80 claims filed, only 12 filed a claim!

[papa0881]

I am carefully looking over my ch 13 plan currently I have 80 creidtors listed. Only 12 claims filed!!!??? This is crazy!


Look at this, copied and pasted from website. 13network.com

Number of Claims 80
Total Amount Claimed $41,936.58
Total Amount Scheduled $99,480.69
Total Principal Paid $4,857.86
Total Principal Owed $29,369.65
Total Principal Due $0.00
Total Interest Paid $0.00
Total Interest Due $24.00
Bar Date Thu Jul 12, 2007
Governmental Bar Date Mon Jul 2, 2007


It says $99,480.69 scheduled. But only $41,936.58 Claimed, why do I need to pay the rest of the outstanding scheduled payments whenever they are not even claimed??? Makes no sense to me. My current plan payment is $1065 I am in a 5 year plan.

$41,936.58 / 60 months = $698.94 per month

Why are my payments so much higher then they should be? $700 a month not $1065..... I mean this sounds strange to me! Why in the world am I paying so much more then I should be.

I contacted my attorney he said that is a question for an accountant to answer. Accountant said it sounds like I am to pay $700 not $1065. What should I do, my case is currently held up because it is being dismissed without predudice because I cannot afford to pay $1065 but I could afford $700 a month.

Whats going on here? Has anyone ever seen this before? I can copy and paste whatever info anyone would like to see so they maybe able to figure it out. I do not want to change attornies, he understands my case as I own some business's.

Please advise very lost here.

[papa0881]

Here is how they came up with the amount of $41,936.58

$8,927.80 PA DEPT OF REV priority claim
$981.98 IRS priority
$1128 Yellowbook (advertising) non priority
$19,686.46 IRS priority
$1,463.86 Labor and Industry priority
$1,237.28 Associated Bag Co non priority
$1,689.72 GE Finance non priority
$2,108.61 Recovery Management non prority
$537.27 Midland non priority
$95.03 Asset recovery non priority
$600.13 DEPT OF REV priority
$1,980.44 DEPT OF REV priority
$1,500 Laywer expense priority
--------------------

$41,936.58
dont get this, payment should be $700 a month not $1065, anyone know how this get the $1065???

$99,480.69 scheduled payoff
- $41,936.58 Claimed amount
-------------
$57,544.11 overpayment.

Why should I be responsible for the overpayment above when they did not claim the money? Do they hold the money until everything is discharged and then I would get a refund?

[rrockinggramma]

Your payment won't change but the months you are in the chapter 13 could be reduced, or those who filed a claim could get more than the percentage written into your current plan.

[papa0881]

Well I cannot pay the $1065 I could afford to pay the $700

$365 a month savings would mean a great deal. So you do not think they would reduce the amount? If I filed again would I need to include the 68 others that didnt claim?

[helpsoneeded]

Papa, what kind of creditors didnt file a claim. Just curious...

[Bandit]

$365 a month savings would mean a great deal.

I am not sure they look at it that way in Ch13. They do the same thing they do with Ch 7 & make sure everything you make is going out to pay bills & at the end of each month you have nothing left.

Total Interest Due $24.00

I want to know why do they charge you interest? or why are you paying interest in this?

Well I cannot pay the $1065 I could afford to pay the $700

If you have 1065 a month disposable income I am pretty sure they will use every penny one way or the other. But you are saying you only have 700 left each month?

How can you have 80 Creditors?

It sounds so confusing to me, sorry but it does.

[holding on]

Well I cannot pay the $1065 I could afford to pay the $700

When you say you cannot afford to pay $1065 there has to be something in your plan that is not jiving (at least according to your thoughts). The plan is supposed to take all your income and all your bills and find out what's left and all that goes to bk. is there some bill that's not in the plan? is there extra income that's not supposed to be there? etc.

80 creditors, wow

[253BK]

You need to talk to your lawyer asap! No one on here is going to be able to tell you what is going on! 80 Creditors boy you sure hit them hard!

Talk with the attorney and have him contact your trustee Maybe you will be done paying in 40 months instead???

[MajorMike]

It doesnt matter how many filed OR the amount, you would still pay the same which is your expendable income. If your attorney didn't include all of your expenses, then he needs to file an amendment to the payment. Are you at 100% payback????
Our creditors so far claimed $33K but are only getting paid 5%. You're not figuring this out correctly anyway. They don't divide what you owe by 60 mos.

[papa0881]

See we opened up a subway franchise, used the landscaping money to fund the subway franchise, subway went broke so did landscaping because subway took all of the landscaping co money.

80 creditors, ALOT of collection agencies. Only the IRS, State and a few others filed claims, the rest didnt. 80 creditors, meaning 80 creditors were put on the bk, about 20 of them are duplicates.

How do they figure out your payment?

[stljohn]

apparently a lot of creditors chose to write the debt off then belly up to the trough. only 4 of 12 claimed on me.

I was in 13 and frankly have no clue how they determined payment other then it has less to do with the amount owed then with how much you can pay after basic required expenses are deducted from your income.

[Bandit]

After you figure your living expenses (& I would go as high as I could in all those areas) then what ever you make that is left will go toward the BK payment. Every Ch13 is different though the basic idea stays the same.

Like this in a simple terms

Monthly income-2,000
Living expense- 1,000

BK payment-1,000

but then if it cost you 1500 to live on each month then the BK payment would only be 500.

I am pretty sure that is the basic idea behind it. They will also be rounding out what you owe based on a percentage of what you really owe...but that percentage is also based on what you have left over each month too.

What stinks about 13 is some people could end up paying back 100% of what they owe, but the good part is all those interest rates & penalties wont exist any more.

I don't know much about Ch13, but from all that I have read that is the simple man term LOL!, that I understand it by. So, if you are wanting to have some kind of savings in this, dont count on it unless you can really juggle the living expenses & try to keep as much of your income as possible.

To me, Ch13 is very difficult for some jobs to figure out. for example people who work for tips- I just don't see how they determine that because waiters do not make the same every month like a salary paid job.
Or other people may work 30 hours one week & only 20 hours the next week. Roofers also do not get paid the same year round because often there is no work at all in the winter.

Sorry about the muddly luck with subway & the landscaping business, really I am.

How do they figure out your payment?

I guess we are going to figure that out here real soon with you

[Bandit]

apparently a lot of creditors chose to write the debt off then belly up to the trough. only 4 of 12 claimed on me.

I was in 13 and frankly have no clue how they determined payment other then it has less to do with the amount owed then with how much you can pay after basic required expenses are deducted from your income.

That is exactly the way it works. You explained it much better than I.

[rrockinggramma]

I had written a long response to pa kettle and then my computer froze and it all got deleted But in essense of his 12 claims, roughly 37,000 is priority debt which has to be paid back at 100 percent. Then the non priority claims will get the rest. He had I think around 6500 listed in non priority. If no other creditors file a claim for him, then his total payback will be only the 42,000 figure he quoted. At 1065 a month that means he will be in his chapter 13 for about 42/43 months give or take and not the 60 months originally scheduled. And he would end up paying back 100 percent to those who filed claims. Now, if a lot more claims come in for the non priority, then this would all have to be refigured. But his payment will not decrease but the length of time he is in the chapter 13 COULD decrease depending on the numbers.

[EveryDayAdam]

rrockingggramma is correct. all priority and secured claims MUST be paid 100%. So any plan you file, has to include atleast enough money over 60 months to pay them 100%...and that is regardless of what a person makes as income.

Also, as others have mentioned, if the amount of claims ends up being less than what you will pay in over 60 months, then your payment doesn't go down, only the amount of time you are in your plan...The only time where you might be able to secure a lower payment, is if your original plan payment was higher than your disposable income listed on your BK petition...in which case, you could go down to the higher of either your disposable income figure or the total amount of your claims divided by 60.