Where do you direct your anger?

I'm not sure how to ask this, but I've been thinking about it for a while and I'm curious as to how other people are thinking. While I realize that my actions certainly contributed to my current predicament, the truth is that I had a completely manageable debt load until I lost my job this past year which was directly related to the mismanagement of the bank where I worked. I didn't play in the stock market, I didn't buy a home I couldn't afford, none of it (not that I'm saying people who did that are more responsible.)

So, all along this whole process -- the obnoxious collections agents berating me, the twentysomething "debt counsellor" talking down to me ("now do you know how to make a budget?"), the embarrassment of it all -- has really made me try to think about responsibility. Yes, I accept some blame (I'm not trying to get away from that) but increasingly I see all the people who helped put me here (incompetent political leadership, greedy traders making 100x my salary at the bank, a credit card industry that is completely immune to sensible regulation.)

All of this was precipitated by a particularly nasty collections call (Northland Group) where the "collections agent" basically started yelling at me about what a worthless piece of crap I am. I started laughing which made him even more mad and I told him that I didn't feel responsible for this situation at all before telling him bluntly what he could do to himself (Oh, did I mention that this call happened on Christmas?)

I guess I'm saying that there are times that I'm just really, really angry at this country and its "leadership" and some others (the upper management of the bank where I worked, for example) and while I know that everyone here is focused on the future (which is great) aren't some of you a little p.o.-ed at the present?

Anger serves no good purpose.

The Bible reminds us that if a man be angry with his brother than he has no promise.

My advice is to pray and ask help in forgiving all those that put you in this predicament. Be as Job of old and seek not to wallow in the past or recriminations but work towards a better future for yourself, anger will only be as a stone tied around your neck. Let go of it.

I'm not sure how to ask this, but I've been thinking about it for a while and I'm curious as to how other people are thinking. While I realize that my actions certainly contributed to my current predicament, the truth is that I had a completely manageable debt load until I lost my job this past year which was directly related to the mismanagement of the bank where I worked. I didn't play in the stock market, I didn't buy a home I couldn't afford, none of it (not that I'm saying people who did that are more responsible.)

I know the feeling. Everything in my life was pretty good too, till managment decided that 5% profit wasn't enough for their multi-billion company. So they went back overseas. The domino effect then started. I lose my job, can't pay bills. Car salesman can't sell, so he can't buy. Dealer can't employ, because he can't sell, bank won't extend credit, becasue dealer can't sell. Thus (Just like houses) it all starts with just a few, then it gets worse and worse.


So, all along this whole process -- the obnoxious collections agents berating me, the twentysomething "debt counsellor" talking down to me ("now do you know how to make a budget?"), the embarrassment of it all -- has really made me try to think about responsibility. Yes, I accept some blame (I'm not trying to get away from that) but increasingly I see all the people who helped put me here (incompetent political leadership, greedy traders making 100x my salary at the bank, a credit card industry that is completely immune to sensible regulation.)

Gordon Geko "Greed, for a lack of a better term, is good" Yeah right, damn the people, who won't survive my mad dash to MAJOR properity, full speed ahead!


All of this was precipitated by a particularly nasty collections call (Northland Group) where the "collections agent" basically started yelling at me about what a worthless piece of crap I am. I started laughing which made him even more mad and I told him that I didn't feel responsible for this situation at all before telling him bluntly what he could do to himself (Oh, did I mention that this call happened on Christmas?)

Heh! I know Northland quite well (When they could get ahold of me) "We need to resolve this" They'd say" "Sure thing" I'd reply. "Got a spare $12,000? I'm kind of short right now" They'd play on sympathy, (I'd tell them I had to kill my dogs to survive) they'd play on my responsibility of being a man and paying my bills (I'd ask them to call past employer about being a responsible company and re-employing me at previous paycheck and returning to the USA) They'd threaten me ("Catch me if you can" and if you do, I'll buy you dinner, because you'd be a collection company that would have some major pull to do that)


I guess I'm saying that there are times that I'm just really, really angry at this country and its "leadership" and some others (the upper management of the bank where I worked, for example) and while I know that everyone here is focused on the future (which is great) aren't some of you a little p.o.-ed at the present?

Yes I am. Had they asked the public, they know we'd have said no. So they just did it anyway "To preserve the way of life" (Read their paychecks, screw yours little man) I hate it that pinoy may be right in the postings he's done, we may be in for civil unrest the likes we've never seen...

I'm not sure how to ask this, but I've been thinking about it for a while and I'm curious as to how other people are thinking. While I realize that my actions certainly contributed to my current predicament, the truth is that I had a completely manageable debt load until I lost my job this past year which was directly related to the mismanagement of the bank where I worked. I didn't play in the stock market, I didn't buy a home I couldn't afford, none of it (not that I'm saying people who did that are more responsible.)

So, all along this whole process -- the obnoxious collections agents berating me, the twentysomething "debt counsellor" talking down to me ("now do you know how to make a budget?"), the embarrassment of it all -- has really made me try to think about responsibility. Yes, I accept some blame (I'm not trying to get away from that) but increasingly I see all the people who helped put me here (incompetent political leadership, greedy traders making 100x my salary at the bank, a credit card industry that is completely immune to sensible regulation.)

All of this was precipitated by a particularly nasty collections call (Northland Group) where the "collections agent" basically started yelling at me about what a worthless piece of crap I am. I started laughing which made him even more mad and I told him that I didn't feel responsible for this situation at all before telling him bluntly what he could do to himself (Oh, did I mention that this call happened on Christmas?)

I guess I'm saying that there are times that I'm just really, really angry at this country and its "leadership" and some others (the upper management of the bank where I worked, for example) and while I know that everyone here is focused on the future (which is great) aren't some of you a little p.o.-ed at the present?


I look at it that the future is based upon the past and present. If we try to ignore the past, we may have altered the future in which the outcome might not be as good as we want it to be. That is why I believe complaining when you have the opportune time to complain is good.

for those responsible, the french had the guillotine and the colonies had tar and feathers!

Oh crap, save me from the bible thumping...please! If all that worked than I wouldn't need to file BK I could just pray my way out of this... this isn't the place to spread the word of "god" since not everyone here shares those same values.

Now on to the anger, I say let it rip!! It serves a great purpose and thats to keep you sane, your not alone, and I feel the same way, I feel let down not only by things that I did on my own, but by my whole country as it was being robbed. It wasn't my fault the mortgage melt down made it so I was not able to complete my remodel, nor was it my fault I got injured and social security is a 30 month wait to get a judge to hear your case. I had enough to get buy long enough (one year) but no one can plan on a three year wait. So no its ALL my fault and I get damn mad at those that point at finger and say, you should have known better.


I have no problem with anyone sharing their view on how they deal with anger. Be it self help from the bible or any other book, meditation or any other method. I also don't see how it was bible thumping. The person pointed out how they deal with it. BTW.. I am not a "bible thumper" but am versed in several parts of the bible.

"debt forgiveness" every 7 years(Deuteronomy 15:1-9). I presume that's where the U.S courts came up with only allowing you to file once every 7 years.

Anger serves no good purpose.

The Bible reminds us that if a man be angry with his brother than he has no promise.

My advice is to pray and ask help in forgiving all those that put you in this predicament. Be as Job of old and seek not to wallow in the past or recriminations but work towards a better future for yourself, anger will only be as a stone tied around your neck. Let go of it.

JRScott thanks I really needed that reminder today :blush2:

Anger serves no good purpose.

The Bible reminds us that if a man be angry with his brother than he has no promise.

My advice is to pray and ask help in forgiving all those that put you in this predicament. Be as Job of old and seek not to wallow in the past or recriminations but work towards a better future for yourself, anger will only be as a stone tied around your neck. Let go of it.

JR - please feel free to quote scripture all you want. Many of us DO believe and appreciate reminders of the great wisdom of the Bible.

While I am angry at myself for getting into this, I won't feel bad using a legal method, as has been pointed out to me, to get out of it.

I didn't intentionally set out to go broke. I guess I was in the habit of always using equity in my house to pay off cc debt. No that the equity isn't there, I don't have any other course of action after I wasted a year in debt settlement.

To see the banks of all people get almost a TRILLION dollars while still paying their CEO's billions, I don't care anymore.

The only thing that bothers me is the process.

Once in a while... I hear a news report, read an article, or read a post to a message board that just makes me go... WOW!

This is one of those moments...

Go ahead and be angry if you want to! Will it do anything to solve the problem? Probably not, but hey, maybe you will feel better! Anger is a normal emotion, and useful for moving on. They key is, when you can turn that anger to what you can do to improve yourself, THEN, you can move on.

GW Bush is not the fault of my problems (although in my state the Dems have been in power for over 40 years... not their fault either...), nor is Obama going to be the reason that I am coming back stronger than ever. I did not have to sign any loan agreements, or credit card agreements... and I could have closed the accounts when the agreement changes came making the interest rates higher. Yes, some of mine is due to illness, so who can I blame that on?

If I had made better decisions, I would not have been here. If my spending was in line with my income (not just being able to afford the payments, but having reasonable payments in line with my income, allowing me to save properly, have an emergency fund, and pay cash for purchases), then the fall might not have been so hard.

So go ahead, be angry, and blame everyone else. That will help you with the grieving process, and hopefully will help you move on. Anger can be helpful in the beginning stages.

If you stay in that anger with others, you will just foster a victim mentality, in that it will always be somebody else's fault.

If and when you can move on from that, many on this forum, including myself, will be able, and more than happy to help you.

If you need more clarification, feel free to check out this post (http://www.bkforum.com/showthread.php?t=31955).

It's called the First Amendment.

Oh just cool your jets. Go ahead and believe in your spaghetti monster and review your porn. Nobody is asking you to do any different.

Oh just cool your jets. Go ahead and believe in your spaghetti monster and review your porn. Nobody is asking you to do any different.OUCH
Sounds like someone is anger challenged

JR - please feel free to quote scripture all you want. Many of us DO believe and appreciate reminders of the great wisdom of the Bible.

Such teachings are not limited to the Bible. Every major religion in the world teaches of the harmful effects of anger.

It is especially pronounced in all Abrahamic faiths (that is Islam, Judaism, Christianity, Mormons, B'ahai, etc. ).

It is also pronounced in many Indian and Far Eastern religions.

There are of course differences but almost all stress that anger on the individual level is harmful to the individual. Some do allow organizational anger or anger against those that attack a particular religion rather than an individual. However that would be tempered by their other rules if they'd just read and obey them.

The greatest problem is that to many do not follow their religions, and to many who are anti religious to easily dismiss the common threads that run throughout the world's religions.

No person whether religious or not maintains their code of beliefs 100% of the time. The discipline necessary to do that eludes us all.

Such teachings are not limited to the Bible. Every major religion in the world teaches of the harmful effects of anger.

It is especially pronounced in all Abrahamic faiths (that is Islam, Judaism, Christianity, Mormons, B'ahai, etc. ).

It is also pronounced in many Indian and Far Eastern religions.

There are of course differences but almost all stress that anger on the individual level is harmful to the individual. Some do allow organizational anger or anger against those that attack a particular religion rather than an individual. However that would be tempered by their other rules if they'd just read and obey them.

The greatest problem is that to many do not follow their religions, and to many who are anti religious to easily dismiss the common threads that run throughout the world's religions.

No person whether religious or not maintains their code of beliefs 100% of the time. The discipline necessary to do that eludes us all.


JR.. You are definitely on spot. This exactly what I try to point out to my kids.

If it did I could post all the porn links of the sites that I like to view or for that matter quote passages from my "religious beliefs".

You see I believe in the the Flying Spaghetti Monster so I find these other references to scriptures to be offensive to me.


The porn reference came from your post.

For quite some time I took my anger-stress out on myself, physically.

Body aches, GI tract problems, then landed in the hospital thinking I was having a heart attack.
They prescribed some anti-depressants and sleeping pills.

Then I hit the gym.

Gotta let it out, someway. Everyone has to find how it will work for them.
good luck.

JRScott, you have every right to answer the question and express your views, religious or not. The OP asked for advice didn't she? I appreciate what you said. Not sure why there is so much hate and anger towards the Bible or Christians or God. Humanism is a religion too. We all have faith in something.

How to constructively deal with anger--that is the way I would frame this matter. Anger can be toxic, but anger is also fully human. The United States would not have come into existence except for the fact that some people a few hundred years ago got really really angry and decided to go to war for their independence.

But this is the key point: anger without constructive action (I know some people don't consider war constructive, but let's push that aside now), is really the toxic thing. Anger without constructive action becomes self-defeating, depressing, blood-pressure-raising and ultimately demoralizing and weakening.

When I have the broad anger you're feeling, I try to think of what small thing I can do to improve the matter. It may be contributing money to a media source that you think raises your issues. It may be contributing even a small amount to a political leader who you think raises the right issues. It may be contributing money to a non-profit group. It may simply be writing a note of praise to someone in the community who you think is doing good and honest work, someone who has integrity. (One way of channeling anger at people X for acting irresponsibly is to find people who are doing the opposite of people X and praise them for their honesty and integrity.)

I find that taking action of some sort really helps dissipate the anger. Part of what's fueling the anger is a sense of powerlessness. You want to get out of that sense of powerlessness as soon as you can, because that sense is not helpful, is not good for our health, does not help us be constructive.

I think we all as individuals and as a society need to stop worshipping people who are apparent successes in businesses without considering their larger ethics, their sense of responsibility to the larger community, etc. I understand businesses have to follow the profit motive, but it's just asking for trouble to assume there's something inherently noble about operating in business, something that places you beyond public scrutiny.

One way I will channel my anger is to make sure that when I read about some rich person's life, I don't fall into silly swoon and envy. Instead, I want to teach young people, "sure, that's a nice house. But we don't know if that person made his money honestly. We don't know if this person is making good decisions or not." So let me hold off on the adoration.

Wealth (or apparent wealth) is not necessarily a sign of greatness. Having great wealth (on in this economy "apparent" wealth) is certainly no sign of virtue. I want to use my anger to remind myself of this fact. I can use my anger to support causes or people or institutions that have a better set of values other than the worship of wealth or apparent wealth.

JRScott, you have every right to answer the question and express your views, religious or not. The OP asked for advice didn't she? I appreciate what you said. Not sure why there is so much hate and anger towards the Bible or Christians or God. Humanism is a religion too. We all have faith in something.

Ditto ditto ditto!!!!!!!!!
I was raised a Christian, don't know if that qualifies me as a "bible thumper", but I digress......

The one thing I did get out of it all is TOLERANCE.
Not a bad quality for anyone, no matter what you believe, or don't believe.

Perhaps some should try it on...............

Can I use your story in a book I am writing about the bankruptcy experience. We "veterans' would be doing a service tohelp the multitude of bankruptees coming behind us. Thanks.....

This is what the op asked "aren't some of you a little p.o.-ed at the present?"

THE OP DID NOT ASK FOR ADVICE and I have no idea how anyone knows the gender of the op either.

This is not a type of question that asked how do you deal with it, it wasn't even asked. But the first answer given was a half semi quote from who knows what bible. Matter of fact a google of the quote does not return to anything the closest being Matthew 5:22 that says "But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment."

So here we have someone claiming to make quotes without citing the passage, and giving "advice" on how they deal with anger. OK great, that was NOT what was asked but that was the answer given. But to some the spewing of partial scripture and the advice to "pray and ask help in forgiving all those that put you in this predicament" can be and is offensive to some people. Because to others on the other end of the extreme can be an response that says, I would rather cast a spell and hope the people that caused me this grief burn in hell for eternity or some version of something like that.

It really is that simple. This is not a religious forum and for those that want to engage in religious scripture posting and prayer advice then why not ask for an area or special place to do so. Because it is bible thumping as defined by the Wiki: "Bible thumper is a pejorative term used to describe Christians in general, especially someone perceived as aggressively pushing their Christian beliefs upon those who do not share them. Its target domain is broad and can often extend to anyone engaged in a public show of religion, fundamentalist or not." Now we don't know if the OP shares those beliefs but we can assume there are many on this forum that do not.

So my point was and still is, the OP did not ask for advice and was told to pray and given semi-quasi quote of possibly some unknown scripture. Sorry, "bible thumping" applies.

And to those that feel there is "Not sure why there is so much hate and anger toward the Bible or Christians or God." There is not hate, again its a matter of you perception of the fact that others don't agree with your beliefs and thus you feel you (or your god) are being "hated" and that is not the case. This again is why these types of posts serve no good purpose as to the OP's original question.

I really do enjoy reading the thought process behind insecurities of other peoples beliefs & offenses taken when religion is mentioned anywhere... especially when someone draws an inference(Where do you direct your anger?) from the OP post about Anger. I suppose this is difficult to find in a forum of believers ( religious forum)

Bigboy, in this forum, there is often a post that states his or her position, and others chime in with how THEY deal with it. For some folks, it's meditation, yoga, walks with the kids, a good workout, whatever. For some folks, it's finding some solace in religious writing. Whatever works.

As an atheist, I am not offended to hear that religious writing/religious observation calms and soothes other people. Why does it get your goat? This is an open forum and folks should be (in my opinion) free to offer up whatever works for them. If you don't think it would work for you, then of course you are free to ignore that advice. But I think it is inappropriate for you to ask others not to write what they find helpful.

I'm also an atheist, or, if pressed, I may believe in the flying spaghetti monster, as I've seen as much of him as any other dogmatic persona or invisible person in the sky.

Although religious references turn my belly and make me think twice about the poster's thought processes, as long as they're not directed at me, I leave them be, as .. well.. THIS results if you don't.

My eight year old daughter is also a believer in the flying spaghetti monster. I showed her the blog. She was cracking up.

I suppose it's all in the delivery, bigboy. You are absolutely correct that you have the right to express your opinion and I believe you misread my suggestion that it was inappropriate for you to do so.

I suggested it was inappropriate for you to jump on a poster for offering "unsolicited advice." This is because "unsolicited advice" is pretty much par for the bk forum course. I did not mean that your opinion on religious matters was inappropriate or that you are not welcome to express it.

I sensed a great deal of anger and self-righteousness in your post, as well, although this being the internet, perhaps I misread that. That level of hostility, in my opinion, is also inappropriate, given the gentle tone in which the advice was given. Again, you are of course welcome to express yourself in any manner you choose, but your response just seemed off-the-charts excessive compared to the post that sparked it.

Finally, the OP didn't directly ask for opinions as to whether anger was appropriate, but did wonder out loud where others directed their anger. I read that as an invitation for others to respond as to whether they were angry and, if so, how they coped.

Just for the record again, I think anger is a completely appropriate emotion to have in some situations. The idea that anger is always inappropriate is just wrong and a misunderstanding of human nature and the constructive role anger plays in drawing boundaries, setting limits and stopping injustice.

Bitterness is different than anger in that bitterness is just simply stewing in anger and in hatred at times. Anger does not have to imply hatred. When I say anger can be constructive, I mean anger without hatred, anger without undue stewing.

The Founding Fathers of this nation were full of anger. How else or why else would you take up arms against the super power of the day? You don't go to war unless you are extremely angry.

If you witness a blatant injustice, it is fine and natural and appropriate to feel some anger. If you see someone exploiting another, it is completely appropriate to get experience anger. If you see your kid being picked on or mistreated by a teacher, it is appropriate to get angry. Now, anger is just that. The next step is to do something and to do something constructive. Just holding on to the anger without doing anything is what is unhelpful.

Now, there are occasions where anger is wholly destructive. There are moments when someone yells at you while driving. Or when someone cuts you off on the road. You can allow yourself to get angry or you can move on. This is the time to move on. There are times when someone is rude to you. You might experience a flash of anger, but in reality, no great injustice has been done to you and so it's best to move on.

There are many times I feel anger when I am calling a store or resolving a business problem, but I talk calmly and try not to engage that anger when I am negotiating. The anger disappears. I encountered some rudeness from some hospital workers when I recently took my dad to the emergency room. I was furious, but I pushed it aside in order to better negotiate for what I wanted. I got what I wanted and 5 minutes after leaving the hospital, I had not an ounce of anger in me. Had I allowed myself to act in that anger, my blood pressure would have risen, my heart would have pounded and I would have felt the effects long after I left the hospital. That's the unhealthy use of anger.

But in response to people cheating or stealing or killing on a massive scale, in response to injustice and unfairness, anger can be (it is not always) the absolute appropriate emotion. One of my heroes Martin Luther King Jr. definitely experienced anger, lots of anger, lots of times. It's just he didn't think acting in the heat of that anger was helpful and so he worked to channel it. What this meant was that he didn't act out of anger. He used that anger to make constructive proposals and constructive gestures and to make calls for reconciliation and love.

But King experienced anger over injustice. Absolutely. Just read "letter from a birmingham jail" if you want to see evidence of this. But beware: even in the famous "letter" King handles his anger so deftly that it is easy to miss it as he turns it into a call for action.

I am not an expert on various religions, but my sense is that many religious faiths call for strong stands against injustice ,and anger can be part of that. It's just you can't allow that anger to turn into hostility or bitterness or hatred.

http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh209/pghfan7/grphug.gif

hmmm. i cannot deal with my anger and bitterness I'm afraid. I'm poverty stricken and in BK hell because a rat @#@*$ named Richard stole 300 thousand dollars from my mother, 4 months after my dad died. she never knew it while she was alive, about a year, cos he used my dads pension and ss money to pay her bills. when she died, my brother and I was looking for our inheritance and every penny was gone, over a year before. then my brother, knowing I didnt have a penny to my name, refused to get a lawyer and go after this "person" because my brother said he didnt need the money. sigh. there went my future home, stability, retirement, everything. makes me want to cry to be honest.

hmmm. i cannot deal with my anger and bitterness I'm afraid. I'm poverty stricken and in BK hell because a rat @#@*$ named Richard stole 300 thousand dollars from my mother, 4 months after my dad died. she never knew it while she was alive, about a year, cos he used my dads pension and ss money to pay her bills. when she died, my brother and I was looking for our inheritance and every penny was gone, over a year before. then my brother, knowing I didnt have a penny to my name, refused to get a lawyer and go after this "person" because my brother said he didnt need the money. sigh. there went my future home, stability, retirement, everything. makes me want to cry to be honest.

If your brother refused to get a lawyer to go after this person, why don't YOU get one to at least try to recover some of the stolen money! Who is this "Richard" and did he have his signature on file as to your mother's accounts or a Power of Attorney to give him access to her funds? Something is not right here unless your post is missing information. I certainly wouldn't sit around and let this matter go unless there is information you know about that you are not providing us. Sounds like embezzlement to me.

Just some thoughts as to the original post - "Where do you direct your anger" (topic) and resulting posts. After reading through the postings on here and the arguments about posting one's thoughts on the subject be it religious or fictional (i.e., Spaghetti Monster), the arguments on here brought to mind a situation which I encountered yesterday in our local Walmart parking lot. The place was packed and a middle-age mom was walking with her pre-teen daughter to their car when a big shiney red truck driven by a lone male with a bandana on his head pulled around the turn quickly thinking she was going to pull out of a parking space, nearly hitting them and zooming past me. She yelled at the guy to "slow down - it's a parking lot!" He yelled out the window to her that he could do whatever he wanted in the parking lot just as she could. She yelled back at him "You must be from the State of Maryland with the way you drive!" and of course all this started in back and forth bickering to the point that when he parked he went up to her car window. I just shook my head at how stupid it all became. As she pulled out past me she shook her head and rolled her eyes while looking at me to give me a description of what she thought of the entire thing...I just stated to her to "Let it go."

Anger is in every book published, including the Bible, and in documentary and fictional movies to which we are all exposed. The Great Flood was sent in anger and punishment in the Bible, Luke Skywalker gets angry and blows up fictional alien fighter space crafts, Scarlett gets angry at Rhett and slaps him... Mentioning one of these books or movies could make someone angry in this forum because they don't like the movie/book or its contents, be it fictional, religious or reality. Some folks on here may have been offended that the "Flying Spaghetti Monster" was mentioned. Most people just let it go as the woman in the parking lot should have done and eventually did.

Bible thumping would be posting links to religious sources or forcing ones views on everyone in here. Posting what one thinks or feels or how they handle a situation (i.e., in this instance - anger) is their own view is not forcing information/data down other posters throats. Some people handle things by looking toward religion for help/guidance - others turn to a bottle of booze, drugs, slot machines, family, friends or any other source of comfort/help to them.

Well said Flamingo,
Being a Christian I took some offense to the "Spaghetti Monster" However, I understood the point the person posting was trying to make. I "let it go" I tired to gather the substance of the message and put aside my dislike. Just as the person posting about "Job" tried to do. They used something they believed in to try to make a connection of how to deal with anger after drawing an inference from the subject line of the OP.

I too "Let it go" when a poster wanted to argue with me. Wasn't worth my time or energy.

When I get angry I have learned to "pick my poison". I sit back and think "is this really worth arguing about?" Most of the time you will realize it's not.

Feed your spaghetti monster a few meatballs if that makes you feel good. For me - as a Christian, what makes me feel good, is knowing that I have eternal salvation.

Too each his own. I didn't come to this forum to convert anyone nor have I tried.

I'm not sure how to ask this, but I've been thinking about it for a while and I'm curious as to how other people are thinking. While I realize that my actions certainly contributed to my current predicament, the truth is that I had a completely manageable debt load until I lost my job this past year which was directly related to the mismanagement of the bank where I worked. I didn't play in the stock market, I didn't buy a home I couldn't afford, none of it (not that I'm saying people who did that are more responsible.)

So, all along this whole process -- the obnoxious collections agents berating me, the twentysomething "debt counsellor" talking down to me ("now do you know how to make a budget?"), the embarrassment of it all -- has really made me try to think about responsibility. Yes, I accept some blame (I'm not trying to get away from that) but increasingly I see all the people who helped put me here (incompetent political leadership, greedy traders making 100x my salary at the bank, a credit card industry that is completely immune to sensible regulation.)

All of this was precipitated by a particularly nasty collections call (Northland Group) where the "collections agent" basically started yelling at me about what a worthless piece of crap I am. I started laughing which made him even more mad and I told him that I didn't feel responsible for this situation at all before telling him bluntly what he could do to himself (Oh, did I mention that this call happened on Christmas?)

I guess I'm saying that there are times that I'm just really, really angry at this country and its "leadership" and some others (the upper management of the bank where I worked, for example) and while I know that everyone here is focused on the future (which is great) aren't some of you a little p.o.-ed at the present?



How do I control my anger?

I look at it that anger can be good, it can get me moving to do what I need to do. I had a person pull a revolver on me once and the person said they were going to shoot me. My anger got me out of that situation.

But anger, as the original poster had when receiving a call from a collection agency who made reference that she was a piece of crap, is something most of us have experienced. Hopefully that anger will prepare the original poster so as not to be a victim again. Hopefully the conversation will be recorded and possibly legal action will be taken against the collection agency.

If your brother refused to get a lawyer to go after this person, why don't YOU get one to at least try to recover some of the stolen money! Who is this "Richard" and did he have his signature on file as to your mother's accounts or a Power of Attorney to give him access to her funds? Something is not right here unless your post is missing information. I certainly wouldn't sit around and let this matter go unless there is information you know about that you are not providing us. Sounds like embezzlement to me.

I think by now the statue of limitations is over, i dont have the money to pay for a lawyer, and my brother does. richard was recommended to my mom to be her trustee by his neighbor who was helping my mom. i think they were in this together, and she looked for sick scared widows to exploit. I feel she probably got a finders fee. also many sentimental items were missing from my parents home. richard put in the trust that he could invest the money in what ever he wanted too, but didnt even have the decency to tell anyone what he had done, didnt difersify the money, and spent it right after my dad died. i feel he is like a vulture, going after people like my mom with a hidden agenda in mind. supposedly he invested all our money in some stupid golf course in new york that went bankrupt. led us on for years telling us that this would be resolved soon and finally disappeared.
i think i'm more mad at my brother who has so much money that he just doesnt care and he knows I havent a freaken penny to my name.
i just dont want richard to do this to other widows, and to get away with it scott free. i hope he rots in hell. thank god my mom never knew what happened.

I think by now the statue of limitations is over, i dont have the money to pay for a lawyer, and my brother does. richard was recommended to my mom to be her trustee by his neighbor who was helping my mom. i think they were in this together, and she looked for sick scared widows to exploit. I feel she probably got a finders fee. also many sentimental items were missing from my parents home. richard put in the trust that he could invest the money in what ever he wanted too, but didnt even have the decency to tell anyone what he had done, didnt difersify the money, and spent it right after my dad died. i feel he is like a vulture, going after people like my mom with a hidden agenda in mind. supposedly he invested all our money in some stupid golf course in new york that went bankrupt. led us on for years telling us that this would be resolved soon and finally disappeared.
i think i'm more mad at my brother who has so much money that he just doesnt care and he knows I havent a freaken penny to my name.
i just dont want richard to do this to other widows, and to get away with it scott free. i hope he rots in hell. thank god my mom never knew what happened.

There are many con artists out there that do this for a living. I would report this person to the police and have his past record checked if possible and possibly file charges. The SOL in some instances starts when you became aware of the situation. I would get some legal advice since your mother and family were victims of embezzlement unless your brother was somehow involved and is trying to keep you out of it... That is just the way I see things from your postings...whatever you do is up to you.

Phillyman makes some great points about anger. To Aaaaaah, what you are feeling is a perfectly natural stage of grief. Your choice will be to park there in that anger or make some positive steps to move on, accept your new identity, and learn from it.

For now, where do you direct that anger? How about a journal? You can scream, rant, cry, mourn, question, and lament all you want without spewing it upon others. Yes, there were others involved in your downfall. Yes, our government is making scary financial decisions that make no sense for our future. Yes, the creditors can be mean, rude, and ignorant. Yes, it is ALL maddening. But what can your anger DO, really? Unfortunately, venting to those others will change neither their operation nor your situation.

So be mad. Then, write a nice note to someone who is doing something good. Things won't magically improve overnight, but as you make positive steps to move on with your life, you will emerge from this stage.

I feel your pain. I have been there. Check out my blog that deals with just this topic as it relates to bankruptcy: http://hopeforthebankrupt.blogspot.com

My best to you Aaaaaah as you move through this.

http://cop.senate.gov ---- tell them your anger, I did,

OH BOY! This whole thread got ME angry!!! For those that claim the bible says to "NOT GET ANGRY" -- pooh pooh!!! Jesus got angry!!!! Remember the incident in the temple????? For heavens sake, it's a normal reaction to the bad being done to us. The BAD thing about it is if you let anger take over your life!!!! So - GET ANGRY, then forgive them, and MOVE ON! If you don't let it out, you'll have all sorts of health problems....I KNOW!!!!