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    Need more advice...

    This is long, so please bear with me:

    As some of you may know, earlier this week, my wife and I retained an attorney. During our consultation, the attorney advised us to go and buy a new car before we file Chp.13 because I currently drive a 12 year old Cavalier with almost 190,000 miles on it. She instructed us to get one because I drive 100+ miles a day for work. She felt that my car would not last another 5 years and according to her, we would not qualify or be able to get a car loan in the next 5 years while on a repayment plan. Currently, my wife has a 05 Mailbu with 60,000 miles and we owe about $11,500 on it. She travels for her job as well. The attorney said that according to Kelley Bluebook vaule, the Malibu is only worth $5500 and she can get the car refinanced to that value during the bankruptcy.

    I feel very uneasy about making a purchase such as a new car. She gave us the card of a local honda dealer she knows who works with people that are about to file bankruptcy. We went to the dealer today and he wanted to put us in a certified honda accord for $17,995 at 30,000 miles. He said the car payment would be at $350-$375 a month most likely. He also said the interest rate would be 25%, but that wouldnt add correctly with the car price and the projected montly payment. It had a sizeable dent on the side of the car and had been slightly rear-ended. We declined to purchase the vehicle and my wife and I felt that he was extremely predatory in his sales tactics since he knew we were filing bankruptcy. The man told us that we are in no condition to haggle price or look around. We needed to buy the car today, because we might not qualify monday due to compounding interest on our bills. We havent been late on anything yet, just high debt to income ratio. In his own words, he said we "need to #$%^ or get off the pot."

    I plan on letting the attorney know what we think of him.

    My questions to everyone:

    1. Should I purchase a "new" used car right now or not?

    2. Has anyone been successful at purchasing a new vehicle in the middle of their chp. 13 repayment plan?

    My wife is starting to have doubts about getting one and so am I (I am a tight wad as it is), but my current vehicle will not last much longer. We found a 2006 ford for $15,000 at 20,000 miles. Im unsure though because it feels sooo wrong to purchase a car right before you file bankruptcy, but our lawyer instructed us to do it. My wife thinks she might be trying to up our secured debt in hopes of putting us into chapter 7 since we failed the means test, but I dont know.

    Thoughts everyone?
    Last edited by Reddrocket07; 08-16-2008, 04:56 PM.
    01/17/2009 Filed
    03/03/2009 341 Meeting
    04/14/2009 Confirmation Hearing

    #2
    Hi Reddrocket,
    Our attorney 'advised' us to purchase a new car for myself before we file ch 13 (although she didn't *refer* us to anyone, personally, I think that is strange). I was driving a 13 year old truck with 240k miles on it...it wouldn't have lasted the next 5 years without costly maintance. My hubby and I went that weekend; at the time we hadn't been late on any payments but our credit scores were pretty low due to our debt/almost maxed out on all cards. I knew we could only afford a max payment of $350...period. I went to the dealer, looked at new economical cars and decided on a used 2007 Honda Civic w/ 15,000 miles on it ($18,000). I believe that the dealer *knew* we were going to file BK soon (when they pulled our credit report), and the interest rate and payment was ridiculous to start! But I stuck to my guns and was willing to walk, I would rather drive my own car than get screwed on a car loan for 7 years (I wanted a 5 year loan)!
    Anyway, we got the car at 8% interest rate....go to another dealer that is willing to work with you.
    I understand the gulity feelings of purchasing a car right before BK, but this whats called PLANNING your BK.

    Good Luck!

    P.S. I would definately tell your attorney that her *friend* at the dealership is a shark!!!!
    May 2008 Hired 1st Attorney/Stopped paying CCs
    May 21, 2009 Retained 2nd Attorney
    May 28th - Filed for Ch 7 (FINALLY!)
    9/11/09 - DISCHARGED!!!!

    Comment


      #3
      I would go and look at some other lots. At 25% interest you'd never pay off the car loan, that's basically loan sharking.

      I would also look at vehicles that are between 5 and 10 years old.

      The reason it is difficult in a ch 13 to qualify for a new car is that all of your excess money is all of your disposable income goes to the plan (unless you get lucky) and you can't take on new debt without trustee permission.
      May 31st, 2007: Petition Filed by my lawyer
      July 2nd, 2007: 341 Meeting Held
      September 4th, 2007: Discharged and Closed.

      Comment


        #4
        After going into a Chapter 13 with 3 year old cars, I can certainly tell you that if you do high mileage commuting as I do your present vehicles will not make it through 5 years - the upkeep would eventually do you in so it is more worthwhile to you to get a new or good used vehicle. Have you ever in the past had a successful, paid off loan with Chrysler, Ford Credit or GMAC? If so, go do one of those dealerships and go after the most economical used or new car they have - prices are good now and your past credit with them will help. If not, you may have to deal with higher interest rates but go after a small economy car to get you through the Plan. Your Honda man mentioned in the first posting is a shark that smells blood in the water and he is circling. Go to other dealerships and do so soon.
        _________________________________________
        Filed 5 Year Chapter 13: April 2002
        Early Buy-Out: April 2006
        Discharge: August 2006

        "A credit card is a snake in your pocket"

        Comment


          #5
          Yea, He also told me my lawyer will prompt me to take back any purchases from other car lots and do business with him because he is "fair." However, my lawyer told me we could go wherever. She just suggested him because he has "helped" her other clients. This guy spent the whole time talking this POS Accord up, insulting us, and trying to pressure my wife and I to buy this car. What is a reasonable interest rate to shoot for. I think 8% will not be in the cards for the wife and I. Liz was very lucky!

          Should you haggle the car below Kelley Bluebook value, or should it be slighty above it? We are looking at an 06 Fusion right now.

          Has anyone else had their lawyer send them out to get a car in order to pass the means test to file chp 7?
          01/17/2009 Filed
          03/03/2009 341 Meeting
          04/14/2009 Confirmation Hearing

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Reddrocket07 View Post
            I think 8% will not be in the cards for the wife and I. Liz was very lucky!?
            Not, really...my fico was 554! But I insisted that he look at my overall credit...never been late, etc.

            Good Luck!
            May 2008 Hired 1st Attorney/Stopped paying CCs
            May 21, 2009 Retained 2nd Attorney
            May 28th - Filed for Ch 7 (FINALLY!)
            9/11/09 - DISCHARGED!!!!

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Reddrocket07 View Post
              Yea, He also told me my lawyer will prompt me to take back any purchases from other car lots and do business with him because he is "fair."
              Oh wow, this con artist salesman was so trying to blow smoke up your butt. I would definitly tell your lawyer what he said, so they can quit referring clients to him.
              Chapter 13 filed -8/12/04
              Plan approved- 7/11/05
              Date discharged--10-12-2007
              Date closed- 12/6/2007:yes2::yes2:

              Comment


                #8
                If you want a reliable car, get either a toyota or a honda. I guarantee you an older toyota or honda will outlive a newer ford, or chrysler. I just picked up a 2003 acura with 73,000 miles on it today for $8,000, and I know I can drive this thing for at least another 250,000 miles, no problem. Don't give up on honda yet. Just go to a different dealer, and for crying out loud, do not tell them you are about to file bk! They will totally take advantage of you!

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by timetosave View Post
                  Just go to a different dealer, and for crying out loud, do not tell them you are about to file bk! They will totally take advantage of you!
                  Eh the lawyer told us to tell him she sent us.
                  01/17/2009 Filed
                  03/03/2009 341 Meeting
                  04/14/2009 Confirmation Hearing

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Its common for a lawyer to tell their clients to get a new car b4 filing, however I think is strange that she refered you to someone. She might have "sugested".....
                    I would look around. For someone who has never been late the interest is very high.
                    I don't work, owed a lot of cc and was able to get 5.9% with Honda. I don't know your fico score but I would definetely look around.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Reddrocket07 View Post
                      Eh the lawyer told us to tell him she sent us.
                      I would look around but also look at the suggestion of the lawyer? You may even make out better. If you do, you win and the lawyer will be pleased (no doubt a personal friend). If it isn't a good deal, say nothing to the lawyer but at least you got the deal you wanted. 'Hub
                      If I knew it all, would I be here?? Hang in there = Retained attorney 8-06, Filed 12-28-07, Discharge 8-13-08, Finally CLOSED 11-3-09, 3-31-10 AP Dismissed, Informed by incompetent lawyer of CLOSED status, October 14, 2010.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by AngelinaCatHub View Post
                        I would look around but also look at the suggestion of the lawyer? You may even make out better. If you do, you win and the lawyer will be pleased (no doubt a personal friend). If it isn't a good deal, say nothing to the lawyer but at least you got the deal you wanted. 'Hub
                        I disagree with this hub. In the first post, they said they went to the person the lawyer recommended, and that person tried to screw them over. The lawyer needs to know that the "friend" is trying to take advantage of them. 25% interest and a car that has been in a wreck to boot?
                        Chapter 13 filed -8/12/04
                        Plan approved- 7/11/05
                        Date discharged--10-12-2007
                        Date closed- 12/6/2007:yes2::yes2:

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Reddrocket07 View Post
                          Has anyone else had their lawyer send them out to get a car in order to pass the means test to file chp 7?
                          I was never anywhere near the median, so it wasn't a matter or chapter 7 vs 13, but it certainly was a matter of protecting assets. My lawyer wouldn't even talk to me until I had followed his instructions to unload my paid-for car (which was still worth around 10K) and get into something exemptable. In NY that's only $2,400! I was panicked, because I live in a very remote area, off the grid, on a vertical dirt road. I NEED 4-wheel drive, and I NEED something reliable. The only safe choice was to buy or lease something new or newish, and to start making payments again...which flew in the face of logic and my personal inclinations.

                          I can really understand how you're feeling, Reddrocket - this whole car thing made me sick. It probably delayed my filing by several months...until I had finally spent enough time on this forum to believe this wasn't insane, illegal, immoral, or all three. If you're not in the habit of "working the system", then "planning your bankruptcy" sounds like a nasty euphemism and it feels a lot like cheating. It isn't, as long as you're being honest and you're not hiding assets. It's no different from taking allowable, legal, tax deductions when you file your income taxes. (And since I filed the EZ form much of my life, it took a while to wrap my head around that, too!)

                          In my case, financing a new car right before the bankruptcy allowed me to save my land and my home, which was my primary concern, and even to pay for some major infrastructure that I couldn't have otherwise managed. I HATE having a car payment, but it's a temporary situation, and it's better than having lost my land.

                          And by the way, the trustee couldn't have been less interested. I was listed as a no asset case the day after my 341.
                          Filed chapter 7: June 9, 2008
                          341 meeting: July 18, 2008
                          last day for objections: September 16, 2008
                          DISCHARGED September 18, 2008 - CLOSED September 29, 2008

                          Comment


                            #14
                            I got my new car today. I was raped by the interest rate, but its definately alot better than the 25% the Honda guy suggested (but not by much!). My lawyer says she can bring it down some when we file. The finance manager at the car lot knew from looking at the responses from the banks that we will be filing BK soon lol. He spoke with 6 banks, 4 turned us down, Citifinancial approved with a down payment, and Wells Fargo approved with no conditions. He told us to refinance in two years to get a better rate.
                            01/17/2009 Filed
                            03/03/2009 341 Meeting
                            04/14/2009 Confirmation Hearing

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Hi there Reddrock!

                              Congrats on the new car, what kind did you get and what is your payment?!
                              May 2008 Hired 1st Attorney/Stopped paying CCs
                              May 21, 2009 Retained 2nd Attorney
                              May 28th - Filed for Ch 7 (FINALLY!)
                              9/11/09 - DISCHARGED!!!!

                              Comment

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