How personal is a trustee allowed to go?

[Lifeslessons]

Hi all! My apologies if this question has been asked previously. (I did look at all the stickys and did a search to see if I could find answers to my question first.)

I filed for Chapter 13 in Oct 2015. My life completely fell apart that year. To summarize, I lost my mother, was trapped in my home because of death threats to my husband, my husband was an abuser, my beloved dog died, I sank into a deep depression where I coped by charging my credit cards and it all ended in divorce - so I had to file for bankruptcy to afford to live on my own. I'm giving the brief history because maybe it will give a better understanding of why the trustee continues to ask for these things?

I've recently had to provide a letter from my therapist that I'm in therapy, what my diagnosis and prognosis are. The next month I had to provide transaction history for all my personal accounts (not bank/cc card - ALL personal accounts - iTunes, Amazon... Even though my bank statements showed I made purchases and the amount, they wanted to see what I purchased - yet none of the purchases were over $100). After that I had to provide all of my perscription medication information and doctor bills/invoices. Now they are asking me to justify why I'm seeing my pain management Doctor using my TRICARE benefits (I'm retired military) versus using the VA hospital (disability). I've been seeing the same Doctor for years and changing to a new doctor with the VA would set my progress back, not to mention I'm comfortable with my doctor and see no reason to leave him. I get they are looking at my expendable income but isn't quality health care a justified expense? My TRICARE copays aren't an outrageous amount. Are these typical requests from the trustees office?

I know this can be a painfully stressful process and trust me, I'm taking responsibility for why I'm in this position (Therapy!) but I feel like each month they are coming up with a new invasive request even after I've provided everything requested within a day of the request. Each month I think hopefully this will be it, yet I still get new requests and I'm so concerned this means they really want to dismiss my case. I also would like to point out that up until the day I filed I never missed or was late on any payment. I really did file so I could afford to live on my own! I'm also paying $1000 a month to the trustee, which is over the percentage recommended for my fixed income. So I'm not trying to short change by any means.

I know each case is different, but I haven't heard of anything similar so I don't have anything to compare this to. My friends say it may be my lawyer failing to do his job. I have caught my lawyer slipping a few times by failing to file documentation I provided to him, but I dont believe he is the one requesting these things. I was fully expecting to have my bank/cc card/taxes/income scrutinized, but I wasn't expecting it to get THIS personally invasive. Any insight anyone has to put my mind at ease would be greatly appreciated. Thank you so much!!

[dmc-2008]

Sorry you had to endure so much at once and sorry for your losses. Personally I think it's too much. They should not need to know what is wrong or what you take. They should just need to see $$$$$ statements. Bills and reciepts for meds, not what kind. Something sounds fishy. Maybe an overly curious law office staff? But just give them $$$$$ info and black out specifics and see if that enough.

But I am no expert and someone will know for sure! Best of luck!

[justbroke]

This would be the first that I read that a Chapter 13 Trustee was so interested in the gory details of a medical condition. I have seen Chapter 7 Trustees dig, ostensibly looking for hidden money and other hidden assets, but this is just too strange.

Perhaps the numbers are not adding up and based on the paperwork snafus from your attorney, it is making it a little more interesting for the Chapter 13 Standing Trustee. From what you write and what I can see, the Trustee seems to think that you are paying for things that you don't need to pay (e.g. paying for TRICARE when you could visit the VA). That's a pretty thorough Trustee -- if you ask me. With sufficient evidence, I wouldn't bother a person who has medical issues; but, alas, I'm not a Trustee.

To put your mind at ease... it's just a numbers game. You are saying that you have all these additional medical expenses and the Trustee believes that they are either a.) over-inflated, and/or b.) temporary (durational). It's not a collateral attack on you; it's an attack on reasonable expense. Just show that you need these expenses and have your attorney fight for you if you need to go to TRICARE. I don't know if it's the case for you and your local VA facility, but TRICARE may provide "quicker" and more reasonable appointments for a person "in pain". (Keep reminding the Trustee that you are in pain, and have a service-connected disability (if that's the case).)

[Lifeslessons]

Thank you so much for the reply justbroke and dmc-2008 I do have service connected disabilities (rated 100%), but the reason I don't use the VA for pain management is what you stated, the quality of care. I do use them for other areas of medical necessity, but I've had the same pain doctor for so many years and I've worked so closely with them to maintain a manageable level. My issues are definitely on going (10 years, 3 spinal surgeries, countless procedures) and the thought of starting over with doctors that don't have the same level of care is very disheartening. I have willingly provided everything the trustee is requesting, it just feels very personally invasive. I understand they are there to look at the numbers, but I'm not sure what my prescription medications and letters from my therapist have to do with numbers exactly or pouring over every purchase the last 6 months that were already reflected on my bank and cc statments? As for the pain management issue, I have provided documentation that can attest to how much I've paid annually for their care and what I asked for in my budget is spot on - nothing extra. If I were asking for $1000/mo I could see it raising a red flag, but asking for one area of care outside of the VA for my quality of life I didn't believe was an unfair request. It has been my actual expense for the last 5 years, it's not a new addition to my expenses.

I'll just keep hoping this will satisfy whatever they are looking for and either confirm or dismiss my case. At this point I'd be fine with either just to get a break from having to divulge so much personal information. It's embarrassing enough to have to admit you need to file, adding to it the exposure and scrutiny of your finances... everything else they've asked for on top of it has been unnerving to say the least. I really, really appreciate your insight though!! Thank you!

[justbroke]

A numbers game. The Trustee is entrusted with protected the unsecured creditors and to maximize what those creditors receive in a Chapter 13. I would just inundate the Trustee with whatever documentation they desire so that I could keep my provider of care in place. Make sure that your attorney understands that this is service-connected and you care about your well-being and quality of care. Make sure your attorney stands up and fights for you. I would stress that since these are not "new" expenses but ongoing and necessary expenses. There are always exceptions for necessary expenses albeit difficult to prove.

I think you're on the right path. Yes, it's invasive, but you're trying to prove special circumstances ("additional necessary expenses"). If it gets too personal, relay that to your attorney and ask that certain medical information should remain medically confidential under HIPPA and that there must be a better way to satisfy the Trustee's inquiry. (And I could be totally wrong and the Trustee may be allowed to request "any" document in order to administer the case.)