Let's Debate~~Child Support Issues

[Minnymouth]

The issues of child support, custodial rights, my kid, your kid, our kid, touch all of us throughout our lifetime. If not us personally, thru relatives and friends.

We watch others battle in court over rights, money, custody etc.

People move to another state to avoid paying child support etc. Gradually the laws are changing and there is no place they can hide anymore.
We teach our children about "safe sex" because of diseases......... DUH we need to be teaching them about "preventing pregnacy" also!!!!

Back in the 60's and70's a friend of mine (hate to admit it) had 9 children over an 18 year period. These kids had 7 different daddies... (none of whom paid child support).. but yet still "hung around"....

She drew aid from the state of Ohio for all 9 kids.... she worked in her maiden name (drew a cash paycheck in a night club) and her husband also drawed aid from the state of W. Virginia on all 9 kids. They would go visit him once a month, suggesting they lived there!!! Claiming custody of course.
At the 9th kid the state of Ohio said "tie those tubes or no more aid"...... so she had no choice or loose her checks....

This woman lived very comfortably for many years.... a lot better than most of us do or ever will.... She had a big fancy home, new cars, expensive clothes, and whatever she wanted........ All at the expense of you and I.....

When the laws changed and she was "discovered" drawing aid from 2 states, still legally married to her husband (father of 2 of 9), she found herself in a LOT OF LEGAL HOTWATER....... So bad it was a felony......

She was arrested, indided (can't spell) and a court date was set. This ole girl was looking at "time".......

So in the middle of the night, she and her 9 kids disappeared from the face of the earth, leaving everything behind they couldn't carry.....

Last I heard by word of the grapevine, she had remarried shortly thereafter and was drawing from another state....

They have never gotten her for the felony in Ohio years ago...... probably never will.....

Many women "play the system".................

Nowdays, in Ohio if you get state aid you have to give the fathers name....... Aid is limited to 2 kids and 5 years unless disability is involved..... When the kid starts school your forced to go to work to earn you check........
This is probably one of the best laws that Ohio ever passed!!!

I don't believe "deadbeat dads" should go free.......especially x-husbands.

I also don't believe that women should be free to have kid after kid - just to get support or child support... and 5 years down the road drag a man into court who had no idea he even had a child........from a one nite stand!!!

Of course the only way to stop all this is "stop screwing around" and be more responsible when you have sex with a stranger....

Any woman that had kids, draws aid from the state at the time of birth, and will not disclose who the father is SHOULD LOOSE THE RIGHT to come back later and file for back child support.

If a man is responsible for bearing a child, let him go on the birth certificate at birth.......... then hold him responsible for child support - NOT 10 OR 15 YEARS LATER!!! SURPRISE - YOU GOT A KID - PAY ME!!!!!

Our society says - take care of your children. A man can't if a man doesn't know about them.....

Many a home and marriage has been destroyed by a child showing up later in life saying "hello - your my daddy".....

Child support has many aspects and many sides too it...
but the ones that really loose the most are the children......

What a shame!!!!

[lilgoose]

Right now, we are still not sure which way we are going to proceed with this. The thought of paying her "rent" or any other type of money that is not "child" support, is a devastating blow and I can't help but to push and fight this. Anyway, will keep you all posted as things develop.

Now, I have to explain something because I don't want someone to think I am cold-hearted and it is all about the money~well, it is in a way. Hey, only human and a mom to boot....

I grew up with my 3 older siblings. Mom and Dad divorced when I was 6. She got child support ordered. He would pay now and then. My mom refused to allow him to see us (especially me and my bro closest in age) because he was not helping to take care of us. She worked full time as a waitress and went to school full time to become a beautician. All this while on state aid. No more than she absolutely needed. Back then, the father could "hide-out" in Texas and get away with not paying.

She supported us and we turned out fine. It would have been an easier life with the support that he should have been paying, but it didn't happen.

I believe that child support is a very important part of a child's well-being and their quality of life...but, not when the pregnancy was not shared and the child was an unknown factor.

If the woman decides to not let the father know, then she should be made to sign a paper, one that will hold up in the court system in any state, that she has given up all rights to the child's father.

The biggest problem is that a woman can seduce a man, lie to him or use whatever means to get him in bed, then get pregnant. Now, if this man just happens to be very wealthy, that makes the whole thing even sweeter! Kind of like hitting the jackpot!!

Now, I do know that in Ohio, if a man wants to fight getting the DNA test done, the court can actually say that he is the father, even if he doesn't take the test! So, a woman can use this to her advantage and go after this man and take every penny from him that she can get. He is none the wiser until the certified letter shows up at his door.

Can you imagine what his wife would think? I know that I cried so hard for the first weeks. It happened prior to us ever meeting, but it has affected me just like it was after we met.

Child support is a wonderful thing and needs to be in place for kids, but the rules and laws need to change. It is so damaging to more than just the kid in question.

My husband found out this morning that the one kid could get up to $125 a week for support, but, yet, if I was to file separation and go for child support for my TWO, I would only get about $150!! To raise two kids on!

I guess I get to feed mine peanut butter (cheap store brand) while she feeds her filet mignon!

[Minnymouth]

LILGOOSE,
I can feel where your coming from........

And yes, there have been many women that raised kids without child support and the fathers do not know they have kids....... These women can be proud of their efforts!

Child support is very important. But the way our society is designed right now a man's second wife and kids pay the high price of his first marriage......

A first wife can remarry, draw child-support, work, have her husbands paycheck and live very comfortable.

A man can remarry, pay child-support, work, and struggle to make ends meet.

Me, personally, it DOES MY HEART GOOD to see a woman have to pay child-support.....

These days more and more often you see men raising their children.

Some women want the child-support but not the responsibilty of the child...

Yes a man should pay child support for his offspring. But he should also KNOW ABOUT THEM from the beginning. Not as an after thought!

Most men may not be really happy about unknown offspring, but most will take on the responsibility. But I too think if their not told, they should have the option of giving up parental rights when the issue is brought up years down the road....

Yes many of the new laws and old laws need to be redesigned...........

Really no-one wins, everyone looses in this situation!!

[aoccc]

I love paying child support, i just get pissed off when i pay 1/2 the daycare and 1/2 my check goes to the ex but yet i get no tax credits.

[edwards2]

aocc - ditto. We figured we paid out more than $150,000 in child support and were taxed on what we paid her. My husband's ex was all about the money...if we really believed she spent it on them it might be a different story but we knew better.

I totally agree with Minny about the wife/mother paying. If the dad has to pay then so should the mom if she is not the custodial parent. Too often it isnt so much about the money but the control that comes with it. Knowing my husband and I had to work 2 jobs to cover the increase in child support did not bother her a bit and in fact until the bitter end of the child support she tried to convince the judge to force us to put money in a college fund for the boys. They all had scholarships and lived at home so there were no college expenses and the judge told her just that. He also reminded her he was ruling on the child support; and it was done. We could have closed the case on the child support, not had to go to court and not have to pay an attorney but she chose to stick it to us one more time and forced us to end it in court. I still believe what goes around, comes around and it cant happen soon enough for me.

[SinkingFast]

I feel so blessed not to have to deal with this.

The first time our kids got an up close and personal look at custody and visitation, thru neighbors across the street, they thought is was kewl. Two moms, Two dads, two homes, one spoiling them like crazy giving them anything they wanted. Kids could play parents off each other. My kids were jealous. Until non custodial Dad went off the deep end and took the kids. He got them for the regular visit and didn't return them. Dad went to a different Court, had the visitation and custody declared null and void, and just kept the kids. It took our neighbor months to get the kids back.

Now it wasn't so kewl. Our kids were young enough it was scarey. Being taken away from their home and not being able to come back home. Not being able to see Mom and Step Dad, who were the foundation of their regular world. It was the best lesson our kids could have ever learned about the pains of living in a yours, mine, and ours group of families.

It only got uglier from there and made our kids happy to have one home with one set of parents.

While the adults are battling and playing their little games, the kids see all this and the kids are the ones caught in the cross fire. While mom may be financially screwing dad, and dad's new family, all the kids, of both parents, of the divorce are victims as well, in their own ways.

[Minnymouth]

Makes me think of an incident in our family.....
My brothers both married women that had children. One a widow, the other divorced with kids. They have both been happily married for over 30 years and all kids are grown, now grand kids, and great grand kids.

My oldest brother married a woman with 3 kids, and they had none of their own. My youngest brother married a girl with 2 kids and had 3 more of their own.

My youngest brother raised her two boys from birth, plus their own three. He loved them all and treated all the same.
Her 2 boys drawed SS off of their dad (he was disabled). When one of her boys turned 14 his real dad promised him EVERYTHING........ so the boy wanted to go live with his dad... Since the boy was hard to handle at times, the decision was made - if you live with your real dad, YOU WILL STAY TILL YOUR 18. No coming back!! My brother and his wife made it perfectly clear.... and turned over complete custody to the real father. Less than 2 months later the boy realized the only reason his real dad wanted him was for the SS check he drew each month... What a blow to a child... My brother and his wife tried to tell the boy that but he was head strong and defiant...
Well, so be it, the boy had to stay and live with his dad till he was 18 and could go out on his own. HARD LESSON LEARNED. He wanted to come back to my brother's and his real dad said NO............. So the boy was stuck till he was 18 and nothing he could do about it....
Needless to say, he was a troubled teen, stayed in trouble, never finished school, and was very luck he didn't end up in jail or prison.

Now instead of being a strong, sensible young man with high values, morals, good work ethics like his brother, he is a 30 year old bum like his dad, lives off women, has kids he won't support, etc...

He tells my brother, he did it to himself, no hard feelings toward his step dad (my brother).... but still the boy (30) won't change his lifestyle... and will live his life this way..

Shame!!!

At 10-12-14 a child has the right to decide which parent they want to live with according to the courts. What happened to the court deciding which parent would be the "best home" for the child? This is a bad change in the laws..... resulting in a bad outcome for a lot of kids...

My thoughts

[lilgoose]

From the Ohio Gov site:

The Office of Child Support is dedicated to improving the lives of Ohio's children.

Now, with this statement in mind.....

How is it going to IMPROVE the lives of our two children by giving over $5000 a year to a woman who did not want any type of support, let alone letting the father know that he was a father to begin with?

This $5000 a year will more than likely make our two children lose the roof over THEIR head.....But, hey as long as the money goes to ANOTHER child (who was an unknown factor for over 13 years now), then it is all OKAY.

My children will suffer because of her choice. This child's father will now face even harder financial times than what put him in bk to start with. BUT that is OKAY as long as this unknown child gets to eat STEAK everynight while the two children that he had and has support for all those years, eats HOT DOGS. (Are those allowed on food stamps?)

As for the child getting to choose, yes, I do believe that the child has some say in that matter. BUT, it is also up to the judge as to whether or not it is granted. A friend of my husband's just went thru the child custody battle and HE won it! But, the youngest of the 3 (he is 11) wanted to stay with his mom. The judge said it was fine EXCEPT with lots of restrictions that both the mom and the son has to follow or the order will be revoked.

I really hate to see the kids get put in the middle of all of it. Right now, we don't know what this child has been told about her father. IF she has been told anything! We don't know. We don't know her middle name. We don't know what color of hair or eyes she has. This is because the court has allowed the mother to call all the shots.

So, right now, it is not about the child....It IS about the money and the woman who wants it. If it comes down to it, and I pray that it don't, then the child will be able to come into our home and she will know nothing about my feelings or any one elses in this house. I know that it is not her fault and she is an innocent in all this, but I know that she will be a constant reminder of the problems that has been caused in our marriage and with our own children.

It is an emotional situation that we are dealing with and I am ready for it to go away......

At this time, we are going to work on releasing the present atty and retain a new one....Just going to take some time to get this done. Keeping our fingers crossed that we have this time to do this.

[Minnymouth]

The sad part about it all is the child is probably more "scared" then anyone.....
Here this child is being used like a pawn by her mother, fixing to meet and unknown father, and his wife and his other children..... Kids are so insecure anyways, and a child in this position is bound to be absolutely scared to death..... especially a young teenager...
Under the circumstances, if you all do make contact with this child, I hope God "guides" your minds, your hearts and your actions while dealing with this situation...
In our society a "unwanted" child is a "unloved" child that can turn into a sad, very unhappy adult full of hate and anguish... and the sad part its not the childs fault either...

Hang in there, it all may turn out better than you think down the road..... no one every knows..... sometimes things like this are a "blessing in desquise" and we never know about it till later...

[lilgoose]

Update on the "Child Support Issue"

Well, it has been awhile, but finally have some news (not so good) to share.

We retained a new attorney and he is so lost and baffled by this whole thing that he is amazed it went as long as it did! A year and a half...

Gets confusing, so bear with me and try to follow along....

Dec 05, there was a hearing date that my hubby went to thinking that it was going to make "official" him being the father and to order him to add the kid on his health insurance, which is the only thing that was wanted for the previous year. He wasn't allowed in the hearing room, according to his ex-atty, so he had no idea what really went on. Atty came out after the hearing and told him that nothing happened and to go on home. No word from this atty until the end of Jan when DH called him to see if there was any changes yet. Oh, little did we know that there was lots of things that had happened and was beginning to happen....She had asked for child support at the Dec hearing. When her atty told her that she would have to give him certain rights, she backed off and said she wanted him to have nothing to do with the kid and she wanted nothing from him. So she and her atty start schemming and come up the following way to get her some money and not give him any rights in return:

Back at the end of Jan, the "mother" brought a proposal to DH's old atty. Who finally let DH know what it even existed. It was, at that time, to pay HALF of 2 months rent that she was behind and continue to pay HALF her rent until Oct '06 (she is going back to school to better herself). No mention as to any other details such as the amount of rent, etc. This was her way of getting money out of DH without giving him any of the rights he would have as a father.

Had a pretrial hearing last week...mainly to get the new atty up to speed on what is going on. It turned into a mess. This proposal was brought up again by her atty. DH's atty wasn't given the same stuff as the original proposal, but didn't know it. Her atty made it sound so great and that she would be willing to not go after him for ANY type of back, present and future financial support if he would do this one time deal. She still made it perfectly clear to the majestrate that she wanted him to have nothing to do with the kid (remember that she NEVER told him about this child until she had a financial problem when the child was 12 1/2 years old! Yes, she could have found him and let him know at any point in those 12 years, she chose not to)

Oh, for those who are just coming into this, DH is a VERY RESPONSIBLE person/father. He takes care of his children and would have done right by this woman and taken care of the child from the very beginning (I wasn't around when he was dating her, we didn't know each other when this happened) BUT she never told him she was even pregnant. She went to another town to have the baby so that the announcement wasn't even in the local paper. No father's name on the original birth certificate. He has always lived within 25 miles from her. No contact for all these years. He hasn't even seen her since he broke it off with her, not knowing that she was pregnant.

Found out that she thought he had all kinds of money and that she could get her hands on some because she had the kid. What a great way to teach morals to an impressionable child. That is so funny because we filed ch 7 bk 3 months before she heard this! DH's atty set her straight on that account. And, a no assest bk to boot!

Okay, back to story......

So, DH agreed to the proposal thinking that it was the same one as the other atty wanted him to pay her back rent and future rent and she agreed to not go after him for $$$$. So, now comes the fun stuff. After he gets home and dumps this all on me.......That was a long 3 days since...a lot of things start being questioned!!

So, we finally talk about this and a lot of things aren't adding up.....First of all, back in Jan 06, she was only a couple months behind on rent, which only takes us back to Dec 05. Something as serious as being behind on rent, you are not going to say a couple months and mean more than 2 months...you aren't going to say behind a couple of months and mean 4 months, esp when there is a kid involved.

Well, this proposal is actually now, in April, for SEVEN months behind, which takes us to October 05. And, this is at a cost of $3150! This is for 100% of her back rent! Now, what isn't adding up is that Oct 05 was when the results came back from the DNA test proving DH to be the father! So, we have gone from a couple of months behind to 7 months behind (which would really be only 5 months if she was really behind a couple in Jan) and to the same month that he was proven???? She is scamming both him and the court system!

So, instead of it being, her rent is $450 a month, 5 months behind at half, $1125.00, it is now 7 months at 100% full rent for $3150. PLUS, starting May 1, $225 a month for the next 6 months.

Okay, yes that is a short time and we are glad that it is...But I am unable to work due to an injury and receive no compensation for it, which is why we filed Ch7 in the first place. He is supporting me and our 2 children on his one income. You all now how hard that is when you are middle class and trying to live on one income. So, four of us lives on his paychecks..which is paycheck to paycheck every week. Always had a little extra left at the end of the week and could let our kids do the things they really like doing, like baseball and soccer. No, kids aren't spoiled, but they do need to have some type of physically active activity that involves other children.

So, he now has to come up with an extra $750 a month for the next 6 months! So, we are now in the process of filling the atty in on how different things are from the original proposal and he is checking into why there is such a descrepency.

I guess this money will be court ordered as child support, but DH still has no rights! She is using this money as BLACKMAIL! If she was to go after back support and win, she could walk away with over $60,000 plus the next four years!

I just am at a loss here. We will do all that we have to keep our heads above water and keep the credit building happening. I am trying to figure out some ways to make extra money to help out, but working from home is such a risky business these days. Don't know what is a real job from a scam.

We will survive one way or the other.....Really want to finance our house out of land contract and this is our only motivation to pinch pennies where we don't have them....

We will live on peanut butter without jelly while she eats steak for the next 6 months!

[confusedinVA]

First allow me to apologize for bringing up this old post. I have just been reading a lot of the older stuff trying to find some answers when I ran across this post. This post hits really close to home for me because I am in a similar situation, but on the other side of the fence.

I have a son who is 11 years old. He has never met his father. When his father and I were dating, I suspected that I was pregnant and told his father. His father kind of giggled and told me that there was no way this was his child because he was sterile. I knew he was for sure the father as I had not been with anyone else while with him. So, thinking this was his way of getting out of being a daddy, didnt see him again. As my son got older, I realized, even though he has a fantastic step-dad, that he needed to know his biological dad and his side of the family. My son deserves that. He also deserves to have his bio dad financially support him. So I filed for child support. Needless to say, his bio dad is very upset. He was contacted by child support services and asked to submit to 2 dna tests which he refused both. They then subpoenaed him to court where he was ordered to take a dna test. We go back to court in November. I am not seeking retro child support. The judge said that he will order retro support from February of this year, which is when child support contacted him until November.

Anyway, his bio dad contacted me when he received the subpoena asking what was going on. I explained things to him. He told me again that there was no way this was his child as he was sterile. He said he had married 2 different women and tried to have children, no luck, he is sterile. He says that he has also tried with his current wife and was unsuccessful, again he is sterile. He told me he is going to sue me for forcing him to take a dna test if the child is not his, or he will sue me for withholding this information for so long. My point to him is, he knew that I thought I was pregnant. I honestly thought the whole, "I'm sterile" line was to get out of support obligations.

I feel terribly guilty, not only for my sons sake but for bio dad. Had I known that he honestly wanted a child, I would have told him from the beginning that I was indeed pregnant. I am not doing this for child support as I have done this long without it. All of these years I have longed for my son to know his real dad.

I do want to wreck anyones lives, I just want my son to know his dad, if his dad wants to know him.

Again, sorry to dig up an old thread but had to get these guilty feelings out in the open.

[Bobby'sGirl]

Will you be past the whole BK process...

...before getting any child support? I wonder if you will have to tell the trustee at your 341 about that anticipated increase in income. That aside, I think you are doing the right thing in trying to bring the biological father into the picture. Trying to second guess decisions made a decade ago will just pile on more guilt. Trying to do the best thing for your child needs to be the motivator for you in the near future. Good luck.

[confusedinVA]

I was originally doing what I thought was the best for him at the time. I honestly didnt think his dad wanted him. I didnt want him to go through that all of his life, having a dad that didnt want him. Please dont try to say that I havent always put my kids 1st in my life because I always have.

I have actually already put the possible child support into the paperwork. I put it in the statement of financial affairs. amount unknown but the case # and hearing date.

[Danielle1981]

Child Support is 100% exempt.

Secondly....No one thinks anything horrible of you. And there is absolutely nothing he can sue your for he's full of it.

Thirdly, go for the back support. It's NOT your money it's your sons money. Put it in a trust fund for him. You told him you were pregnant and he insisted it wasn't his by saying he was sterile. It was his way of putting off responsibility.

[oliveoil]

I just want to say thanks for this discussion on child support issues. I have read this whole thread three times. I am working through some issues just like this and find this extremely helpful. Please keep the input going.