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In lieu of paystubs...

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  • In lieu of paystubs...

    If I'm to start gathering info now in anticipation of filing (maybe) but the payroll lady at my husband's work won't make copies or give printout of last 6 months pay, would copies from our credit union showing his direct deposit every week count?

    Also, if I've been collecting unemployment would that work for me to if it's been direct deposited or should I call the Emp. Security Commission and ask for copies.

    I assume unemployment benefits counts as income for the last 4 months I've been on it?

    Thanks in advance!
    Chapter 7: filed 1/30/08
    341 Meeting: 3/05/08 Uneventful!!
    Last Day for Objections: 5/05/08
    DISCHARGED!!!: 5/07/08

  • #2
    Originally posted by HAP View Post
    If I'm to start gathering info now in anticipation of filing (maybe) but the payroll lady at my husband's work won't make copies or give printout of last 6 months pay, would copies from our credit union showing his direct deposit every week count?

    Also, if I've been collecting unemployment would that work for me to if it's been direct deposited or should I call the Emp. Security Commission and ask for copies.

    I assume unemployment benefits counts as income for the last 4 months I've been on it?

    Thanks in advance!

    You will need actual payroll stubs showing tax deductions and other deductions taken out of his pay (gross to net). Yes you will have to provide the amounts you have received for unemployment. If you are having taxes taken out of your unemployment, you will need to show the gross amount comparied to what they deposit. If you are not having taxes deducted, all you need is the amount received and when.
    _________________________________________
    Filed 5 Year Chapter 13: April 2002
    Early Buy-Out: April 2006
    Discharge: August 2006

    "A credit card is a snake in your pocket"

    Comment


    • #3
      Thank you. Ugg, I was afraid of that, this lady at his work can be a real pain in the butt when it comes to doing anything more than the bare minimum at times.
      Chapter 7: filed 1/30/08
      341 Meeting: 3/05/08 Uneventful!!
      Last Day for Objections: 5/05/08
      DISCHARGED!!!: 5/07/08

      Comment


      • #4
        HAP, I doubt you're the first person who has ever had difficulty getting these docs together, so don't worry.

        First, begin keeping his stubs now. You indicated you were preparing to file, so you can at least have them available for the period of time from now until you actually file. And yes, go ahead and get copies of your unemployment, since you have the option as well as the time for them to mail them to you. I know it's a pain in the keister, but you'll be glad you took the trouble. It's one less thing you'll lack.

        Secondly, have your husband stop by Payroll one day at work. It may be that they won't give YOU the paystubs, but have no problem giving them to him. He could also try the benefits people or a manager in HR.

        If that still doesn't work, I would write a letter and send it certified, return receipt requested, to BOTH the Payroll and the Human Resources department (even if they're both only one-man departments). Find out who the head person is in each of these depts, and address the letter to him or her personally. You'll have your husband sign it, because they are his paystubs, and it will not use your name at all. It would read something like the following:

        ---begin letter---

        Dear Mr. Smith,

        On December ___, 2007, my wife spoke with Ms. Sourface in your payroll department in an effort to obtain copies of my paystubs from July, 2007 through present, as we will need them soon for a specific financial purpose. Unfortunately, Ms. Sourface told my wife that she would be unable to provide those stubs, but could not explain why. On December ___, I stopped by Ms. Sourface's office myself to request the stubs personally, and again Ms. Sourface refused to assist me in any way, or explain why I am not permitted to obtain reprints of my pay stubs for this time period.

        Since I am well aware that our payroll department has this information at hand, and there are no privacy issues involved in reprinting my paystubs and giving them to me personally, or even mailing them to my residence, I am at a loss to understand why they would be withheld from me, especially when withholding them will prevent me from settling some pressing financial matters. I hope that this is not the last word, and that you will be able to respond to this formal request for copies or reprints of my pay stubs from July 2007 through the present. Please let me know what you need from me in order to assist you with processing my request.

        I appreciate your prompt attention to this matter. Sincerely,

        ---end letter---

        If you were to send something like this and still not receive copies/prints of the paystubs, you could at least show the trustee the copy of the letter and the certified mail receipt to indicate that you gave it your best effort. In the light of your inability to obtain the actual stubs they might be able to settle for a substitute document.

        Also, the bankruptcy law itself states 60 days (two months) worth of stubs: that's all you have to come up with to begin your filing. If the trustee wants more, the above proof that you tried should help. Good luck!
        Last edited by FreshLikeADaisy; 12-24-2007, 08:32 PM.
        I am not an attorney. I can give my thoughts, but only YOU can decide what is right for YOU. Even if you have an attorney, you owe it to yourself to learn as much as you possibly can: it's YOUR future, not the attorney's. Know the process yourself!!! Here’s the link to the Nolo Press book on filing Chapter 7, there are others too. (I have no affiliation with Nolo Press; just a happy customer.) Best wishes to you!

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by HAP View Post
          Thank you. Ugg, I was afraid of that, this lady at his work can be a real pain in the butt when it comes to doing anything more than the bare minimum at times.
          That letter to her boss AND the head of HR will *definitely* propel her into helping mode. With a quickness.

          Also, unless your husband actually works in payroll, this is not the kind of request that will come back on him in a bad way. Payroll staff gets paid to fulfill requests like this: that they don't feel like doing it will not reflect badly on your hubby, and they will likely stand ready to help him IMMEDIATELY with any future requests.
          I am not an attorney. I can give my thoughts, but only YOU can decide what is right for YOU. Even if you have an attorney, you owe it to yourself to learn as much as you possibly can: it's YOUR future, not the attorney's. Know the process yourself!!! Here’s the link to the Nolo Press book on filing Chapter 7, there are others too. (I have no affiliation with Nolo Press; just a happy customer.) Best wishes to you!

          Comment


          • #6
            That's a great letter. Unfortunately, it's a family run business and the guy that owns the place (the boss onsite) is I guess human resources also and the one sourpuss lady mentioned above is the entire payroll department and the owner/boss pretty much says what she says goes as far as how she runs that part of the business. If/when the time comes and we need copies of paystubs, I'll ask my husband to ask her nicely, stating we need copies to settle the pressing financial matters as suggested above, if that doesn't work - we can move on to the suggested letter approach (while I start collecting them from now on). He has had to ask her to do things before and she always *****es and says this is the last time she does this, blah blah blah. Like it takes so long to pull out a folder with his name on it and do this. If she were to cut out two of her smoking breaks for the day, she could have this done in no time.

            Thanks again to everyone!
            Chapter 7: filed 1/30/08
            341 Meeting: 3/05/08 Uneventful!!
            Last Day for Objections: 5/05/08
            DISCHARGED!!!: 5/07/08

            Comment


            • #7
              [QUOTE=HAP;129718]That's a great letter. Unfortunately, it's a family run business and the guy that owns the place (the boss onsite) is I guess human resources also and the one sourpuss lady mentioned above is the entire payroll department and the owner/boss pretty much says what she says goes as far as how she runs that part of the business. If/when the time comes and we need copies of paystubs, I'll ask my husband to ask her nicely, stating we need copies to settle the pressing financial matters as suggested above, if that doesn't work - we can move on to the suggested letter approach (while I start collecting them from now on). He has had to ask her to do things before and she always *****es and says this is the last time she does this, blah blah blah. Like it takes so long to pull out a folder with his name on it and do this. If she were to cut out two of her smoking breaks for the day, she could have this done in no time.QUOTE]

              Employers are required to provide a paystub with each paycheck showing breakdown from gross to net as to tax and other deductions. I am assuming he receives them but doesn't keep them which is not a good thing to do because it is always best to keep those to check your W-2 against your paystubs (especially the last paystub of the year) when it comes in for the tax year and which gets filed with your taxes. Mistakes happen and if the business is small can happen very easily if it is a one person dept. His employer probably has that information all online and can just print out the information in a short period of time. If they are backward and do it all by hand, then I can see why there might be a sourpuss in that Dept. if someone is requesting back information.

              Best of luck to you but make sure your hubby gets and keeps all future paystubs for several years especially if you itemize when you file your taxes.
              _________________________________________
              Filed 5 Year Chapter 13: April 2002
              Early Buy-Out: April 2006
              Discharge: August 2006

              "A credit card is a snake in your pocket"

              Comment


              • #8
                HAP, I think you're on the right track. If all the in person requests fail, you can use a milder variation on that letter, sent certified return receipt requested, to the boss/owner. Your husband can soften it by mentioning to him beforehand to expect it, and explain that he had no choice but to send it in order to be able to prove he tried to get copies. If boss/owner presses and wants to know why hubby needs paystubs so badly, make like you're trying to settle a tax claim: you'd have the same need for docs as in bankruptcy, and you might even get his sympathy. No need for details, just say it's a tax matter that dates back some time and is pretty complex. Either way, boss will cough up reprints OR you will have a letter (with proof you sent it) proving to the trustee that you tried.

                BTW, ditto to what Flamingo says. Always keep paystubs, even if you just throw them in the same drawer week after week. Which I actually did for a number of years, and then every so often I would go and sort them out, stapling together each year's worth of stubs. It was easy because if you just throw them in the same place they are already in reverse order. Even just a collapsing file you can stuff them in and then shove behind your dresser is better than nothing.

                Pay stubs are a pain in the keister, but keeping them is less of a pain than needing them, as you are now all too well aware.

                Good luck!
                I am not an attorney. I can give my thoughts, but only YOU can decide what is right for YOU. Even if you have an attorney, you owe it to yourself to learn as much as you possibly can: it's YOUR future, not the attorney's. Know the process yourself!!! Here’s the link to the Nolo Press book on filing Chapter 7, there are others too. (I have no affiliation with Nolo Press; just a happy customer.) Best wishes to you!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by FreshLikeADaisy View Post
                  BTW, ditto to what Flamingo says. Always keep paystubs, even if you just throw them in the same drawer week after week. Which I actually did for a number of years, and then every so often I would go and sort them out, stapling together each year's worth of stubs. It was easy because if you just throw them in the same place they are already in reverse order. Even just a collapsing file you can stuff them in and then shove behind your dresser is better than nothing.
                  Yep. I don't understand how any one can *not* keep their pay stub.

                  And I do what FLAD does as well - toss 'em in a drawer until year's end. And it's only 12 pieces of paper too!
                  Chapter 13 Filed "Old Law"
                  Filed: 6/2003 Confirmed: 3/2004
                  Early pay off sent: 10/05/2007 - 9 months early
                  11/16/2007 - Discharged!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Actually it's 48 pieces of paper since he's paid weekly. Not the point I know, but anyways. Yes the old hindsight thing. Never really thought about it since we've always gotten our W-2's at the end of the year but I guess we'll do better from now on.

                    Thanks again for input
                    Chapter 7: filed 1/30/08
                    341 Meeting: 3/05/08 Uneventful!!
                    Last Day for Objections: 5/05/08
                    DISCHARGED!!!: 5/07/08

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      ...Yes the old hindsight thing.
                      I've been kicked in the ass by hindsight so many times I can't count.

                      Good luck!!!
                      I am not an attorney. I can give my thoughts, but only YOU can decide what is right for YOU. Even if you have an attorney, you owe it to yourself to learn as much as you possibly can: it's YOUR future, not the attorney's. Know the process yourself!!! Here’s the link to the Nolo Press book on filing Chapter 7, there are others too. (I have no affiliation with Nolo Press; just a happy customer.) Best wishes to you!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Correct me if I'm wrong - but is this not a privacy issue? That payroll person received a phone call or letter from supposedly the spouse of an employee. That payroll person plays it safe by NOT sending anything to the one that called him/her - because he/she does not really know that the person who called is really that person.That payroll person probably did not want to gt involved in a possible ID theft event.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I never said I'm the one that asked her, she told my husband (the employee and the one that asked for this information) this.

                          Thanks.
                          Chapter 7: filed 1/30/08
                          341 Meeting: 3/05/08 Uneventful!!
                          Last Day for Objections: 5/05/08
                          DISCHARGED!!!: 5/07/08

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I didn't have all of the 6-months pay stubs, I did find one pay stub from 6-months ago and used my current stub. Simply subract the 6-month YTD from the current YTD and that is your 6-months of pay. That was sufficient enough for me to file the bankruptcy, at least it worked for the lawyer I hired. Then you won't need all stubs within the 6-months just one and your current stub.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Needafreshstart, that's not safe advice because it's written into the law now that 60 days worth of "payment advices" must be available when filing. There's no way around that if HAP isn't as lucky as you were.
                              I am not an attorney. I can give my thoughts, but only YOU can decide what is right for YOU. Even if you have an attorney, you owe it to yourself to learn as much as you possibly can: it's YOUR future, not the attorney's. Know the process yourself!!! Here’s the link to the Nolo Press book on filing Chapter 7, there are others too. (I have no affiliation with Nolo Press; just a happy customer.) Best wishes to you!

                              Comment

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