Second time around

[nervousnellie]

Made it thru Ch.13 after paying thru the nose for 42 months.Even managed to pay off mortgage at the same time.All was great for awhile and then Wham! Had a medical emergency a few months ago with no insurance.( I just became eligible for Medicare this month)Now I have approx.$60,000 in medical bills.The minimum payments required are so high there is no way we can pay those amounts.Have set up reasonable payment plans with the Dr.'s but the hospital has already turned over some accounts to collection agency. They want a minimum of $1000 per month on 17,500 and now have just received another bill for 37,500.I can only imagine what the minimum payment would be for that one.All this and I still have the kidney stones and the pain .
I worked thru the tax season,but as we all know that has come and gone.Now we live on pension and SS income.I have applied for unemployment,but that will only be $151.00 per week if approved.
I know the only way out of this is to file Ch. 13 again. I have learned so much from this forum it will help us this time around.The lawyer we had before was certainly no help.Our payments could have been much lower had we known some of the expenses we were entitled to claim.
Now I just need to find a Lawyer who will work not only for themselves but for us also. We are in the Southern District of Ohio.Anyone have any experience with Lawyers in the Dayton area?

[woeisme]

no experience with Dayton lawyers, but my trustee and the southern ohio district judge seem very fair. (I went with a BK mill, worked out ok for me, but not what I'd recommend). In the Columbus area.

If you just have SS and pension, could you try for a CH 7 instead? Or do you have too many assets to protect?

Wishing you the best of luck from another ohio-er.

[nervousnellie]

Assets

Our home is paid for and we have a leased vehicle.Nothing else of much value.
Probably wouldn't qualify for Ch.7 since the house is paid for would we?

[liz417]

How much is your home worth? Do you have enough in exemptions to cover it?!?

[woeisme]

I think homestead exemption is only $5000 here in Ohio. It totally blows.

[StartingOver08]

I think homestead exemption is only $5000 here in Ohio. It totally blows.

No. That is old information.

The new exemption is: OH Exemptions
Real or personal property used as residence to $20,200

[lrprn]

Made it thru Ch.13 after paying thru the nose for 42 months. ... Wham! Had a medical emergency a few months ago with no insurance.( I just became eligible for Medicare this month)Now I have approx.$60,000 in medical bills.

One very important question no one has asked yet...when did you file Ch 13 (month and year) and when did you receive your discharge (month and year)?

The biggest problem you are going to have filing a 13 again is that I very much doubt given what you've shared about your income that you are going to show enough disposable income on the mandatory Means Test and Schedules to support a Ch 13 payment plan and still give all your creditors the same amount they would have received if you filed Ch 7. (Unfortunately the bk law changed significantly in October 2005 if you filed your 13 before that.)

Also if less than two years have passed since your 13 was discharged, you can't file another 13 and have your new medical debt discharged. (Another part of the bk law that changed in Oct 2005.)

Having your house completely paid for is going to enormously complicate filing either type of consumer bankruptcy - 7 or 13. No state - including Ohio - has a sufficient homestead bankruptcy exemption to protect a fully paid-off home (unless your home is worth less than $20K in Ohio - very unlikely). That makes filing Ch 7 (which I strongly suspect you qualify for) impossible if you want to keep your home. It's also going to make it impossible to file Ch 13 as well - you have too much equity in your house to protect it fully if you file.

You are in a very tough spot, I'm sorry to say. Your best bet at this point is to set up several free initial consultations with experienced bankruptcy lawyers in your area. Share your story and see what they think might be able to be done in your situation. You may have to consider selling your home to pay off your medical bills - that may end up being the only viable option you have. Discuss this during your free consultations to see if the lawyers see other options - I hope they do.

I cannot imagine how frustrating it must be to survive one 13 only to have a major medical problem and hospitalization raise its ugly head. I pray that everything works out in your favor. Keep us posted about what you find out, ok?

[nervousnellie]

We filed 11/3/2003 and was discharged 6/23/2007.Case was closed 8/07.
Monthly income from pensions is $1585 and SS is $1765 after deductions for Medicare premiums. That may sound like a lot but after monthly expenses there isn't much left.
Not sure what market price of home is right now.Somewhere in the eighties I would suppose.Homes for sale and Foreclosed homes are plentiful around here right now.
We were actually planning to sell and get into something a little more maintenance free when the bottom fell out of the market.At 74 and 65 our Golden years have gone to pot.
Not feeling sorry for myself,but mad as hell.Had I been insured the hospital and doctors would have no choice in accepting a much smaller payment,but really stick it to those of us who are uninsured.
If we don't qualify for BK. 7or 13 then what is the worst that can happen? Can they take your pension and SS income?I know they can get a Lien on the house,but can they force you to sell?
I will be getting advice from several Attorney's but just wanted some peace of mind for now .Thanks for any info you have knowledge of.

[DUMBAGAIN]

I have a question. You get SS and pension. I might be wrong here, but I thought no one could really take those. I mean no garnish. So I'm wondering what happens if you do nothing? My mother was in a similar situation, when she went to see a lawyer she was told, "you have nothing they can take, don't worry about it". Now she did not own a home at the time. I mean I guess maybe they could put a lien on your house, but if you planning on moving anytime soon, does that really matter? Just wondering.

[lrprn]

If we don't qualify for BK. 7or 13 then what is the worst that can happen?

Your creditors will take you to court and get liens against your house. When you do sell it, the creditors will get their money you owe them then.

Can they take your pension and SS income?

Even if the creditors get a judgment against you, all SS, VA, RRB, and most private pensions and all government disability, supplemental income, etc. are exempt from garnishment for creditor debt in all states. However, it is VERY important that you keep your pension and SS money separate from all other money you may be earning in separate accounts.

If you co-mingle the exempt funds with non-exempt funds, all too often when your bank gets a garnishment decree from the court, they send the money (exempt and non-exempt) to the creditor. It's up to you to hire a lawyer and get the exempt pension and SS funds back. Unfair? You better believe it. But it does happen.

I know they can get a Lien on the house,but can they force you to sell?

No, the creditors with liens cannot force you to sell. But they do tie up the title to the house which complicates trying to sell it.

[nervousnellie]

Thanks for the info.Will be talking to some Attorneys,but will probably let whoever wants to get their judgement.
Maybe I'll live to be a hundred and they'll have a long wait
Seriously if they were more reasonable with their charges and payment arrangements I would be agreeable for paying for their services.