Corporate credit cards

[LostOne0069]

OK, so here's another twist for you BK Gods (and Godesses, of course!).

I have a Corporate credit card from my employer that I use for company related expenses that I get reimbursed for. The monthy expenses on this can be as low as $75 or as high as several thousand dollars.

The card does say "company xyz" on it... but it is MY card... I get the bill, I get the call if it's late.

It's an American Express card and thus it gets paid in full at the end of each month.

My question is this:

#1, do I have to report this as part of my "debt" since it's a corporate card and not supposed to be used for personal carges not to mention it always has a "0" balance since it's paid at the end of each month.

#2. Whether I report it or not, is a trustee going to try and get back money that I paid to this card since I've recently paid this card $3000+ whereas I haven't paid other cards at all?


I just worry about them doing something dumb like this... I can be pretty sure that I'd lose my job if all of a sudden they were on the hook for several thousand dollars of stuff that they already paid once.

[Minnymouth]

This you need to discuss with an attorney.... especially since you pay the bill!!! That would be considered "preferencial payments" to a credior.

Even though its a company card, you are paying the bill, not the company, unless the company reimburses you to pay the bill!!! You would have to prove where it IS a company card and the check stubs to prove where they reimburse you to PAY IT.....

Really this card needs to be paid directly by your company... why are they reimbursing you and then you paying it???

Only an attorney can answer a lot of these questions for you...

Keep us posted

[SinkingFast]

As Minny suggests, definitely run it by your attny.

But I don't think it will really enter into the picture. Hubby has had cards like that over the years. Corporate cards. He used them for company associated travel and such. Filed an expense report, got reimbursed, and paid the bill in full.

Hubby's cards have been like yours. Company name and then his name. We got the bills direct to us. We paid direct to them. If the expense reimbursement was late, and we were late in payment, we were the ones who got the call. Not the company. Just explain the expense reimbursement hadn't come thru yet, they'd say OK, just pay us when it does, and that was it.

Hubby never applied for a line of credit with those companies. AmEx was one. There have been others. The cards were always given to him by the companies he's worked for. And, none of those cards shows on Hubby's credit report or in his credit history. It's like they never existed with his name on them. Because, the accounts are Corporate accounts. XYZ company actually had the account and Hubby was simply an authorized user.

In fact, the company actually "owns" each card they distribute to employees for use. When Hubby was "terminated" he had to hand in his security clearance card (essentially a key card as it would unlock doors for entry into buildings he was cleared to go into), his employee ID badge, and his Corporate Card. The checklist specifically stated those things were property of the Company. It's like your driver's license doesn't really belong to you, it belongs to the State. You just get the priviledge to carry the license and drive a car type of thing.

[Minnymouth]

Sinkingfast,
Yep, your right about the Corporate Card belonging to the company (my mind must be out to lunch right now).....
So none of it shows on your credit report - thus not your bill but Corporate bill.....
Trustee shouldn't have a problem with this.....

[SinkingFast]

Really this card needs to be paid directly by your company... why are they reimbursing you and then you paying it???

It's all about a paper trail, Minny. To prevent abuse of Company funds.

Hubby could use his Corporate card any time, any place. That's why the bills came to us. You've seen those commercials where the host pays for a huge, expensive dinner, for a whole bunch of guests. You can run up a $10K tab easily. Sometimes there's no limit on a Corporate Card.

If it's really a business expense, you file an expense report, along with receipts, and get reimbursed to pay the bill. The company has the actual airline tickets, rental car bills, gas receipts, hotel bills, meals receipts, taxi cab receipts, etc., to justify to their accountants where the money went.

One Company used to give Hubby a minor cash advance so we wouldn't have to up with all the funds for a trip up front. He'd get enough to pay for the airline ticket, basically. One trip, I remember, Hubby's hotel bill alone was over $1200 for one week 15+ years ago. It was a conference at a Westin Hotel. Then the Company went to the Corporate card. The Corporate card allows employees to travel as necessary without creating an undue financial burden on the employee's private funds. And, you have to have receipts for everything for the expense report. Kinda does the Company's accounting for them, in a sense.

[poorme]

Amex offers corporations/businesses two types of corp card platforms. Under one of them, the company simply 'tells' amex to issue you a card and THEY are liable to amex for unpaid charges/lates, etc. YOUR credit is not pulled/evaluated. Usually under this platform, you file your expense report to the company and they pay amex directly.

Under the other program, Amex does approve you based on your credit and the card is issued to you...YOU pay amex back after being reimbursed by your company. In tough cases, though, the employer can have a card issued to you with an officer's approval to Amex, but you're still liable.

Still, it is qualified business expense you're reporting that you must pay back...the trustee sees this all the time and shouldn't have any problem with it.

[SinkingFast]

Under the other program, Amex does approve you based on your credit and the card is issued to you...YOU pay amex back after being reimbursed by your company. In tough cases, though, the employer can have a card issued to you with an officer's approval to Amex, but you're still liable.

Still, it is qualified business expense you're reporting that you must pay back...the trustee sees this all the time and shouldn't have any problem with it.

Just curious, but based on what you've said, Hubby had the kind of card that was based on our credit. Bills came to us, and we paid them directly. Not bills went to the Company that paid direct to CC. If that's the case, why don't any of those cards show in Hubby's credit history??

Hubby's had AmEx, and US Bank. Those are 2 I know for sure. There have been a couple others. Company changed names several times so there were several different carriers. Or, a Corp Card company would come along with a better offer and the company would change carriers.

So if we were liable, in the structuring the way you say, then why didn't they report to the Credit Bureaus as such?? Just curious.

[poorme]

AFAIK, the corporate card is still secured by the employer and is issued under their name. That's why it isn't on your personal cr reports. The trade-off for the employer to choose one platform over another is the amount of support they get/pay for from Amex. In your case, the company's money is only tagged by Amex when the cardholder fails to pay, whereas in the other one the company's money is used to pay ALL the expenses. The expense report you turn in only serves to balance the company's outlay against your travel, etc. since you don't really get reimbursed. The way I see it, the first example (where your credit is NOT a factor) is usually used by very large corparations with a lot of cardholders and other top-notch professional firms.

[SinkingFast]

Several of Hubby's previous employers qualify as very large, mulitnational corporations. Hubby's cards always had the Corporate name or logo listed above his name.

We've chatted about this a bit and think it has somewhat to do with departmental budgeting. Hubby's Department would structure so much into their budget for various employee related expenses. Travel expenses to conferences, meetings with clients, and seminars, and such. If all the CC charges went into one mosh pit, the accounting dept might have a hard time allocating expenses to the correct departments.

If each employee files for expense remimbursements within their department, each department has a better handle on where they stand regarding various departmental allocations.

[Sammy]

I have a similar issue in that I have an AMEX card that I use only for business use (business travel, home office expenses, etc.) all of which are reimbursed. I file an expense report every month and the reimbursement goes to AMEX. While this can have the appearance of preferential payment, I can show the paper trail of expense reports, reimbursements, and payments to AMEX.

In my case, the AMEX card is not a corporate card and it is in my name on my credit. I asked my employer if they would provide me a corporate card and they will not. The card was issued concurrent with my starting this job and is the only reason I applied for it.

If I list AMEX on my list of debtors (with $0 balance) they will likely cancel my card and I will lose my job because I will be unable to travel on business.

If I do not list AMEX on my list of debtors, I risk getting screwed in court.

Rock>ME<Hardplace

[SinkingFast]

Actually, and I do hope this is correct,.......

You only have to list the Creditors you owe money to that you wish to discharge the debt.

Some people have had LOC's where they didn't owe anything on them at the time of their BK. So they did not list those Creditors on their Matrix. They get thru BK, and the CC's survive to be used to rebuild credit on the other side.

We have on Bank CC and 2 Store cards that we don't owe anything on. We're not gonna list them on our Creditor's Matrix. We're hoping those LOC's survive the BK so we have a jump start on rebuilding.

Your bigger problem may be that AmEx finds out about the BK and cancels your acct with them. That can and has happened to other people. Creditors they did not file against, in a routine pull, possibly an annual review, find out about the BK and close their LOC. Something to keep an eye out for.

Definitely tell your attny about this CC. What it's used for and why you do not want to include it in your Creditor's Matrix. Be prepared to show statements from the CC along with expense reports you've filed with your company in the past, and possibly even check stubs where you've been reimbursed. Always CYA with a paper trail.

[anonymuse]

My old company (fortune 100 business) cc shows up on my credit report. Weird?!

I don't care if it's closed/zero balance/etc. I put every friggin thing on my matrix just so that nothing can every come back at me to bite me in the butt. I figure better safe than sorry.

The only two I'll leave off (which aren't reporting yet) are the debit cards (but have overdraft protection) for the two checking accounts I have setup at different banks which I will only use once I file. (They each have only $10 in them.)