Embarrassed to ask..but I will!

[motox]

i have done the same thing and in the same boat now.. i went alittle over the edge and probably said about 50,000 more then what it was and this is one of the cards that i am filing on... i opend the card in 7 of 07 and filing in march.. i wonder if it will be an issue

[PaKettle]

While I love your speeding scenario reference as a risk comparison, it's not the same as with this issue. You are relating to risk factors and with a CC application, you have a signed contract which can be used in a Court of Law if they want to go after you for fraud and on that signed contract, whether agreed to online or signed physically, you state what you listed on that application is true and correct. Is the risk high for a one time fraudulent listing of income? Probably not...but if one continues to do it over a period of time the risk becomes higher. I would not advocate anyone listing income amounts higher than what they are on any application for credit. To compare the risk with your speeding scenario, there are those folks that get tickets (mostly in small towns) going 4 miles over the speed limit (happened to me) and then there are those that do 90 and more on the big highways every day and never get a ticket. I too have never heard of anyone getting in trouble for filing fradulently on CC applications but is that because most of the population lists correct information on applications or could it be that those that do list incorrect income either luckily get away with it or get their applications denied if the income is checked? Our HR department gets calls all the time from loan companies or other lenders verifying employment and income.

I guess my point in all this is that if you want to take the risk, know there is a risk. It may be small, it may be large. Remember you sign the form/application stating that the information you are providing is being true and correct.

I agree with you. I am certainly not advocating lying on credit apps, and I acknowledge that it IS different than the speeding analogy, in that there may exist a copy of the signed contract stating that you made x amount of income at the time of signing it.

But my analogy is still appropriate in the sense that the OP was considering the risk of being penalized for having done this, and I stand by my analogy in that the risk of being caught is fairly small, in general. It's not something to lose sleep over unless you REALLY LIED, big time, and recently.

I definitely would not recommend lying on a credit card app - it COULD come back to bite you on the behind. Also, that kind of behavior can just lead to one's getting more credit than one can handle which likewise could lead to ending up in bankruptcy! So don't do it!

But if you've already done it, and now you're filling, don't lose any sleep over it. Just tell your attorney and hope for the best.

Chances are it will turn out okay. The lesson is: Look at the stress lying has caused you. So next time, don't lie.

[Flamingo]

I think the point is that the original poster is asking if it might be a problem that he/she exaggerated the income he/she made at the time of applying for credit.

Some people made it sound as if this is "fraud" and therefore it could be a major problem. While this is potentially true, I think the "practical" answer is that no, this is almost never a problem, unless it has really been done to the extreme. I'm sure many people DO exaggerate and I'm sure it is almost never a problem.

The speed limit sign on the road you drove to work on, says 55MPH but I bet there is a very good chance that you went faster than that. Most people do.

But how many get tickets for going 62? Almost no one.

But if you go 90, you are much more likely to get a ticket for it.

I'm pretty sure it's the same thing with this issue.

I'm not advocating lying on credit card app's. I never did and never will. But I know people do.

I do however drive 62 in 55 zones, and I've yet to get a ticket for it. Nor have I yet heard of anyone getting prosecuted for fraud or even having it used against them in an objection if they exaggerated their income on their credit app. If anyone has heard of that happening in all but the rarest of cases, I'd be surprised.

While I love your speeding scenario reference as a risk comparison, it's not the same as with this issue. You are relating to risk factors and with a CC application, you have a signed contract which can be used in a Court of Law if they want to go after you for fraud and on that signed contract, whether agreed to online or signed physically, you state what you listed on that application is true and correct. Is the risk high for a one time fraudulent listing of income? Probably not...but if one continues to do it over a period of time the risk becomes higher. I would not advocate anyone listing income amounts higher than what they are on any application for credit. To compare the risk with your speeding scenario, there are those folks that get tickets (mostly in small towns) going 4 miles over the speed limit (happened to me) and then there are those that do 90 and more on the big highways every day and never get a ticket. I too have never heard of anyone getting in trouble for filing fradulently on CC applications but is that because most of the population lists correct information on applications or could it be that those that do list incorrect income either luckily get away with it or get their applications denied if the income is checked? Our HR department gets calls all the time from loan companies or other lenders verifying employment and income.

I guess my point in all this is that if you want to take the risk, know there is a risk. It may be small, it may be large. Remember you sign the form/application stating that the information you are providing is being true and correct.

[Flamingo]

I've been worried about the same thing, as my filing is coming up quickly. Before filling that section out, I asked the creditcard & loan companies if household income included parents. They all said yes. However, what they said may not matter in the end. I'm waiting to see if this becomes an issue for me.

Here is an excellent definition for you as to household income:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Household_income_in_the_United_States

[phoenyx]

Is this okay to do? I do it, I had a card through BoA before my BK, and I asked the rep for a credit limit increase. She said I needed to send in proof of household income, so I asked her if I should include my parents and siblings, since we all live in the same house. She said yes, but I still wonder if this is ok.

Sorry if this was already asked I don't have time to read all replies! Thanks!

I've been worried about the same thing, as my filing is coming up quickly. Before filling that section out, I asked the creditcard & loan companies if household income included parents. They all said yes. However, what they said may not matter in the end. I'm waiting to see if this becomes an issue for me.

[jetset]

Also many credit applications ask for the household income. So if you are living with parents/girlfriend/boyfriend/roommate, some people will write down the income of the entire household.

Is this okay to do? I do it, I had a card through BoA before my BK, and I asked the rep for a credit limit increase. She said I needed to send in proof of household income, so I asked her if I should include my parents and siblings, since we all live in the same house. She said yes, but I still wonder if this is ok.

Sorry if this was already asked I don't have time to read all replies! Thanks!

[PaKettle]

[snip] The initial poster here inquired whether or not it could be an issue that she input a higher amount on a credit application over what she actually made or something similar along those lines. It may or may not be a problem; but if there is an issue for some reason, they have her signature on the agreement. I guess cause I work in the legal field I use caution in many things because I have seen minor things become huge things and it doesn't take much to avoid that happening. No one can gauge the risk percentage on that but there is risk...

I think the point is that the original poster is asking if it might be a problem that he/she exaggerated the income he/she made at the time of applying for credit.

Some people made it sound as if this is "fraud" and therefore it could be a major problem. While this is potentially true, I think the "practical" answer is that no, this is almost never a problem, unless it has really been done to the extreme. I'm sure many people DO exaggerate and I'm sure it is almost never a problem.

The speed limit sign on the road you drove to work on, says 55MPH but I bet there is a very good chance that you went faster than that. Most people do.

But how many get tickets for going 62? Almost no one.

But if you go 90, you are much more likely to get a ticket for it.

I'm pretty sure it's the same thing with this issue.

I'm not advocating lying on credit card app's. I never did and never will. But I know people do.

I do however drive 62 in 55 zones, and I've yet to get a ticket for it. Nor have I yet heard of anyone getting prosecuted for fraud or even having it used against them in an objection if they exaggerated their income on their credit app. If anyone has heard of that happening in all but the rarest of cases, I'd be surprised.

[Flamingo]

With so many applications done on the internet now and many come from those preapproval, go online, and apply things, I doubt that this is even an issue. I never send in an app anymore. I just do it all online. And if you have had the card, made payments, and then default, I don't think it is an issue. Especially today, when I think 2008 will be a banner year for credit defaults and high BK filings.

You are correct as to the defaults and BK filings; major rounds of layoffs took place this past week and when I saw JP Morgan laying off 1,000 people, you know it is getting bad.

When you apply online, at the end of the application you have to check whether or not you accept their conditions - that is your signature tied right in with your SS. I wonder how many people actually take the time to read all the conditions and permissions listed in the box provided on the website. In any event, the key here is not whether or not it matters, you are signing a contract/agreement that you are stating the information is true and correct. The initial poster here inquired whether or not it could be an issue that she input a higher amount on a credit application over what she actually made or something similar along those lines. It may or may not be a problem; but if there is an issue for some reason, they have her signature on the agreement. I guess cause I work in the legal field I use caution in many things because I have seen minor things become huge things and it doesn't take much to avoid that happening. No one can gauge the risk percentage on that but there is risk...

[rrockinggramma]

With so many applications done on the internet now and many come from those preapproval, go online, and apply things, I doubt that this is even an issue. I never send in an app anymore. I just do it all online. And if you have had the card, made payments, and then default, I don't think it is an issue. Especially today, when I think 2008 will be a banner year for credit defaults and high BK filings.

[aachudneymiles]

I work for a major credit card company (Major) .. We dont keep anything after awhile even records of closed account are totally deleted out of system after a while .. meaning no record of you even having a card with us.. but it would take too much space to hold everyones records closed and open. we just input everything in the computer... we do monitor people credit report (to see if your are be coming a risk) Depending that we mite raise or drop your limit. but if your asked for a copy of your contract i can almost bet we can provide it ...

[jktrading]

IMHO, they would have to prove fraud. If you guessed at the time of application, or even hoped for the best from your business or raises, that is not the smartest, but there's no fraud. Tell your attorney everything after you retain them, and let them decide what to do. I'm just giving an opinion.

[BKcrazy]

Ok, fair enough. But, I think with how things are these days, they have better things to do than come after everyone filing bk.

I keep the agreements. I do read them. I didn't make false statements on applications. But, they do have to consider that sometimes income fluctuates.

[Flamingo]

I've read the fine print before. I was making a good amount before. But when you have income that drops how many people do you really think call and alert them? I have a feeling it's almost a non-issue these days. And thanks for insinuating that I DIDN'T EVER PAY ATTENTION
.

Oh, come on - where did I insinuate that? I didn't insinuate anything about you. My response was directed at whoever read my reply and not directed specifically at you. I stated "most people" and I am one of them - LOL! How many people actually read the fine print on a credit application when they sign it? How many keep a copy? I'm not among them...but I know all about the fine print and what is in it. Many people may not know what they sign and they wonder why they get in trouble or there are issues that come up afterwards and state, "well, geez, I never agreed to that," "why did my interest rate go to 13%" or "why are they raising my credit limit?" While many people may think an issue is small for them, it could be a huge one for someone else, especially as to fraud. That is one area where taking chances can be risky no matter what the amount.

[BKcrazy]

I've read the fine print before. I was making a good amount before. But when you have income that drops how many people do you really think call and alert them? I have a feeling it's almost a non-issue these days. And thanks for insinuating that I DIDN'T EVER PAY ATTENTION

DOLLAR BILL-I'd just talk to your attorney. There are also people out there that got interest-only no doc loans. And I'm sure thanks to the help of loan officers, those weren't exactly correct. You are paying your attorney to deal with this headache.

[Flamingo]

I had cards that were opened close to 10 years ago. My income has changed and gone up and down since opening them and filing bk. They chose to raise my limits because I paid on time. What my income was years ago and what it is now = shouldn't they be checking into that? I can't see being held to something that old. I'm sure they keep records, but they would be somewhat responsible as well for not checking income. I didn't ask for those increases in credit. If they monitor my credit, then they should pay attention to income yearly as well.

If you have a copy of the credit application you originally submitted or if you paid attention to any fine print items in with your account bills or even stated on your bill, you will find that the company has covered itself as to your questions and credit increases. Your original signed application allowed them to do that as time went on. You will find they will pull your credit reports prior to advising you that they are increasing your limit. That is why it is important to know that since fraud was the initial subject of this thread as to listing false income on an application for a credit card, you are signing an agreement with the company that if they issue you credit, they are basing it on the information you provide them. They got ya if they want ya. You are also giving them other permissions if they open an account for you; that is why you have to read the fine print. Unfortunately, most people don't.