1st mortgage solved, here is the deal on the second

[Lajazz947]

Update:
Spoke to GMAC this morning. I offered them a 5% buyout of the lien. They came back instantly at 10%. Telling me it is a great deal, etc etc. I told them they will get far less from a JDB or litigating. That the debt is basically an unsecured loan which I can BK. Said I would think about the 10%, but we need to get closer to 5%...

Hey, I like to think that I negotiate well but you take the cake my friend.

I am kind of in the same situation. If you read my posts I have WACHOVIA and WF fighting over who is in first position.

You have given me inspiration.

Good luck.

[joecitizen]

albacore44...

...I was watching court records for him...

I am in riverside, california how do i go about watching court records here? thx

[spidge]

Thinking out loud.

I wonder if one solution could be that the lien holders of the 1st and 2nd could write down an equal amount and become equal partners in this so that both could benefit in the long run. I am struggling with how to put it into proper terms but they could become one lien holder in a partnership with the borrower having only one loan to pay on, but both partners gaining the interest revenue over time from one lien.
I know some of the government programs leaned towards something like this but I think it may have been miss-applied therefor not utilized.

Just a thought.

[frankies_mom]

Anyone in this thread have any experience with JDB on 2nd mortgages. CITI didn't work so well with us and United Guaranty bought it up in the middle of a loan mod. So our 2nd is paid in full and off CITI's books but we are now dealing with collections. Any probability of settling with them? If we were to sell our house today, it would just cover the 1st mortgage, 2nd would get nothing if that is helpful info. Also, we are post BK7 and did not reaffirm either mortgage. Any advice on getting them to negotiate would be greatly appreciated.

[spidge]

Anyone have updates on thier efforts for the 2nd's?
BofA keeps calling and I ask them what they would do but they stay with the script and always respond with "are you planning to pay some time in the future?".
It seems by most of the posts here the borrower instigated the settlement offers. Is that what I need to do to get them to start offering me something?

Also one of the posters mentioned settling with payments within a year. Wouldn't that be admitting to the ability to make a payment?

If I were to settle with the 2nd over time, would the payments be considered prefered payment and put the BK at risk of abuse issues?

[spidge]

Interesting.

BofA has taken over the Countrywide home loan links. I signed in to check the status of my modification file for my heloc and it now states that it is in active proccessing.
Time will tell, but I am looking to pay my attorney by the end of this month to file ch 7 and I plan to offer the owner of the heloc a 5% settlement.

[spidge]

Thanks for the links, but if I read them correctly it only helps those that qualify for any of the current government backed programs?

Again, I'm out.

[albacore44]

There is no true plan to help those of us underwater. There is lip service and token plans to help a few homeowners.

Many home purchases originated in the last decade were either 80%/20% loans or 80%/15%/5% type purchases. The first mtg is in great shape.

The plan is this:
1) homeowner goes into default, lender has mortgage insurance on the property (either paid by homeowner or lender paid blanket insurance),
2) lender may 'offer' to work with homeowner, lender ends up foreclosing in most instances (in our area more than 90% of the time the foreclosure is completed rather than worked out),
3)lender collects 19% to 35% of the original mortgage balance from MI depending upon policy
4) lender puts asset (property) on market and sells for current FMV

Steps 1 -4 are well documented.

So the first mtg got FMV + 19% to 35% of the originating loan amount pd from MI policy and is in usually very good shape.

Second mtg gets the MI policy only. I suspect that these 2nds also were hedged thru that credit default swap policies that have been paid out now at 100% thru AIG. (FWIW I don't have hard evidence of what is happening with the 2nds yet).

If the lender writes down the 2nd $200k then they do not qualify for the MI payout.

I hope that Relief and others qualify to get the 2nd written down - or paid off as planned. I would rather see the current homeowner be able to stay in their home, pay 10% on the 2nd, get the lien released and have the 2nd collect on whatever MI policy is in place. This will be the only way be can begin to truly recover. I don't see any of the lenders doing this for a large percentage of the upside down homeowners as a matter of policy. JMO.

And that's just the thing..........none are writing down principal. Guess I can understand their reasoning. If the 2nds are in fact collecting on the MI policy, then it seems it might be a better deal for them to let the homeowner default, then collect the MI, and sell the rest off to a JDB. I am probably going to go the route of BK but keep paying 1st and 2nd, then stop paying 2nd and roll the dice and try to settle with the JDB for a lein release.

[StartingOver08]

There is no true plan to help those of us underwater. There is lip service and token plans to help a few homeowners.

Many home purchases originated in the last decade were either 80%/20% loans or 80%/15%/5% type purchases. The first mtg is in great shape.

The plan is this:
1) homeowner goes into default, lender has mortgage insurance on the property (either paid by homeowner or lender paid blanket insurance),
2) lender may 'offer' to work with homeowner, lender ends up foreclosing in most instances (in our area more than 90% of the time the foreclosure is completed rather than worked out),
3)lender collects 19% to 35% of the original mortgage balance from MI depending upon policy
4) lender puts asset (property) on market and sells for current FMV

Steps 1 -4 are well documented.

So the first mtg got FMV + 19% to 35% of the originating loan amount pd from MI policy and is in usually very good shape.

Second mtg gets the MI policy only. I suspect that these 2nds also were hedged thru that credit default swap policies that have been paid out now at 100% thru AIG. (FWIW I don't have hard evidence of what is happening with the 2nds yet).

If the lender writes down the 2nd $200k then they do not qualify for the MI payout.

I hope that Relief and others qualify to get the 2nd written down - or paid off as planned. I would rather see the current homeowner be able to stay in their home, pay 10% on the 2nd, get the lien released and have the 2nd collect on whatever MI policy is in place. This will be the only way we can begin to truly recover. I don't see any of the lenders doing this for a large percentage of the upside down homeowners as a matter of policy. JMO.

[albacore44]

More info on the Obama 2nd legislation...

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124091319810563169.html

All they did was saw the leggs off the Cram down Legislation. Who do they expect this to help ?? They still have not addressed the fact of those properties that are underwater. Which bank is going to write down $200K in principal on an underwater property ??

[BKINAZ]

More info on the Obama 2nd legislation...

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124091319810563169.html

[eddiep]

Thanks relief!

It only makes sense to adjust the second as well. Hopefully this will help others stay in the homes!

[relief13035]

do you have a link to this information?

eddiep - YOU are the one that pointed me in the right direction with the info you gave me in the PM you sent. I thank you so much for that.

Here's the link to the new info that came out today:

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/afx/2009/04/28/afx6349153.html

[eddiep]

Please check out the Obama plan on 2nd mortgages that came out today. It is encouraging.

do you have a link to this information?

[albacore44]

I am current on my 1st with CitiMortgage. Right now (so I can play the settlement game) I am 2 months behind on my HELOC.

CitiMortgage called me this morning on my cell stating that they have submitted my HELOC proposal, along with my hardship letter, to the settlement negitiator.

Please check out the Obama plan on 2nd mortgages that came out today. It is encouraging.

good luck..........I got my eye on you. I have Citi for my 1st. It is at 4.75% (was 7 yrs., 3 to go) int only option for 10. now when i took that out I thought it was a pretty good deal. but that was when my house was increasing by $200K a year. I would think they would eventually be calling me to beg me to modify, because a loan like that has got to look like a big liability on their books, now the property is upside down. but their gonna be pissed when I BK all their credit cards. we will see