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A Successful Student Loan Discharge, Totality of Circumstances

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  • A Successful Student Loan Discharge, Totality of Circumstances

    http://www.mow.uscourts.gov/opinions...rman/marie.pdf

    I hope the link works to the case. This case is in the 8th circuit.

  • #2
    OH WOW HHM. That ruling delights my heart, made my day. From 216K to 36K. AWESOME.

    My personal opinion is that it is contrary to sound public policy to allow students to run up 216K of debt. In my own past work life at a university, I have seen a 150K loan balance for a master's degree in the arts. There is no way in hell that a person can pay that off in 20 years, let alone ten. It is simply unconscionable to allow students to rack up that much debt in the first place.
    So the poor debtor, seeing naught around him
    Yet feels the narrow limits that impound him
    Grieves at his debt and studies to evade it
    And finds at last he might as well have paid it.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Dst1 View Post
      OH WOW HHM. That ruling delights my heart, made my day. From 216K to 36K. AWESOME.

      My personal opinion is that it is contrary to sound public policy to allow students to run up 216K of debt. In my own past work life at a university, I have seen a 150K loan balance for a master's degree in the arts. There is no way in hell that a person can pay that off in 20 years, let alone ten. It is simply unconscionable to allow students to rack up that much debt in the first place.
      I agree. (Let me step up on the soap box for a moment). Student Loans are like a "mean form of welfare". The student loans are a govt. subsidy to allow those who cannot afford college to attend. But, it is not a free ride in the long term and end up putting many people into indentured servitude. The other problem is was the lack of forsight, the wide availability of student loans, in my view, has lead to the spiraling increase in the cost of education. By flooding the universities with money, that lead to higher salaries, increased spending, expansion etc., hence increasing the cost of education and the need for student loans.
      Last edited by HHM; 01-29-2009, 01:25 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Wish this was me - I have had depression since I was 10 years old and now I am suffering from post partum depression as well - well, who isn't depressed as a result from their student loan debt as well, right?

        Comment


        • #5
          College is becoming increasingly difficult to afford.
          Borrowing money for college is a big responsibility but college remains a smart investment for obtaining a satisfying career that earns a competitive salary.

          I'm a sucker for Loan Modification.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by wees View Post
            College is becoming increasingly difficult to afford.
            Borrowing money for college is a big responsibility but college remains a smart investment for obtaining a satisfying career that earns a competitive salary.

            But that statement is a fallacy. You can't even really assign a probability to it because of the inherent randomness in achieving success. You cannot claim that having an education is either a necessary or sufficient condition for achieving success.

            I do believe education has inherent value. However, I think you need to approach college like any other purchase. If you don't have the money, you don't buy. If people bought cars like they buy education, 90% of the unemployed would be driving Mercedes. Reason being, the investment in an education is so speculative in the outcome, it is analogous to someone agreeing to a $900 per month car payment when they have no job.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by wees View Post
              College is becoming increasingly difficult to afford.
              Borrowing money for college is a big responsibility but college remains a smart investment for obtaining a satisfying career that earns a competitive salary.

              Unless you choose a low paying career like I did - now I wish I had never gone to college!

              Comment


              • #8
                I tried to have my student loans discharged but it didn't happen. I have been on a hardship deferment, and they sent me a letter today saying they want 30 years worth of payments of $890 a month. Just over $300k with interest. I am a special ed teacher who makes less than $36k a year. I'm not sure what to do...I am taking the letter to my attorney tomorrow. Someone I work with said once I have taught for five years(first year), I can have my loans forgiven. I pray that's true, because having this hanging over my head has me so depressed I am not sure if I can make it 5 years.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by CurtInKS View Post
                  I tried to have my student loans discharged but it didn't happen. I have been on a hardship deferment, and they sent me a letter today saying they want 30 years worth of payments of $890 a month. Just over $300k with interest. I am a special ed teacher who makes less than $36k a year. I'm not sure what to do...I am taking the letter to my attorney tomorrow. Someone I work with said once I have taught for five years(first year), I can have my loans forgiven. I pray that's true, because having this hanging over my head has me so depressed I am not sure if I can make it 5 years.
                  300K HOLY SMOKES. There are different loan forgiveness programs. However, I cann't see any of them allowing you to knock off 300K of debt. Only certain types of loans can be forgiven. See a lawyer, but don't be optimistic you can get rid of it all.
                  So the poor debtor, seeing naught around him
                  Yet feels the narrow limits that impound him
                  Grieves at his debt and studies to evade it
                  And finds at last he might as well have paid it.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by HHM View Post
                    Reason being, the investment in an education is so speculative in the outcome, it is analogous to someone agreeing to a $900 per month car payment when they have no job.
                    Sadly, I agree. Both my parents are highly educated, my father has a Phd. I have a masters degree. But I think the only smart one in the family was my brother who became a lawyer, and even he says the law isn't what it once was. In my parents generation, having an advanced degree just was a ticket to success. And I think that in sharing that love of learning with their children, they thought they were giving them a financial treasure. The reality of the world now, however, is completely different. IMHO people should only get an advanced degree anymore because they want to peruse a research-orientated or an academic lifestyle. My best friend has a Phd in Biochem and even that gets him basically a middle class life-style. I know people with BA degrees that make twice what he makes and they are working for the Federal Government.

                    I actually have come to resent my own investment in higher education (from a financial perspective) as it didn't pay off for me. And I have seen it happen to too many of my friends and associates, not just me.

                    Higher education is a guarantee of nothing anymore.
                    So the poor debtor, seeing naught around him
                    Yet feels the narrow limits that impound him
                    Grieves at his debt and studies to evade it
                    And finds at last he might as well have paid it.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Dst1 View Post
                      300K HOLY SMOKES. There are different loan forgiveness programs. However, I cann't see any of them allowing you to knock off 300K of debt. Only certain types of loans can be forgiven. See a lawyer, but don't be optimistic you can get rid of it all.
                      I'm not optimistic at all.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        If you're a special ed teacher in a low income school (and you'd be surprised at how many schools are on the list), you could get up to 17,500 forgiven. I know that's not much in your case though.

                        http://studentaid.ed.gov/PORTALSWebA...paying#teacher

                        Originally posted by CurtInKS View Post
                        I tried to have my student loans discharged but it didn't happen. I have been on a hardship deferment, and they sent me a letter today saying they want 30 years worth of payments of $890 a month. Just over $300k with interest. I am a special ed teacher who makes less than $36k a year. I'm not sure what to do...I am taking the letter to my attorney tomorrow. Someone I work with said once I have taught for five years(first year), I can have my loans forgiven. I pray that's true, because having this hanging over my head has me so depressed I am not sure if I can make it 5 years.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          It would certainly help. I should explain, because of health and employment issues my loans have been on constant hardship forbearance since I finished school. According to the letter I go, 2/3 of that amount are interest and fees and only around $100k is principal.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I think what the person who told you that might be referring to, in addition to the forgiveness program already mentioned, is this:
                            http://www.finaid.org/loans/publicservice.phtml

                            If your loans are federal not private, the above program lets you pay on them (income sensitive payments, so that is good) for 10 years and the remaining balance is forgiven. You just have to consolidate your fed loans with Direct, as you will read. No big deal. Good luck.
                            If your loans are private, then you are in the same boat as me!
                            Teacher Momma

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Thank you everyone for your responses. I have given some consideration of requesting they garnish my wages, because I was told that they can only garnish 10% of your gross, which would be about 1/3 of what they are wanting. Anyone know if there's an online source about what they can garnish? Per state I assume?

                              Comment

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