Problems brought on my stubborn spouse...

[gymbo]

Welcome!

I am VERY familiar with the stubborn spouse issue because initially, IT WAS ME. My husband was paying the bills last fall and I thought everything was fine and one day he said "I think we need to file BK". I was like, umm, no way, no how, not gonna happen, I don't care what we have to do, if we are really in that deep we will work it out.

I took over the bills and for months WE TRIED. We did not eat out (very much), we both got 2nd jobs, I did not shop AT ALL and I sold everything I could find in my house that was not nailed down on ebay (in my spare time, after my 2 jobs)....

...And we broke even for 2 months. And we were miserable. And tired. And fighting all the time. But the breaking point was, I was not seeing my daughter at all and decided - there must be a way out of this.

Neithor of us want to file BK (and we haven't yet) but we know it is coming and we are being smart about all of our purchases. Have not stopped using cc's yet but we only charge necessities (food, medical bills, pet bills or gas) and I try to keep the charges at or below the minimum due. I don't know why. It's my own personal guideline for right now.

But if your wife surprised you with a trip to Vegas (nice gesture, BTW), she cannot possibly have a CLUE about your real financial situation.
Maybe hand her all of the bills and tell her to figure it out.

It sure opened my eyes!
Good Luck and welcome to the forum

[gymbo]

and...

One more thing... I have been on this forum for a while but still cannot figure out what DH and DW stand for. At first I thought it was Divorced Husband or Wife but I don't think that's right.

Will someone please fill me in?

[jktrading]

One more thing... I have been on this forum for a while but still cannot figure out what DH and DW stand for. At first I thought it was Divorced Husband or Wife but I don't think that's right.

Will someone please fill me in?

DH = Dear Husband
DW = Dear Wife

[gymbo]

DH = Dear Husband
DW = Dear Wife

Oooooooooooooooooooooooh!
Thanks

[TEW]

I’m not sure who it is harder for, the spouse that see’s the BK coming and does everything they can to stop it or the spouse that can not see the storm on the horizon and just keeps going? Last week when I got the matrix and sat down with her and she saw the total, she had the deer in the headlights look. She said oh that can’t be right. I said no it isn’t, things are missing.

[jenopher]

oooohhh, same here! Husband does not pay bills and did not want to see them. I had to do the old wait till there is no more credit left, which I had to lie about in order to speed things up. We still had another 10-15K in credit we could have cashed out on. It took having the bank account at 0 on more than one occasion and the cards he had maxed out for him to see the light. No more equity in the house to cash in on and pay it all off either. A few tears from me and a good look at the current debt to income and he got it big time! Old habits are hard to break, but it's easier when you are cash only. We are both slowly but surely getting better with our purchasing decisions.

[hnhlvr]

But the breaking point was, I was not seeing my daughter at all and decided -

Gymbo, I'm so glad you decided to file simply due to the fact that you'll have more time with your daughter. I've read advice stating people SHOULD work two jobs to pay off debt even if it means sticking kids in FT daycare or parents working split shifts, where one parent is home with the kid(s) and then the other is working and then they switch at the end of the day, but the parents never see each other, so there is NO family balance.

Someone told me I should be doing that. I wondered if I work 2 jobs, "when will I see my kids?" At their high school graduation? They're in elementary school and I refuse to miss their young lives JUST to avoid filing!

[Cali]

The reason we filed was because of my nice paying job(6 figures) going overseas. Our incomes were more than enough to live the life we have, but once 1/2 income is gone and the bills are the same, it's hard to keep up. We never maxed any CC's. We had very high limits on them all, the total CL could have bought a house or 2. We always paid our CC's in full each month, but once I was unemployed we couldn't do that. So of course, the high interest came and the payments went crazy and here we are a 1.5yrs later.

I saved a lot of money during my time of employment, that is what I used up until we decided to file. I never used my 401k, or sold things.

I think in the long run this was the best thing we could have done.

And my hubby and I both decided to file, no fights or anything.

[justplaintired]

It's hard being the one who pays the bills while the other is oblivious. It's hard being the one who doesn't want to disappoint the other with reality. That's basically what got us here. My DH just simply closed his eyes to the situation. He really didn't want to know and I didn't want to fight so we just kept getting deeper and deeper into debt. The final straw was an increase in interest on one card. We couldn't do it anymore. We never really fought about it. I got the statement saw the rate increase, more then doubled, called, they said tough, deal with it, I went and got DH who was outside, he came in called, got the same answer, I looked at him and said we have to file. He was onboard finally.

I drag him into the store now, he grocery shops, he goes to Walmart for necessities now, he is amazed how much things cost. I just let him live in his own world way to long. Now he is getting a clue as to how we got here. It's funny to me to see his eyes open wide at the cost of things, I kept trying to tell him, he just didn't want to hear it. So getting your spouse involved in things, everything having to do with finances is crucial in a BK. It actually is a huge relief to me to know he is getting an understanding of how much it cost to live and maybe we can avoid some of the mistakes we made that got us here.

[ThreadsSnapping]

It was only 3 weeks ago that hubby realized just how expensive it is to live. He couldn't seem to figure out why we didn't have all this money in the bank since we filed. He finally added up all of our everyday bills and he was shocked. He knew about all the bills but it doesn't seem like much when it's a $40 water bill, a $225 cell phone bill, $505 for the 2 car payments, $35 for a carton of cigs or $150 a week for food. But when he added it all up monthly it hit him like a ton of bricks.

He also commented on how long we went and how we made it before filing and how we paid everything before. But it was always something saved us in the nick of time - a bonus check at work, our tax refund or the stimulus check that made the truck payment in May. We were always robbing Peter to pay Paul and finally Peter got the shotgun out and started firing at Paul and it was all over.

He's finally starting to really get it and it makes my life so much easier. And I'm not the mean one anymore when I say we don't have money for him to go play golf this weekend. But he has said he is willing to go to the local one instead of the one 45 min away most of the time since it is cheaper and less gas. It's a slow process and it's hard but we'll make it.

TS

[woeisme]

As of this moment, credit cards are still being used for basic gas and groceries, etc. This is a part that truly confuses me. Everyone says to stop using the cards period, but how can you survive for 3, 6, 9 months waiting to file when it isn't possible to do so if payments are being made in the meantime. We haven't missed any payments yet, though it is just a matter of time once they limit out (2-3 months maybe). But I have heard that leaving your credit score as good as possible before the BK will result in coming out of BK with the score in ok shape, at least better shape than knocking it down by not making payments. I know 2-3 months won't do much, but wouldn't 6-9 months be a problem?

You can survive for 3, 6, 9 months by not paying on your credit cards anymore, and using that cash for your day-to-day expenses. Who cares about a credit score? Isn't poor use of credit what got you into the problem you are in currently? Do you really want your wife to be able to get credit cards coming right out of BK when you can't pull the BK trigger again for close to a decade? Having to rebuild your credit slowly, carefully, and in the correct manner after BK will be really helpful in the reality check she needs so that you guys don't end up in this kind of mess again.

Ok, I know having a decent credit rating is important for other things, like certain jobs, getting good interest rates on necessary things like car loans and mortgages, not having to put huge deposits down on utilities, etc. But seriously, your credit will take a big hit regardless of whether you pay up to the day you file or if you have 9 months of non-payment on record. But using the cards will compromise your ability to file, and possibly not be able to discharge your debt, which will land you into the same place of not being able to pay everything and having late payments show up on your record anyhow. The risk of using credit when you know you are insolvent compared to the small possibility of having a slightly improved credit score coming out of BK is really not worth it in my opinion. But you have to decide what is best for you. I know missing those first payments is hard as hell, went through it myself last summer, but after the initial freak-out, it's surprising how the roof didn't cave in, nobody came and repossessed Christmas, etc.

[roedog]

It's good to hear other's stories on the matter. The interesting part of our process is that my wife is the one that paid the bills. She saw the numbers every month and it had no effect. Time and time again I would get ahold of a credit card bill that I was certain would have a favorable balance after knowing I hadn't touched the card in many months only to find it had skyrocketed upward. I would confront her on it, she wouldn't argue her case (seemingly agreeing with what I had to say), I would feel bad afterward, I would expect that I could now trust her. A couple months later I'd get the mail, check the balance (see it had jumped again), want to bang my head against the wall, and go through the confrontation process again. This has occurred many times over the years. I admit that I hate to see and deal with bills. I'll tally up our bills for the month, compare it to income, see a reasonable buffer, then spend as little money as possible assuming that will be enough. My problem has been being naive enough to believe doing this and trusting my wife to do her part will be good enough. Maybe I should have taken over the bills, but I think I wanted her to see the issue every month. And paying the bills wasn't the problem, spending the money was.
One more thing with that. Once while feeling distraught about finances, I told my wife I'd never feel completely happy until we were free from CC debt. Her response, "oh don't worry about it, we'll always have credit card bills!" That sums it up right there.
In regards to seeing 3-4 attorneys, do they differ that much? I would think with a State's set rules in place, there shouldn't be many grey areas.
Lastly, part of my thinking with activating that credit card was to not put it into the BK, thus having one for credit rebuilding purposes after the fact. Is activating a card the bad idea, or is using that card the issue? I know having it available could be a temptation. But assuming I would resist, is there another reason to avoid it? More for an FYI, I don't expect to activate it after hearing previous responses.

[momof5]

. The interesting part of our process is that my wife is the one that paid the bills. She saw the numbers every month and it had no effect.

Thats definately interesting and a little scarey also. My husband works and brings home the money. I, in turn do all the bills. Every month was like a game for me. Paying this one with this one, using paycheck money to pay credit card bills and in turn using those credit cards to pay the household bills. Awful cycle and I am soooooooo glad its over!! I will admit that I stayed quiet about how bad it was for many many many months because I was afraid he might think I was messing up somehow or I didnt want him to worry.
I know you know your wife best but is it possible that maybe she is still in that 'pay 'em or else mode?' I recall that feeling of relief once everything was paid for the month. I would think to myself....all set till next month. It didnt stop me from using Credit cards because I was in this mind set that unless they were maxed I still had money.

[AngelinaCatHub]

You can survive for 3, 6, 9 months by not paying on your credit cards anymore, and using that cash for your day-to-day expenses. Who cares about a credit score? Isn't poor use of credit what got you into the problem you are in currently? Do you really want your wife to be able to get credit cards coming right out of BK when you can't pull the BK trigger again for close to a decade? Having to rebuild your credit slowly, carefully, and in the correct manner after BK will be really helpful in the reality check she needs so that you guys don't end up in this kind of mess again.

Clap, Clap, Clap!!!!!!!!!!!!! Check out my signature icon. 'Hub

[Frogge]

I am the same, I can't say enough about this subject..

I am STILL quiet, DH does not know how much we owe and I am waiting until the last possible moment to tell him. Why tell him? He'll stress out just like me and we'll both be a wreck. He'll be mad that I let it get THAT bad (even though I know it's not all my fault, I struggle with that). He knows everything but the actual dollar amount of the CC debt, including how much I pay out monthly to the cards.

I just can't believe we floated like this for so long, and how the mounting pressure of the bills and shuffling this and that like momof5 was talking about, to me this was "normal" !?! when in reality things were escalating little by little -- to the point where I feel like an emotional slave to the credit.