Debt not included on discharge listing

[chocolatewaterz]

Hello all-
Going to my meeting with creditors tomorrow - but I was wondering what happens if an old debt surfaces after the meeting or even after the discharge. Do I have to pay it? Aren't I released from all debts prior to my BK? Please advise.

[blaze]

I know it is no problem to add a creditor all the way up to your discharge. Our attny charged extra - not sure if that is standard or not. After that I don't know - maybe someone else can advise?....

[FreshLikeADaisy]

Chocolatewaterz (interesting name, that ) there is no such thing as a discharge listing; when your bk is discharged you will receive a discharge order, signed by the judge, but it will not list specific debts.

The discharge pertains to all creditors listed on your creditor matrix (these should also be reflected in your schedules) unless a creditor obtains a successful objection to their debt, in which case your discharge would still stand... except for that one debt. You will know it if this happens, it won't just pop up: you will receive notice from the court.

If an old debt surfaces after your 341 or even after your discharge, the question to ask yourself is, "Did I include them in my creditor matrix when I filed Ch7?" If you did, and there was no objection granted, you're fine: the debt is legally discharged and they can go suck a lemon. But if you did not include them in your creditor matrix, then they were never legally notified of your bk and yes, that might cause some problems including having to pay the debt back.

So the MOST important thing is that you list every single possible debt on your creditor matrix, and use as many addresses for them as you can find. An example would be if you had a debt that went collections, but later were sued on: you'd list the original creditor, the collections agency (or agencies), and the law firm for the plaintiff that sued you over it. This is the absolute BEST way to ensure that no debts come back to bite you after your bk is over. Blaze is right, you can add a creditor to your matrix until the case is closed, but it's best to do this as soon as possible because you don't want to give a creditor grounds for objection by waiting until the 11th hour to ensure they are notified.

Now, since you've already filed, there is a $26 fee to add creditors to your matrix (all other amendments are free, but not this one). So pull your records, old mail, credit report, whatever you have, and look it over very carefully to ensure that ALL debtors are reflected on your creditor matrix. If you find one, or even several, that you left off it's okay, just amend your creditor matrix (or have your atty do it for you). No matter how many names, it's just the $26, so it's in your best interest to double-check it very carefully as soon as possible and fix it all at the same time. Trust me, that $26 is cheap compared to not notifying a creditor at all.

I hope this helps and I wish you good luck.

[BassBoy]

To expand a bit on what FreshLikeADaisy stated, the debt would be discharged, even though it wasn't listed on your creditor matrix, AS LONG AS YOU ARE NOT AN ASSET CASE! If you are an asset case, and the creditor was not listed or notified, then you will be responsible to pay that debt because that creditor did not have the opportunity to share in whatever asset there may have been.

[JollyGG]

If a debt surfaces betweeen filing and discharge. Simply add them. It only cost around $26 to amend your matrix with the courts. Now your lawyer may or may not charge you extra for doing it for you.

However, it is a small price to pay for piece of mind.

We actually, had a medical bill that it was unclear if insurance would pay or not. We left it off of our creditor matrix when we filed to give a little bit of time for insurance to make a decision about covering it. Right after the 341 meeting we went ahead and added that creditor

[BassBoy]

I agree with JollyGG and the others, it is worth the piece of mind to add the creditor if the bill(s) shows up before your discharge. It's when the bill/debt pops up after the discharge that you weren't aware of at all, for example, a medical bill from a while ago. This happened to us (medical bill came about a year after our discharge) and because we were an asset case, we had to pay it. If we weren't an asset case, tough luck for the bill collector/physician/hospital.

[ch7nA2003]

Were do I go to pay the $26? What form do I file, and where do I get it? Thank you!

I declared CH7, no assets, in Arizona in 2003, before the law changes. I did not know that the military over paid me back in 2001, because they did not tell me until 2007. So they were not on the matrix. They garnished $950 of my income taxes in 2008. Will I get reimbursed after I add them to my credit matrix?

I called them and told them about the bankruptcy (2003). They said that had I declared it after they notified me (2007), they would reimburse me if I just faxed them the bankruptcy notice; but because the bankruptcy (2003) was before they notified me (2007), they don't have to. The date of the over payment was 2001 though. They just reviewed their records recently and maybe did not know about it either this whole time.

Thank you so much for your time and help. I was really counting on this $950 tax refund they garnished.

[ch7nA2003]

If I add a creditor to my credit matrix, will it fall off my credit report at the same time the bankruptcy does, or will it be on there 10 years from the day I add them to the matrix?

[biotechsolution]

ch7nA2003..you would have to check to see if that debt was dischargeable...government overpayments I think are a ticky area...if the over payment was in 2001 you may get it back....but it's not going to be just adding the creditor to the matrix. You are going to have to reopen your bankruptcy case, $260 dollars, and then file a Adversary Proceeding to have the bankruptcy court rule if the over payment was discharged.

[ch7nA2003]

This is from the creditor's website:

http://www.dfas.mil/militarypay/debt/bankruptcy.html

"Upon learning that an individual has filed a bankruptcy petition, debt collection is stopped immediately unless it is determined that the automatic stay imposed at the time of filing pursuant to 11 U.S.C. 362 has been lifted or is no longer in effect.
...
Our customer contact representative will request that you fax a copy of your bankruptcy documentation to...
...
If we have withheld funds via administrative offset or salary offset, and you included the debt in the bankruptcy filing, notify us immediately. Our office will contact your current finance office or servicing payroll office to request suspension of collection action and request they refund any funds collected after the automatic stay date."

Does this mean the debt is dischargeable an I don't need to re-open the bankruptcy? The only dispute they are giving is that since the collection agency just bought the debt recently, they are saying they don't have to honor the 2003 bankruptcy.

[biotechsolution]

your problem is going to be when the US considered that they overpayed you. they willl argue that it was after your 2003 petition but you claiming it was in 2001. The only way it's going to be really resolved if for the bankruptcy court to decide.

[biotechsolution]

Were do I go to pay the $26? What form do I file, and where do I get it? Thank you!

I declared CH7, no assets, in Arizona in 2003, before the law changes. I did not know that the military over paid me back in 2001, because they did not tell me until 2007. So they were not on the matrix. They garnished $950 of my income taxes in 2008. Will I get reimbursed after I add them to my credit matrix?

I called them and told them about the bankruptcy (2003). They said that had I declared it after they notified me (2007), they would reimburse me if I just faxed them the bankruptcy notice; but because the bankruptcy (2003) was before they notified me (2007), they don't have to. The date of the over payment was 2001 though. They just reviewed their records recently and maybe did not know about it either this whole time.

Thank you so much for your time and help. I was really counting on this $950 tax refund they garnished.

Who garnished?? the government or the collection agency?? if it was the government you're going to have to reopen the bk. If it was the collection agency you may just have to threaten them.

[ch7nA2003]

reopening retroactive?

I filed my form F, and the court mailed me a notice saying I have 30 days to reopen the case or they will disregard it. My question is, if I reopen the case, will the creditor have to refund me the money they have garnished from me this year? (assuming the court agrees to include it and the creditor does not fight it)

Also, do I have to have a low bank account now, and inability to pay the debt now, for my Form F to stand, or will they just go off information from 2003?