Lets see what we can do as a group to help each other.

[heyu]

I go to work everyday and still cannot make ends meet, I am in BK at present,48 days since 341 and still in the house that I surrendered, every day I say to my self, how can I make some more money, I have tried the internet and lost a bundle, I have invested and also lost a bundle, I need to find a way to make money even when I am asleep, thats how the rich make theirs, I am sure that they are not any smarter than or more educated than most of us, so what is it that makes them make cash, and when asked they will tell you its easy but you try the same thing, you will likely get in trouble or loose a bundle to boot. I am doing this to open a new thread so that you can voice your ideas and thoughts, someone will have something that may just work for someone else so why not give this idea a try.

[Flamingo]

Right now people in the foreclosure business (i.e., cleaning up foreclosed houses) are making a bundle, repo people and anyone involved as to bankruptcy filings (BK attorneys are making a bundle). None of us have the time to go get a law degree but one can investigate the businesses tied into this economy as to what is doing well. Who knows what can be made there until the economy improves.

Also, now is the time for many to consider maybe going back to school and changing careers - even though most corporations and businesses are doing badly, hospitals and other health care institutions and nursing homes are having a big shortage of nurses, caretakers, home care folks or any related field (i.e., radiology technician, etc.).

[BassBoy]

Yes, it would be great to make cash while you sleep, but in order to make the cash, you have have something to start with, like what my wife and I do as a side business. We had to invest a small amount, but the return could be potentially rewarding. I will say this though.........in today's economy, people are watching their pennies, so what we do as a side business has not done very well. It's a risk these days.

Is a second, part-time job out of the question? It may help you put away something extra to help you out with your finances. I did that when my previous emplyer was cutting hours and salaries. I would bartend 3 nights a week. The base pay was minimum wage, but on a good night, I'd come home with my pockets full of tips. I never mixed a drink before, but I'm a people person, so I did well with the customers. I learned mixing quite easily.

Do you have a hobby or craft that you're good at? You could this on the side. I do a little of that these days since I had to give up bartending.........interfered with my day job..........couldn't stay awake. LOL! We live in a duplex and I do some of the handywork (minor stuff) for the landlord. I'm good at this kind of stuff. He compensates me for what I do. I also do some work for the homeowner of the duplex next to us (different owner). The owner lives in one side and rents the other. It's not a lot of extra money because there isn't a lot of repairs, but it does help out.

Oops, didn't mean to go on-and-on. Just throwing ideas out there.

[DisneyGirl]

Some things we did around here, Hubby changed careers and is working on continuing his education. This alone has increased our income greatly.

Also my husband is a musician and has a home studio so he's thinking about putting songs on itunes and such and making some money there.

Not exactly multi-million dollar ideas, but we more than "get by" now.

[BankruptPinoy]

My book Living Well on Practically Nothing is a treasure trove of
advice on cultivating and reaping the benefits of frugality, a subject
I learned well through experience.

I was born in 1931 during the Great Depression. The Romney family had
lost its money by then, and by 1933 my father had lost his job, too.
We relocated to rural New Hampshire and moved into a 200-year-old Cape
Cod that was heated with wood fireplaces and a kerosene range in the
kitchen.

While my father tried to earn a precarious living taking photographs
and fixing radios for local people, my mother and the rest of the
family practiced many economies to make ends meet, which I will always
remember. I recall Dad's buying or trading for half of a cow one
winter, which he kept in a large wooden crate on the porch. It was so
cold in New Hampshire that the meat never thawed. Dad would take a
hacksaw and an axe and chop frozen meat off it as needed. The cow
lasted all winter.

The Depression was frightening, and as a youngster I often considered
what we would do if we got even poorer. I was fascinated with the
woods out in back of our colonial house and thought I would like to
live out there like Hansel and Gretel. At about age 4 I ran away from
home and had a grand time in the woods until they finally found me. It
was a friendly place. As a teen, I became an active hunter,
backpacker, camper, and hiker and spent a lot of time alone in the
woods at a survival level (an interest that has continued all my
life).

Prior to 1929, the Romney family had been socially prominent. Some of
our friends and relatives snubbed us once we were poor, but others
really enjoyed my parents and remained kind and helpful. These people
became mentors to me, and I learned much more from them than I ever
learned in the context of formal
education. (When I entered grammar school, I was disappointed to find
that my teachers were not as bright and interesting as the people
around my dad.) Among those who stand out in my mind are Roger Babson,
our cousin the economist who predicted the crash of 1929 (my dad
didn't listen) and founded Babson College and Babson Park in Florida;
his friend Igor Sikorsky, who was an early airplane designer in
czarist Russia and invented the helicopter; Vannevar Bush, my Uncle
Conrad's college classmate who was an MIT professor and the founder of
Raytheon; George M. Bryne, another cousin, who built many of the
canals and tunnels around Boston, fought with labor unions, and had
yachts; Frank Blanchard, the reptile biologist, explorer, and National
Geographic writer who could charm snakes and found them everywhere (he
was an environmentalist before anyone else was); and Richard E. Byrd
Jr., who had explored the South Pole with his late father, Admiral
Byrd, and was also a masterful, intuitive self-taught mechanic who
loved antiques, boats, and old cars. These people were most inspiring
to me, and they played a crucial role in shaping the philosophy and
attitude that guided my life and laid the foundation for Living Well
on Practically Nothing. My teachers and professors, on the other hand,
provided little in the way of enlightenment. Most ignored me. So I
coasted through school and college fairly easily, doing little work
and reading everything but my lessons. Nevertheless, I did manage to
graduate and earn an MA degree under the GI Bill.

My first few jobs, teaching college and trade school, were poorly
paid. But because I was able to read and prepare lessons very quickly,
I had a lot of free time. I looked for other ways to make money and
soon discovered that antique furniture, antique cars, World War II
pistols, and old lever-action rifles could be bought very cheaply,
fixed up, and sold at a profit. (I bought the 1888 Kodak shown at
above for $50 and sold it to a museum for $2,000!) I learned the
principles of antiquing by working for Harold "Elephant" Reed, who in
the 1940s, claimed to be the largest antique dealer in the world. (The
details of this experience are highlighted in my book.) I had learned
how to do most car repairs, including changing and rebuilding an
engine, from my dad, who drove a Model A Ford for about 200,000 miles
in the 1930s and then kept a 1940 Ford for about 180,000 miles.
Capitalizing on that experience, I bought nice antique cars for as low
as $45 in the 1950s and '60s, which lasted for years and sold at a
profit. I soon learned to restore radios, refrigerators, and many
other appliances as well. This brought in lots of extra money, and in
a short while my family and I were living very well for much less
money than others spent. About that time I started saving money and
discovered that if you never listened to brokers and never bought any
mutual funds, you could do quite well in the stock market.
Fortunately, I started investing when stocks were relatively cheap.

In 1960 I went to work for International Correspondence Schools, where
I learned all about the mail order business. In 1962 I became the
civil defense (CD) training coordinator for the state of Vermont, with
50 instructors under me. I was already an enthusiastic survivalist and
CD volunteer, and I had learned all about controlling people and
fighting radiation, blast, and the fireball at National Civil Defense
headquarters in Battle Creek, Michigan. So I gave the state of
Vermont's course a strong survivalist emphasis, and although it was
very popular, the liberals almost got me fired for being too gung ho.
Fortunately, my friends pulled me through.

After working in civil defense I took a variety of other hum-drum
jobs, and in 1969 I decided to go on my own, selling books and
second-hand items by mail and doing some free-lance writing. At first
the business was not successful, and we had a very hard time.
Eventually, though, I got the formula right. Our most successful
products are the books we sell on camera and radio repair. (I also
enjoy taking pretty pictures, some of which have been published,
earning extra money. I took the photo below with a secondhand Agfa
camera I bought for $10.) As the updated edition of the Living Well
book explains, it was the computer and the Internet that really saved
the business.

I decided to write the first Living Well book in 1990 for the benefit
of my kids, my nieces and nephews, and other young people. I was
struck by the fact that young people today seemed to have no
perception of what life is really like and no awareness of any kind of
living except punching a time clock or teaching school – and borrowing
money. I felt that writing the book would be a good way to pass along
some of the insights culled from my own experience. Well, my son,
Edward C.W. Romney, took the information in my book quite to heart. He
started a pallet factory on $2,000 and built it up to a large
enterprise that is now grossing $1.6 million a year. He is not the
exception, however; many other people have written me letters
describing how the first edition of Living Well
on Practically Nothing has changed their lives. To me this makes all
the effort worthwhile. I hope the new, expanded and updated edition
will help people even more.
Q&A

Paladin: What were some of the most valuable lessons you culled from
your experience of being poor?
Romney: Keeping one's pride, keeping clean and neat regardless,
resisting status completely, never buying anything for vanity only,
maintaining a low profile, anonymity. I am far from poor now but still
wear old clothes and drive small or older cars or an old pickup
(though we do own an older Cadillac that looks almost new that we use
for honored guests and special occasions).

Paladin: Can you give us some examples of some of the resourceful
things your family did when you were young in order to make ends meet?
Romney: Mother's wonderful, low-cost homemade bread, baked beans,
boiled dinners, and pies were made on a cook stove that also heated
the house. We also heated the house with wood fires (I chopped and
sawed a lot of the firewood). And by working with Dad we learned to
build and fix things. We were given (or bought for a few cents)
radios, photographs, and all sorts of appliances and instruments.
Dad's shortwave and ham radios saved on postage and long distance
phone calls (which were then very expensive) and provided news and
entertainment. We heard Hitler (who was frightening), Churchill, Radio
Nederlands, and all kinds of programs. And my family had a wonderful
knack for self-entertainment: Mother played piano to almost concert
level and painted pictures (she had studied painting in Paris, so it
was her career and fun too); other relatives sang, played violin or
cello, or recited poems; and instead of movies and nights out, which
could not be afforded, we had fascinating philosophical discussions
around a dinner table (not acrimonious, but good-natured sharing of
viewpoints and experiences). Like all New Englanders, we had a huge
attic and kept everything, so we had more than 1,000
books—classics—and I read extensively when I was home alone and the
snow was blowing. I was greatly influenced all my life by William
Shakespeare, Arthur Koestler and Albert Schweitzer, Goethe's Faust,
and many other fine classic works that make one a worldly and
sophisticated person. Other treasures were up there too: old letters,
pictures, fans, clothing, clocks, a round trunk that traveled cross
country, and much more. When we traveled, we had friends in most
places who let us stay overnight and vacation (many had summer camps),
so we avoided paying the huge resort and motel costs one sees today.
As a result of growing up poor, we learned disdain for people with
unearned wealth and respect for good businessmen, which helped us
avoid being cheated or fooled. And we learned NEVER to borrow money,
which was considered akin to writing a bad check.

Paladin: Can you recall some of the hardships you endured?
Romney: When it comes to hardships, the old cars stand out in my mind.
In those days they weren't nearly as reliable, and the brakes were bad
too. One time, the brakes failed on the '37 Ford woodie wagon while we
were coming down several thousand feet from the mountainous Skyline
Drive (there was no backup system then). There was no stopping it; we
were going too fast to shift to second gear. The old, top-heavy wagon
took the narrow two-lane road's sharp curves at 65 miles per hour.
Luckily, it didn't tip over and we survived, but I was petrified! Once
the brakes on Dad's '40 Ford failed when a brake hose split wide open.
I got the car home in second gear, sometimes scuffing the curb to slow
it down, and on the way I ran into the car in front of me fairly
gently. There was no damage, because bumpers were very strong then,
but the driver in front was not pleased. Tires were also poor before
nylon cord and synthetic rubber were invented. I remember getting a
flat in a long tunnel on the Wilbur Cross Turnpike in Connecticut with
the '37 Ford Wagon. The old car rolled around terribly but stayed
upright, and I drove it slowly out of the tunnel on the rim with angry
motorists following behind. I replaced it with the spare, which was in
a stylish metal "Continental" case on the tailgate. But the spare,
which was aged too, failed after a few miles, and I had to buy a new
tire in a turnpike gas station, which cost today's equivalent of $250
and took all of our savings. In the 1950s, we had only one car, and if
it wouldn't start and we had to go to work or class, it was terrible.
There were no neighbors to drive us, no garages nearby, and if we
didn't get there, we would be in deep trouble. (In those days there
was no forgiveness like today.) Once, just before it was time to go to
work, I discovered the water pump on my Model A Ford had a bad
bearing. I used coat hanger wire, and at the last moment I got it
going. Then, halfway to work, it set up an awful clatter as the
impeller tore up the cylinder head. I just made it.

Paladin: Now that you make a comfortable living, do you ever splurge
and enjoy your money frivolously, or are you a die-hard penny-pincher?
Romney: We splurge. I enjoy dining out and dancing and traveling the
world with my wife, Sara, who works very hard in the business. We just
bought a new 2002 Saturn, and we live in a good house in a safe
section of town.

Paladin: Are there any luxuries you allow yourself? What is your take
on the old saying, "You can't take it with you"?
Romney: As we get wealthier, we take for granted some of the things
that were really luxuries once. We no longer ever eat at McDonald's;
it must be Cracker Barrel or Steak House. And instead of changing my
own oil in winter, I have it done now. But we NEVER spend to show off
or for vanity. I still wear a Timex watch and wear used clothing. Dad
said he expected me to do better financially in life than he did, and
I told my son the same. This is how you "take it with you."

Paladin: In your view, what are the essential ingredients of success?
Romney: Willpower, persistence, and good judgment. It's also important
to remember and profit from experience and to distrust most authority
unless it proves itself.

Paladin: What are some things even the poorest person can do to save
money and accumulate wealth?
Romney: Ways to save money include having no debts, caring for
property, not drinking alcohol, avoiding being a victim of crime,
staying out of trouble, and not eating too much. To accumulate wealth,
try keeping all small change and then banking or investing it. And buy
stock direct and have all dividends reinvested – never sell it.

Paladin: What do you see as the most important lessons to be gained
from reading your book?
Romney: Old used things . . . real classics . . . bought cheap are
often better than new things. Education is often a trap and not always
a boon. Working for yourself is better than having a boss, unless you
are young and need a mentor. You can live well for much less in some
parts of the country than others, but job opportunities may not be
good in those places. The Internet will hitch you to the world.
Distrust the media.

[BankruptPinoy]

The unions have apprenticeships with tuition free training.

Doctor? Lawyer?
How About Plumber?

By Terri Cullen

From The Wall Street Journal Online

The toilet in our main bathroom broke twice this month -- which
naturally led to a conversation between my husband Gerry and me about
our six-year-old son's future occupation.

Gerry's a jack-of-all-trades around the house, thanks to his career as
a facilities manager, so there was no need to call a plumber when the
toilet broke. After Gerry fixed it for the second time in a week
(first came a worn seal, then a broken valve), he mentioned how much
money we save having a plumber on-call 24/7. And he's right: The cost
for even minor plumbing work in our metropolitan New York suburb can
be staggering.

When the job's too big and we're in need of professional advice, we
call on Drew, a good friend and licensed plumber who rarely charges us
for his services. Drew's generosity has saved us thousands of dollars
over the years: At $65 an hour, this month's bathroom breaks alone
would have cost us $130.

Assume a plumber like Drew works a seven-hour day, five days a week
and that hourly rate comes to about $118,000 a year. And plumbers can
earn far more on bigger jobs: For example, typical plumbing charges
for a kitchen remodel in our area run $750 per fixture. Some of the
benefits are pretty good, too -- as an independent contractor, Drew is
often free to set his own hours, which over the years has saved his
family thousands of dollars and a lot of aggravation when it comes to
child-care arrangements. Health-care costs are covered by his wife,
who works full-time in the banking industry.

After the second toilet breakdown, I joked that from now on Gerry
should make sure our son Gerald is close by and taking notes when the
next mishap occurs, so he'll learn what to do and be able to save
money when he has a home of his own. "You bet, I'll make him a plumber
in no time," Gerry laughed.

Do we really want Gerald to grow up to be a plumber? No -- though
there's good money to be made, the work is physically demanding and
the wear and tear on the body often forces workers to find different
work later in life. "Most don't last past 50 on the job," says Frank
Rizzo, Secretary of the New Jersey State League of Master Plumbers.
"They'll move on to building inspection or another related field."
Drew's knees are proof: He's had surgery on one and his doctor has
told him he'll soon need to replace the other.

My husband's job can be punishing, too -- years ago he was almost
killed when he fell from scaffolding in the warehouse of a former
employer. Gerry's often said to me that he would never urge our son to
skip college and take a job in his labor union, the way his father did
with Gerry. He says that "my son will sit behind a desk like you do --
not break his back for a living."

But I wonder if skilled labor is becoming one of the few sure paths to
a good living. Most parents still dream of having their kids grow up
to be doctors or lawyers -- along with prestige, those careers are
seen as guarantees of lifelong financial security. Gerry and I want
that for Gerald, but I'm no longer sure obtaining a law or medical
degree will provide it. As higher-education costs soar, more students
with professional degrees are being forced to take on the equivalent
of a small mortgage to pay for them.

Medical students who borrowed to pay for school -- roughly 85% of all
students -- graduated with an average of $120,280 in debt in 2005, up
4% from the year before, according to the Association of American
Medical Colleges in Washington, D.C. Almost 67% of those students had
loans of more than $100,000. This student-loan calculator from
financial-aid Web site FinAid.org shows that average translates to
payments of $1,384.19 a month over 10 years, at a rate of 6.8%. That
amount of debt could force many young doctors to put off getting
married and having children, buying their first homes, and saving for
retirement.

Lawyers also face a tough beginning.

"If one graduates with median or higher debt and ends up going to a
large law firm that pays six figures, those people are going to be
OK," says John Sebert, a consultant on legal education at the American
Bar Association. "On the other hand, if one goes into a small firm
where you're getting paid $50,000 to $60,000 a year, I can't imagine
that that's not going to be a problem."

Gerry's experience has been just the opposite. Gerry's parents were
adamantly against his going to college -- his dad urged him to join
his union, where he was sure Gerry could land a good-paying job. So he
did, and our lives have been the better for it. He bought his first
home at age 25, and we married soon after. We've managed to amass
relatively considerable retirement savings, largely because Gerry
began saving and his employer began contributing to his account as
soon as he graduated high school. His union also provides us with the
kind of benefits that are vanishing at many employers: We have
health-care and disability insurance, and the union is very aggressive
about helping its members find work, a perk Gerry greatly appreciated
when he lost his job last summer.

My own parents were too busy trying to make ends meet to think much
about what their own children would go on to do after high school. At
the urging of my high-school journalism teacher, I enrolled in
journalism school and graduated five years later -- carrying more than
$20,000 in student loan and credit-card debt. My starting salary at my
first job? $18,000.

Would I encourage Gerald to follow the same path? Absolutely ... if he
shared my love of writing. At this early stage, though, it seems he's
got his dad's knack for numbers and an inherent desire to build
things. (Our family room holds a small city of Magnetix skyscrapers.)
What does he want to be when he grows up? "A sports player!" -- though
he's still on the fence about whether to play pro football (American)
or pro football (everywhere else). His second choice? "A policeman, so
I can ride a motorcycle."

One thing Gerald's sure he doesn't want to be is a personal-finance
columnist: "Mom," he sighs, "you're always on the computer."

[BankruptPinoy]

To survive in this economy, one cannot have an "education". People
with "educations" are a penny a dozen; and that is how they are paid.
Where I live, there is no shortage of out of work, CPA's,Computer
Programmers, Systems Analysts, Chemists, Engineers, even Attorneys.
Why? Employers do not need people with "educations , they are looking
for people with "Job Skills". The only "education" worth having
nowdays is one that gives you a practical "job skill". Nurse, Lab Tech, X-Ray Tech, Sonographer, Physical Therapy Assistant, Dental Assistant-all can be taken for free in Georgia with the HOPE Grant for Georgia residents, unless that person has used up HOPE credits on other degrees paid by HOPE.

How about teaching? Well, school districts are not wanting to hire around here unless it is at the T-4 level; BS degree only. If you have a masters or higher, they figure they can use the money better.

[BankruptPinoy]

http://www.chuckharder.com/consumerarticle4.htm

"Be a "finder." Go to flea markets, garage sales and other such
outlets and look for collectible items that you have researched.
Often the pocket watch you can buy for $5.00 is worth $300.00 to
the watch and clock collector. Just go and study up on antiques
and collectibles at the library. And don't forget the value of old
records. Old jukeboxes also bring big bucks!

Go ahead of the garbage truck. Pick up the cast-off lamps, chairs,
clothes, radios, TV's, lawn mowers and what have you. You would
be amazed at what people throw away.
Bottom line:
No overhead. What you earn you keep.

Starting Your Own Business . . .
With Nothing!
By Chuck Harder

There are lots of books at the library about different types of small
businesses that you can go into. You might want to check them out and
then think along these lines:

1. Find a need and fill it. What is needed in your area?
2. What can you do that will fill that need?
3. Can you work out of your home and avoid an overhead?

You have the right to be a "Sole Proprietor" which means that you are
operating a business in your own name. You still can deduct business
expenses but don't need to spend big money on incorporating or setting
up any form of fancy operations. Just keep track of all of your
expenses to prepare your income taxes at the end of the year. If
things go well you might want to incorporate later to get more tax
breaks.
Here's some ideas to ponder:

A. What's your hobby? Can you turn it into making a buck? If so you
may have the beginning of a business that you really love that can
support you.

B. The "Lost Arts" are returning. If you can sew, repair shoes, or do
similar work you may find a need for these services in your area. I
know a lady who sews from her home and makes a very good living!

C. Be a "finder." Go to flea markets, garage sales and other such
outlets and look for collectible items that you have researched. Often
the pocket watch you can buy for $5.00 is worth $300.00 to the watch
and clock collector. Just go and study up on antiques and collectibles
at the library. And don't forget the value of old records. Old
jukeboxes also bring big bucks!

D. Go ahead of the garbage truck. Pick up the cast-off lamps, chairs,
clothes, radios, TV's, lawn mowers and what have you. You would be
amazed at what people throw away. When I was once desperate I did
exactly that and took the stuff I picked up to the flea market and
came home with $350.00 after two days of selling.
Bottom line:

No overhead. What you earn you keep. Your only expense should be a
self-inking rubber stamp with your phone and address!"

Ed Romney says, "If I lost my job, I would buy a cheap old station
wagon or van and get a lot of ladders, scaffolds, and paint brushes
and go door to door wearing white coveralls asking to paint people's
houses and do some home improvements. I'd hire extra help from men
hanging around the employment office for each job and pay them by the
hour. I'd make the homeowner pay for paint in advance so there would
be no overhead."

He also suggests gypsy cabs and buses, using your car as an unlicensed
cab to take people to airports and other places. He says to take a
short course in welding then mount an electrical and a gas welding
outfit to the back of an old truck and travel around welding broken
farm implements, autos and trucks, whatever job you can find. He says
welding pays good. He says also to be a mobile mechanic and travel
around with your equipment and fix things. Own your own junkyard he
writes.

Ed also said motorcycle repair and sales, especially with gasoline
prices are so high, would be good. Tax preparation, payroll, record
keeping businesses. Tutor kids especially in difficult subjects.
Take care of kids, sick people or prisoners. LPN, prison guard. NOW
I MUST ADD, I would never be a guard. They ferment urine and feces
and throw it on you. That's just for starters, and that's no BS.

Ed also said to be a flea market dealer, an auctioneer, and if he lost
his job today, he would go to McDonald's because they are always
hiring or try a temporary service like Kelly or BOS or Manpower
because often it is the temp that is hired full time.

Homeowners need lawns mowed, leaves raked, trees and bushes trimmed.

"If one person says no, do not be upset. You know you are good and
honest. Keep on."
From Ed's book, "Living well on practically nothing"

"Our Country won't go on forever, if we stay as soft as we are now.
There won't be any America - because some foreign soldiery will invade
us and take our women and breed a hardier race."-Gen. Lewis B.
"Chesty" Puller

OK, here's an idea for a niche in auto repair. Specialize in
repairing, lowering, and/or pimping up 1980–1995 Chevrolet/GMC
pickups. Nothing else. To get started, spend a few days going through
parking lots for 20 miles around, slipping attractive fliers under the
wipers of your target pickups. In fact, since you have some money
saved, you might consider buying older pickups, fixing them up, and
selling them again—especially to your fellow Hispanics. (Check first
with the DMV to find out how often you can do this without being a
dealer.)

Another question-I'm a high school dropout currently working at a
local fast-food joint. I want to quit this boring, low-paying,
dead-end job, but what can I do? I like to work with my hands, and I
can repair anything from an inkjet printer to a riding lawnmower, but
I don't know how to start any kind of business.

Keep your job for now, take any overtime that's offered, and save,
save, save. Offer your services to repair as many different kinds of
things as you can. Even work free, if it will help you learn. Keep
looking for a niche, and when you find one, drop everything else and
specialize in that. For example, if you happen to do well in getting
an old outboard motor running, why not specialize in that field? Trust
me on this one—outboards that no longer run can be picked up at yard
sales for pennies! Get them going again, shine them up, add a new
prop, guarantee your work, and sell them
to fishermen, perhaps as backup engines. (A dedicated fisherman will
spend his last dollar to get out there on the water when the fish are
biting—and sometimes even when they aren't.)-Again from "Skip College"

OK, here's an idea for a niche in auto repair. Specialize in
repairing, lowering, and/or pimping up 1980–1995 Chevrolet/GMC
pickups. Nothing else. To get started, spend a few days going through
parking lots for 20 miles around, slipping attractive fliers under the
wipers of your target pickups. In fact, since you have some money
saved, you might consider buying older pickups, fixing them up, and
selling them again—especially to your fellow Hispanics. (Check first
with the DMV to find out how often you can do this without being a
dealer.)

Another question-I'm a high school dropout currently working at a
local fast-food joint. I want to quit this boring, low-paying,
dead-end job, but what can I do? I like to work with my hands, and I
can repair anything from an inkjet printer to a riding lawnmower, but
I don't know how to start any kind of business.

Keep your job for now, take any overtime that's offered, and save,
save, save. Offer your services to repair as many different kinds of
things as you can. Even work free, if it will help you learn. Keep
looking for a niche, and when you find one, drop everything else and
specialize in that. For example, if you happen to do well in getting
an old outboard motor running, why not specialize in that field? Trust
me on this one—outboards that no longer run can be picked up at yard
sales for pennies! Get them going again, shine them up, add a new
prop, guarantee your work, and sell them
to fishermen, perhaps as backup engines. (A dedicated fisherman will
spend his last dollar to get out there on the water when the fish are
biting—and sometimes even when they aren't.)-Again from "Skip College"

[AngelinaCatHub]

Penoy: You make my mind swirl with your long but very good pastes. Now in my humble opinion, as things are going, we don't need educational minds, we need occupational minds. Things that can be fixed at an affordable rate.

How many "black smiths" do we have? Few. Now if you need one, you pay royal. As they know what to do.

Those who survive the next great Depression, will be those who can live off the land. No I do not mean berries and ferns. I mean barter. "I'll give you a fish for your repair of my fishing pole", etc. We are now coming home so to speak, and for me, I think it may be an enlightening spirit for our children, [if they survive super shock].

One of the finest books I have read (30 times) is " Alas Babylon" by Pat Frank. There is a sort of wisdom there as in George Orwell's 1984.

[BankruptPinoy]

Mark Twain's famous quotation, "Figures don't lie, but liars figure,"
has never had greater meaning than when it is applied to today's
politicians and government accounting.

Why I'm Worried About The Future
Personal Opinion and Commentary By Chuck Harder

Quote:America was built on the premise of the 30-year mortgage. You
could buy a new home and rely on the fact that tomorrow would be very
much like today. You were sure that the home would be paid-off and
free-and-clear well before you were not able to work any longer. In
short, America worked for it's workers. No matter if you did or did
not finish High-School or even attend College you had the assurance
that a good job was waiting for you right in your hometown. Even if
you took an entry-level job and worked on the manufacturing-plant
floor, you would be able to earn enough to build a family, enjoy a
decent lifestyle and retire with dignity. That's gone, the factories
are gone and America is in deep decline.

I believe that in the late 1960's the "Rockefeller-New York-Banking
Bunch" decided that the everyday American and Unions in particular had
too much power. The bankers decided to take control. They did. As
usual they did it via their front organizations such as "The Council
On Foreign Relations (CFR)," and the "Trilateral Commission (TC),"
"Business Roundtable," and others. Soon government agencies like AID
and OPIC were set-up for the specific purpose of moving American
factories offshore under the supposed mantle of "trade not aid."

The scheme was elegantly simple and would make Al Capone and John
Dillenger blush. Factories based in the USA that paid a living-wage
would be moved offshore to slave-labor countries. The same machinery
would be operated and the same products would be produced by
frightened "peasant workers" in the third-world countries. Those local
workers who complained or threatened to report abuses or form unions
were summarily fired and often disappeared. Workers that kept their
mouth shut earned pennies-per-hour and lived in tin-shacks near the
factory. A glowing example of the situation is that most factories in
Mexico and the third-world don't have employee parking-lots.

Now after over ten years of this policy and the acceleration of
plant-closings by stupid policy like the North American Free Trade
Agreement (NAFTA) and The General Agreement on Trade and Tariff's
(GATT), (all signed by President Bill Clinton who says he is labor's
friend), has put the destruction of this country on the
"rocket-docket." A slow-trickle over the past ten years is now zooming
with the closure and move offshore by entire companies such as "Fruit
Of The Loom" and many others. Try to find just one radio, TV, VCR or
tape recorder made-in-the USA and you will soon learn that you cannot.
Entire industries are now offshore.
The Slow Trip Down-the-Toilet

The policies of Washington are decided by the big contributors. Mr.
and Mrs. America are considered the "Yahoos in the hustings," by those
that you elected. You and I live in "over-fly country" which is the
land between the Washington, New York, and Los Angeles airports. The
rich and the elite live in those cities and shun everyday people.
Bluntly put, we the voters don't count and have not since the mid-
1960's - if then.

The USA got rich by an "internal-economy." Little did we care what the
rest of the world was doing. We built our homes, cars, farms, and
communities and lived a grand lifestyle all considered. The New York
bankers and stockbrokers have made a fortune by converting the equity
we used to own such as our jobs and paychecks into their pockets. It's
been a long and slow slide but one might think it would have been a
disaster six years ago. Right? Wrong, wait until you read on.

If Bill Clinton is not the "anti-Christ" he should be. No man has done
more damage to this country and it's institutions and also still was
able to maintain prosperity. How did he do it? Answer; he did nothing.
The USA has been plagued by a string of disasters since his taking
office. Hurricane Andrew, floods, earth- quakes, droughts, massive
fires, and even meteor showers and solar flares. Each disaster
released a ton of money from the insurance companies back out into the
economy. As most of the products, services and labor to rebuild is
still native to the USA the money circulated into your home town with
the necessary multiplication factor to stimulate an economy that
should have gone "into the tank" long ago.
FIGURES DON'T LIE, BUT LIARS FIGURE

It's a simple calculation. You either keep your people working at good
jobs or you will have a giant welfare cost. The cheap products coming
in from overseas fill the bank accounts of the giant corporations but
the taxpayers have to pay more taxes for the decline of our
civilization. As people are fired they lose their homes, some turn to
crime and at the very least the welfare and food-stamp costs rise. The
price will be paid either at the store for good merchandise or to the
tax-man to fund the disaster from the foolish policies. You will pay -
there is no middle-ground.

A simple test: Ask yourself this question - Do you feel safer today
then ten or twenty years ago? Is your family safe? Do you walk alone
at night? Have you or someone you know been victimized? Have you
installed a home security-system or thought about it? Do you own a
gun? If not, do you think about getting one? Do you wish you would
take the step to buy a gun and learn how to use it? Why?
WHERE WILL YOU LIVE?

My first suggestion is to find a very rural area that is about
one-hour from the city that you live in. If possible find a small town
that is along an old US Highway that is now paralleled by an
interstate highway. Often property values plummet in areas bypassed by
new inter-states. Once you find that small town start going there on
weekends. You'll find small old motels on the old highway that will be
delighted to have you and your family as paying guests. Often they
will know where land is for sale. Attend the local doings and tell the
local folks how much you like their area. Keep the kids quiet and
never say anything snotty. Don't drink or party in front of any of the
local people. Be model citizens and show up around the town.

Make sure you take a business-day off and visit the local county-seat
and courthouse. There you will find the "gold" you have been searching
for. Start at the "Tax Appraisers office." Often they will have a book
you can buy that will show the county map and how it is divided into
the parcels of real estate and shows who owns what. Then jump in the
car and drive the areas you are interested in. Once you do the gold is
easy-to-find. Note on the map the parcels of empty land or the houses
and farms you are attracted to. Sometimes you will find an old mansion
with some broken windows and run-down as we once did. Then check the
tax records and see if the property-tax is paid. If it isn't you might
want to pay the tax and get in the "drivers seat."

A HA! Here is where you strike GOLD! It is my experience that out of
ten pieces of land in rural America there are at least three that the
owners don't want! Why? Simple, deaths in the family and/or Uncle Earl
used to live there. Now nobody left in the family wants the land and
are all arguing over who will pay the land-taxes! Often the relatives
of "Uncle Earl" are thousands of miles away and some may also be
elderly. They would love to sell the land to you for peanuts. My wife
and I have bought lots of land under exactly these conditions.
WHY NO "FOR SALE" SIGN?

Probably a good portion of land in the USA outside of cities is in an
"Estate." That means that some heir to Uncle, Dad, or Grandpa lives a
long way off and is busy with their lives. They never took the time to
find a local Realtor and don't know who to call. Thus the land and
often the empty house or farm just sits. Once you research them, and
write to them you'll soon be talking on the phone for a deal.
YOUR LETTER TO THEM MUST BE SIMPLE

On the next page you'll see a copy of my famous letter that I send to
the owners of record of properties that I am interested in. It's
simple and does not bind you to a deal. Use it with my best-wishes. My
wife and I have bought many parcels from either foreclosures or
absentee owners or estates. It's the only way to get a deal. If the
local Realtor has the land listed you will not be able to buy on your
terms in most cases. Why? Because the Realtor has given the owners a
"fair market appraisal" and the owners have a price fixed in their
mind. Much better to buy from owners who are desperate to get rid of
that "crummy land in County XXXXX where our goofy Uncle Earl used to
live." When you pay them "nothing" it will confirm to them that Uncle
Earl was indeed goofy! They will all sigh and be happy that they found
another fool. No, I'm not kidding. This is especially true of heirs
who live in big cities a long way off.

If you find that you are really interested in the property and the
land taxes are unpaid for several years you would be wise to pay the
taxes. If the owners do not redeem the land by paying you back after a
certain length of time you can continue to pay the land taxes and
eventually own the property for just paying the back and current
taxes. Many estates lose track of the land and simply don't care. We
have bought land real cheap by first buying up three years of back tax
certificates. Even if the owners do not sell to you the tax
certificates earn you interest you will never get at a bank. Make sure
you want the land that you buy the certificates on. There is a lot of
marginal or "junk land" that owners don't want and will be happy for
you to get for paying the back taxes. Be wary of old gas-stations or
country stores that may have buried fuel tanks underground or other
toxic environmental nightmares for you! Some old farms have dumps
buried that are also "super-fund" sites. Check with the county agent
and be sure that the land is "clean" and there are no toxic dumps or
hidden tanks for you to have to pay to clean-up. This is a bigger
problem than you would ever imagine. Once I almost bought a building
that had tanks buried that were 30 years old. It would have cost me
five times what the real-estate was priced at to clean up the
environmental mess. No matter if the situation is true or false you
will be under the watchful eyes of bureaucrats that could care-less if
you go broke. Watch out. Best bet is to get an "environmental audit"
before you sign a contract to buy the deal. Cheapest money you will
ever spend. Again, the county agent may know.
THE LETTER

To: (Owner of record at the tax office)

(Address, City and State)

Dear Sir or Madam:

My family has an interest in purchasing a piece of property in the
general area where you own some land. According to the local records
the legal description of your land is:

(Legal Description)

If you are interested in selling the land to us please state your
price and terms. This letter does not constitute a contract to buy the
land but is only a request for more information. Hopefully we can deal
direct and save you and us the various fees normally paid to others.
If we agree on a price and terms we will have the local title company
handle all papers. You can call me evenings and weekends at the number
below. Thank you in advance for a prompt reply.

Sincerely,

Your Name,

Address and Night phone number.
THE BEAUTY OF "RAW LAND"

"Uncle Elmer" bought this tract of land twenty years ago to build his
retirement home or to start a small farm. Sadly he had a heart attack
and never left the city. No, this story is not far-fetched. Much of
the land that we have bought from an estate has exactly this story.
The estate is delighted to get rid of the land that they have been
paying property taxes on for years.

BEST BET - see what the tax appraiser has placed on the land as to
VALUE. Normally an estate will be delighted to get 80 percent of that
value or less. Best of all, raw land normally does not have any buried
full or empty fuel tanks or dumps. Still, check it all out.
IF NO ELECTRIC POWER IS NEARBY THE LAND IS CHEAPER!

If you get "way out" in the country you may find that there is land
that you want where there are NO POWER POLES. Then check with the
county agent or power company and verify that there is NO POWER in
that area. Such land is normally sold dirt-cheap for exactly that
reason. Make sure you advise the owner that no power is near the land.
It may cost tens of thousands of dollars to get the local utility to
bring power to that site. Thus you have another bargaining tool. My
plans will allow you to live "off the grid" so why pay more for land
where the power may be off anyway! Often the cost of rural land
without power nearby will be so much cheaper that you will save enough
to buy the generators, batteries, propane tanks and water tower.
YOUR SURVIVAL COTTAGE DOES NOT NEED POWER - OR A FLOOD!

The first step is to find the land and be sure it DOES NOT FLOOD. The
county agent will have a map that shows the flood plains. You will be
in lousy shape if the country is in a mess and you are living in a
flood-plain and the place goes under water. Trust me on this. Be safe
and not sorry. My wife and I live on top of a hill and have watched
our neighbors go under water. Be careful and avoid flood land.
YOU FOUND AND BOUGHT THE LAND - NOW WHAT?

My advise is to build as small a cottage as possible to survive in
with your family. You might also consider a repo mobile home but that
has some aspects that I don't like. First, the big advise: The
entrance to your place is off a road that someone else will also be
driving on. My advise is to get a farm-gate from the first day you cut
a driveway into the land. Hopefully it is heavily wooded and you can
cut a drive in the form of a "Lazy S" so that those passing by the
gate cannot look into where you have your house or cabin. If they see
only a gate and just trees and no home they will then drive on by. You
do not want to stand-out. If the property is not wooded then I would
forget it. You need the coverage of the woods. Also remember that if
you buy such land and decide to camp-out on it in a tent you may be
visited in the middle-of-the-night by wildlife that will not be
stopped by your tent canvas. Bears, wild dogs, wild hogs and so forth
may ruin your campsite and hurt your family. Only camp-out in a secure
vehicle such as an enclosed travel-trailer. Wild hogs are about
everywhere in the USA and they eat small animals and can hurt you and
your family. Don't risk it.
WHAT'S THE WHOLE IDEA?

You have to now decide what type of shelter you want to construct or
just move-in. No matter what you do there will be local folks who know
you are there and what you are doing. If this is a very rural county
you may be able to do a lot of things yourself. In such cases a used
and repo mobile home may be the ticket. Just be sure you can get it in
the property. Also check with the county building department and get
the well and septic tank permit. If you build your cabin from scratch
on your rural land you may be able to "ease it in." In short, you buy
the land, cut in the drive and the cabin slowly appears and you make
your own septic tank and drill your own well and nobody sees nothing
from the road. Because you are not asking to hook-up to power that
does not exist nobody cares what you do out there in the boonies. Keep
the gate locked and the taxes may not go up much either. Also check if
there is a "Homestead" provision and if there is be sure to register.
Your local lumber-yard or home supply store like, Scotty's, Lowe's,
Builders Square, Home Depot, etc., will have books on small homes and
cottages you can build. Some even have complete kits with doors and
windows, etc. Or you can design your own using pre-cut standard lumber
so you don't have to cut the lumber and waste much wood. That's how we
build and thus our scrap-pile is very small.
LIVING CHEAP AND USING VERY LITTLE FUEL

From this point on I will explain how I plan to cope with the
potential disruptions and not use up a lot of fuel. I think many of
these ideas are novel and elegant but at the same time you may wish to
expand on them. The entire concept here is to use existing technology
that is low-cost, easy-to-get and very affordable. There are all kinds
of hot-shots that will sell you giant expensive deals costing tens of
thousands of dollars. Well Pardner, most of us everyday folks do not
have that kind of money. This report is written for the good people of
the USA that must cope on a reasonable budget.
PROPANE AND THE GENERATOR

You can spend $50,000.00 on converting a home to full solar. Others
have spent $20,000.00 buying a diesel generator that will handle the
whole house if the power goes off. What they do when they run out of
fuel is another issue. My plan here is for you to buy the land, build
the cabin and prepare it and if possible be below an investment of
$25,000.00 or less. This makes sense as new cars cost more and have no
chance of appreciation where real-estate does. The reason for using
propane to power your generator is that it does not go bad over time
when stored. Diesel fuel does not store well in the Southeastern US or
anywhere that heat and humidity are present. There is a fungus that
grows in diesel fuel and it can turn nasty and gloppy. I have owned a
diesel car since 1982 and still drive it. There is a lot of
maintenance on the fuel separators and you have to keep the tank full.
While I am "up to speed" on maintaining a diesel you may not be and if
your fuel tank is full of fungus and glop and then the diesel won't
start. If water got into the system you could lose a fuel pump, and
injector pump. Forget diesel. Gasoline is just about as bad and in my
opinion is highly dangerous to store and pour into a hot generator.
Forget gasoline.
NO TAX ON PROPANE

As propane is not normally a motor-fuel there is normally no road tax
on it from the US Government or State. Often these taxes amount to big
money. While you can sometimes buy diesel without paying the tax
per-gallon you have to have a tax-exemption form and that's more red
tape. Propane is more elegant by the minute when you look at all the
dynamics.

For the "survival cabin" I would immediately get at least 1,000
gallons of propane in two or more tanks. My advise would-be to buy two
inexpensive electric generators such as a 5KW and 3KW unit and convert
them to propane. I will provide you with pictures and diagrams here
that basically allow you to do the following:

1. During the day you run one of the generators for an hour or two to
do the basic work that must be done. Run the wash machine, well,
refrigerator, freezer and also charge the batteries.

2. You will build an elevated water tank that you will fill with the
well and pump during generator "on-time" and then gravity feed the
water into the cabin all night long and perhaps the next day or so.
Plans are in this book to do that elegant or cheap.

3. Using two deep-cycle RV/Marine 12-volt storage batteries you will
charge them with the generator and then use a small 140 watt inverter
to provide power overnight for small fluorescent lights, a small TV
and satellite receiver or radio. When you go to bed and shut off the
TV and Satellite receiver you can run a small personal fan if you want
during the summer. Other than that, make sure you have great
ventilation.

4. If you must "open and shut" a refrigerator a lot then get a big one
and a freezer that you will power during generator "on-times" and then
don't open them when the generator is off. During those times you
might get a tiny counter-top model that the inverter can run off the
batteries all night. Watch the wattage and power- consumption. You can
also get propane-powered refrigerators but they are often rather
expensive. Another idea is to freeze water in 2-liter bottles and use
them for ice in a Styrofoam chest and drink the ice water when the ice
melts. Never use one gallon plastic milk jugs as that plastic is
biodegradable and will fall to pieces.
SOLAR POWER

I suggest the Alpen Solar lantern we sell as it is versatile, puts out
a lot of light and makes sense. Other than that solar is still pricey.
Explore and do what you want but I do not feel that you will be
delighted with the cost of the solar panels and the actual output. Go
for it if you like but make sure you realize the limitations of just
solar power unless you are willing to spend serious money. One source
is J.C. Whitney automotive in Chicago, Illinois. Also RV dealers have
"portable small solar packages" that will allow limited light and a
radio at night. Just remember that the hazy and cloudy days do not
bountiful solar power make. I would rather have two or three cheap
propane-converted generators. Used wisely they would run for two years
on 800 gallons of propane.
HEATING THE CABIN

When you build your cabin consider using 2x6 lumber for the exterior
walls. Why? First the structure is stronger and will withstand higher
wind-loads and you can use more insulation than normal in the walls as
you have extra depth. Be sure to use silver-board and if possible use
the double-foil plastic bubble "Reflec Tec" with the fiberglass wall
insulation and also in the ceiling to increase the "R" value.

The interior of the cabin can be finished a number of ways. My
favorite is using "BLUE BOARD" sheet-rock that is designed to be
coated with a veneer plaster. The joints are taped with special
plastic-mesh joint tape and done quickly. The first coat is applied
and then a finish coat is done with a texture, swirl, or whatever.
It's a good and fast system and used a lot in rural America. The
plaster is a bright-white and can be left natural or painted. If you
paint the interior I suggest a semi-gloss paint as it is easy to
clean. With lanterns and wood heat you may have some soot from time to
time and it wipes clean off semi-gloss but is a mess if you use flat
paint.

This is a system that adds insulation, seals the interior and helps
keep out pests, is fireproof, pleasing to the eye, bright and cheery
and cheap. As you will be using old-technology for heating and cooking
and maybe lighting I suggest that anything you can do to make the
interior fire-retardant is a wise move.

Don't overlook a wood stove and chain saw but be sure you understand
all of the dynamics of wood heat, and the dangers of chimney fires if
you burn too much freshly cut pine. Wood heat fires are nice to look
at if somebody else is cutting and stacking the wood and cleaning out
the ashes the next morning. It's a lot of work but may be a necessary
alternative in some cases. If you go the wood-heat route make sure you
have a good "modern" cast-iron or other metal wood-burning stove that
you can also cook on in a pinch. Don't bother with a fireplace as they
waste too much heat. The free-standing wood stove puts most all the
heat in the cabin and requires less wood and a smaller fire. All this
makes life a lot easier for the family. Be sure that the stove is
setting on bricks or a concrete slab inside and is properly installed
in the house. If you do it yourself make sure you use INSULATED VENT
PIPE that is the correct size for the wood stove.

If you use wood heat you will want to build an inexpensive wood shed
that has a tin roof. You might want to have one bin area for small
kindling wood and another area for cut logs. You will need dry wood to
start and maintain a fire especially during long Winter rains. Be sure
the storage bins are large enough to hold a weeks worth of wood in
case the weather turns real lousy and stays that way.
Setting up the 12-Volt To 110-Volt Inverters

The inverter is a solid-state device that converts 12 volts DC to 110
volts AC. The input of the inverter connects to the batteries and must
be properly connected to the Positive (+) and Negative (-) terminal.
Screw that up and you burn out the inverter. The batteries must only
supply 12 volts. DO NOT WIRE THE BATTERIES IN SERIES. The diagrams and
pictures in this book should do the trick for you. When in doubt have
somebody that knows check it out.

I use two deep-cycle 850 amp-hour RV batteries. They are set-up in
parallel. That means that the RED wire runs from the (+) POSITIVE post
on one battery to the (+) post on the other and then to the center-pin
of the cigarette-lighter plug. The BLACK wire runs from the (-)
NEGATIVE post on one battery to the (-) post on the other battery and
to the outer-ring post on the cigarette-lighter plug.

I used 8-guage wire with battery terminals soldered on. The cigarette
plug wires are also soldered to one end of the terminals. (See
Photo's) I would imagine you could use 10 or 12 gauge wire, but I know
that 8 gauge will allow a good route for the charging cycle. During
charging the battery-charger clips only need to be attached to the POS
and NEG terminals on one battery and the inter-connecting wires will
bring the current to the other battery at the same time. I keep my
dual RV batteries "UP" by using a small 6-amp charger. When I will use
the generator I will be using a much larger charger. UNPLUG the
inverter from the cigarette-lighter/connector during charging. You can
also check the voltage using an inexpensive meter such as you see on
my power bench. If you make light-use of the inverter system and go to
bed early you might be able to run for several days on a full-charge.
Best bet is to write down the load that you are running and how long
you run it each night. You'll soon learn what the capacity is.
A WORD ABOUT FLUORESCENT LIGHTS and ELECTRONIC LIGHTS

You can get 12-volt fluorescent lights from an RV dealer or the RV
section of a large store such as Wal-Mart. DO NOT HOOK THEM TO THE
INVERTER. They are designed to be run off 12 volts straight from the
batteries and no inverter is needed. They will be run on separate
wires if you run them. Also any 12-volt lamp is run straight from the
batteries. The INVERTER is only used to power items that normally plug
into the 110-volt wall receptacles.

There is a type of screw-in 110-volt tube-light made by LIGHTS OF
AMERICA and some other companies. The 100 WATT light-output model puts
out the equivalent of a 100 watt light bulb but only uses 27 watts of
110-volt electrical energy from the inverter. These are actually
ELECTRONIC LIGHTS and not a normal fluorescent. They have small
radio-transmitters built-in that exit the phosphor in a much more
efficient manor. PROBLEM: They will not run below 108 volts and simply
shut-off. If your batteries are low they will not light.

If you simply want the cheapest lights available and are not
interested in 110-volts you can go all 12-volts. This means you use
12-volt lights and also a 12 volt car radio for listening. Unless the
TV runs on 12-volts you will need to use an inverter. Wal-Mart and
K-Mart sell little black-and-white TV's that run on 12 volts for about
$50.00. I have one pictured here that also has a built-in AM and FM
radio. You will need an outdoor TV/FM radio in most rural areas. Use
the Select-Antenna shown to soup-up your existing or "super" AM radio
reception. For best AM reception I suggest a GE SUPER RADIO that are
available in most electronic stores. Don't forget the short-wave radio
also - you'll be glad you have it.

If you go "All Inverter" you will use common extension-cords from the
inverter output to your devices. If you go 12-volt you will have to
connect the 12-volt devices directly to the battery. You can buy or
make-up 12-volt extension cords that have battery clips on one end and
a cigarette-lighter receptacle on the other. If you go "all inverter"
I suggest you buy some little 71/2 watt 110 volt night-lights in case
the batteries get low and the 110-volt fluorescent go off. The night
lights may be dim but you will still have some light.

Another option is running 12-guage wire from the batteries to certain
points in your house. There you would connect 12-volt lights or have a
cigarette-lighter output for an inverter. The problem is that if the
wires are too long the inverter will not operate correctly. Keep it
near the batteries and run power cords inside from it.

Again, you might decide to stay with all 12-volt and run 12-volt
lights, a car radio, CB, and 12-volt TV all off the double batteries.
That's simple but does not allow the use of the electric shaver or
other appliances that normally run on 110. An inexpensive fixture for
12-volt lights is the outdoor style yard-light or the RV light
fixtures than you can easily acquire.
A NOTE ABOUT LARGE RV STORAGE BATTERIES

Make sure you charge and use them in a WELL VENTILATED AREA that is
not near any sparks or flame. Batteries give off hydrogen gas when
active and in a sealed area may explode if you have a spark. I suggest
you connect the battery charger clips to the batteries BEFORE you
turn-on the charger to avoid sparks.

NEVER: Put the batteries on a concrete floor. Keep them sitting on
wood when possible and make sure they don't vibrate off the bench if
your generator is nearby. Don't cook them in direct sunlight and do
not let them freeze. Don't let kids play around them and remember that
if you touch a wire from one post to the other it will glow red hot in
an instant and burn you or flash and explode. These are not toys and
must be respected. Read the instructions and make sure that you only
use distilled water or rain-water if you have to fill them. DO NOT USE
TAP OR WELL WATER EVER.

[BankruptPinoy]

Hub, yes sir, you are right! Barter! Here's something I found about that:

During the Great Depression, my grandfather had a farm, a country
store, a sawmill, a grain mill and a blacksmith shop. Most of his
dealings were by barter. For those in the community, he would saw five
logs and keep the lumber from one. He would grind five bushels of
grain and keep one-fifth of the flour.

Once a month he would load the truck with raw produce, drive to
Harrison and trade it for whatever he needed for the store. His
neighbors took whatever they needed from the store and often paid in
labor or produce. There was little money but everyone was well-fed,
well-clothed and the best of friends.

These kind of people will survive no matter what happens. They will
survive because they can produce what their neighbors need. Not only
will they fill a need in the community, but they will know how to
raise and process most of their own food and barter the surplus.

Yes sir, I know I've posted a lot of info. I'm really just trying to help myself, and in the process, if I can be of service to someone else then I am happy. I appreciate you and your posts.

[twuoo]

It costs money to make money. That is the old adage. Money just doesn't materialize out of nothing. But you also have to know how to take the money you have, in order to make it work for you. There's no easy route to that. If we could make money while we're sleeping, who wouldn't sign up for that!?

The very best thing you can do is invest in education, but do it wisely.

A couple routes that I know of.....

1) become a certified driving instructor. There are always going to be teenagers and adults, who need to learn to drive. Taking that course is very straighforward. You are not required to take any other fluff classes like 'liberal arts' in order to become certified.

2) become an occupational therapist or physical therapist assistant. These are usually only 2 year community college programs. But starting wages can be $15-20/hour. In terms of just committing to 2 years, it's alot of bang for the buck when you start earning.

3) just about anything health field related will be a good bet. Especially if you can focus on the aging population.

For those of you who might not have finished high school....there are programs out there that will actually pay for you to learn a job and earn your GED. That's nothing to sneeze at! Some of the training centers offer pretty high tech instruction.

I feel very blessed in that I feel fairly recession proof in my current profession. I don't know if it will always be like that, but it is this way for now.

My neighbors who aren't as fortunate, are struggling fairly hard. I help them out financially when I have any "extra" to give.

I try to live below my means. I always look for ways to save. I used to be better at doing coupons, but not so much these days.

Turn down your thermostats and throw on a sweatshirt. Spend a little to insulate the windows. Just cut back where you can....

[Genenco]

I try to live below my means. I always look for ways to save. I used to be better at doing coupons, but not so much these days.

Turn down your thermostats and throw on a sweatshirt. Spend a little to insulate the windows. Just cut back where you can....

Yes, good advie from all avenues, but alot right there.."Live BELOW your means" That's probably the key figure in alot of situations.

I remember the slogan "Your neighbor is a millionaire, the reason he is, is because he doesn't show it" Do you REALLY need that Hummer? The latest BMW? The 4 bd room house? When only 2 of you are in it? That 2 week cruise to mazatlan?

Save for the fun later..

I'm embaressed to say, that yes, it's too late (Somewhat) for someone like me to become super rich, but then again, having alot of money ( I did once have $10,000 in a bank account) only seemed to make me incautious and also a bit greedy, but a touch lazy in regards to acquiring more. (Maybe I was a bit bi-polar then...Who knows)

One time I asked my Mother "How did the Rockefellers, Gettys and such become rich?" Her response (Because I KNEW it wasn't true") was "They picked up their socks and cleaned their rooms...yatta yatta "

Nothing about investing, using child labor, sneaky tax shelters and outright tax evasion. So in a way, she did teach me about them, though it was something I had to seek on my own for answers.

Problem was, I was well on my way to a financial titanic end anyway...

P.S. One thing I recalled (That's why I edited this) while in MO, was I met a man who delivered newspapers. He was driving a Honda "Element" fantastic gas milage, but his payments were $500 a month. How can you afford that?

"Simple" He said. "I use the tax structure the IRS allows all consumers" He can deduct (After a certain amount) the milage from his driving for work and this was better then 200 miles per day. And on top of that, he earned a hourly wage also.

Deductions. Alot of people laughed when Pres. Bill Clinton issued his Tax Return and listed his shorts as a "Chairitable Deduction" $3 a pair, average 6 pair..Funny? Nope, smart. His ability to squeeze each penny was why he and others (Not too mention sweetheart deals possibly) were not having to struggle each year or monthly.

I knew a lady who LOVED working for her church, but she struggled with her bills...I suggested she look into having her "Work" as a charitiable deduction" sure enough, she got back a bundle of cash for this. Be sure and check with local IRS regs on this, they DO answer all questions for free.

It's the old "Penny wise, pound foolish" that gets us mostly. Change that to "Penny wise, Pound Saving" which is a better way of thinking.

It's not up to the IRS, your Mother or parents or sister or brother who will help you save, you have to at least know you want to and be willing to go the extra mile to do so. The returns make it worthwhile.

[heyu]

Reading your thoughts and ideas was inspiring, I got one good idea that I will implement and for that I must thank you Twuoo, you see this idea works, so come on folks lets keep this thread going, everyone has some thing that someone will find will help them to think and probable use.
God bless you all and all the best for Christmas and the new Year.

[twuoo]

Heyu: There are alot of great minds on this site with alot of wonderful idea.

I've found this site to be indespensible when I was going thru my bk stuff.

People here are so helpful and (mostly) not judgmental.

Don't be shy to ask questions. It's a heck of alot cheaper and less embarrassing than trying to talk to an attorney...

What idea did I throw out that seemed most helpful?

Happy Xmas everybody!