100K limit? myth or real

[Priceless ProSe]

I really dont know much about IRA but wouldnt you have to take it out (no longer protected) to reinvest? It seems you took the funds out of the IRA and borrowed against the speculated success of said project, and that if the project would have worked out you were planning to use these funds to pay back the creditors. I dont understand how this makes the funds protected from the creditors.

Its funny when I really think about my questions towards you, the money we borrowed from CC went primarily towards depreciating consumer goods ! Admittedly I dont even have any retirement funds as of yet.

Regarding the car again, i understand there is a paper trail to your associate paying for it,which is good, but is it a secured debt? If there is no contract between your associate and you (one stating that the car is collateral for the loan) what would keep them from taking the car and declaring (well they wouldnt actually have to declare it obviously) him an unsecured creditor (oh and please say its not the same guy you gave the 40k to..hehe)

[Lajazz947]

Here's how it worked:

The IRA was a private placement that stayed inside a self directed IRA so the money was never removed from the IRA account itself.

The promised return was $500,000 from the development of the property and subsequent refi to take the cash out to pay off investors.

$300K back into the IRA and $200K outside the IRA that I would pay regular tax on.

I was counting on the $200K to use towards the remodel and took out another $200K from a home refi.

The $200K never came back for me to pay the money that I used on unsecured CC's and lines of credit so I got stuck with $200K in debt that I cannot pay now.

I would never get the full $500K back from him since he did not use my money to purchase the property that he said he was going to and the property has not been developed.

I hope it's making a little more sense now.

The car situation is indeed the same associate ( I only have one) but all the dealing are on the up and up so I can't see that as creating any type of fraudulent transfer other than the UST making him give back the $40K that I will repay him somehow.

[Priceless ProSe]

Sounds like all your ducks are in a row, make sure to clarify with the attorney about the car. Sorry for all the questions, hopefully if I ever have to file BK again (no way in heck) I have those kind of problems (having to explain why i have oodles of cash! just kidding)

Hopefully someone with real knowledge will come along now that youve really got it spread out like this. Best wishes to ya

[Lajazz947]

Thank you very much. It was good working with you. Even though I have it very organized you posed some very good questions that will help me quite a bit.

I know that it will not be as easy as it appears, or maybe it will be easier. I just hate surprises so I am trying to be as proactive as possible.

One last question:

Is there a statutory time-line for the UST to challenge your petition before he/she HAS to give up?

Thanks

[Help!]

YES - the good news is that the UST has only 10 days from the conclusion of the 341 hearing to file a statement of presumed abuse. After that, they have only 30 days to file a motion to dismiss/convert or a statement as to why dismissal/conversion is not appropriate (a declination... what happened in our case). Occasionally they are granted an extension, but they must have compelling reasons (these are not routinely granted in our district and I've even seen denials of the UST's motion to extend).

[Lajazz947]

Thanks, what exactly is a declination.

I read about it and it seems that in a declination the UST tries to throw it out entirely or does this mean they try to throw it into a 13?

[Help!]

A declination is the best possible outcome after a statement of presumed abuse has been filed. The UST allows the Ch. 7 to proceed unopposed, without any further effort to convert to Ch. 13 or dismiss.

[Lajazz947]

Thanks. That's a better answer.

[Cali]

My attorney told me that the UST would look at my case closer because of the high debt(162k)and being 23k over median.

[Help!]

My attorney told me that the UST would look at my case closer because of the high debt(162k)and being 23k over median.

It seems awfully late in your case for the UST to appear. I'll bet they don't get involved in your case because of your husband's deployment. Congress did a lousy job of defining "special circumstances" rebutting abuse but military deployment was one specifically mentioned in 11 USC so I'd be surprised if the UST would file a presumed abuse statement. Their time is almost up anyway (10 day rule).

[slam22]

My attorney told me that the UST would look at my case closer because of the high debt(162k)and being 23k over median.

Cali our attorney told us the same thing bascially. We have 200k unsecured, not counting our 200k (now unsecured HELOC due to upside down). We are about 30k over the median.

[Lajazz947]

Cali our attorney told us the same thing bascially. We have 200k unsecured, not counting our 200k (now unsecured HELOC due to upside down). We are about 30k over the median.

So how does your attorney plan on dealing with his issue? After reading these posts I am now getting myself ready for battle.

Has the UST asked for anything in particular that we should be prepared for?

Thanks

[slam22]

So how does your attorney plan on dealing with his issue? After reading these posts I am now getting myself ready for battle.

Has the UST asked for anything in particular that we should be prepared for?

Thanks

I think the main thing that our attorney wanted from us was just being abole to document as much as we can. We've got copies of every bank statement, 401k statement, credit card statement, brokerage statement for the past two years, ever since my wife lost her job. It shows where every penny went. That's when the downward spiral began. My advice would be to just do as much of this as you can prior to filing and your 341 hearing. If the trustee asks for it then you'll have it ready to turn over to him/her without having to scramble at the last minute to get it.

[Lajazz947]

Fantastic.

I only have the 2008 records, maybe some in 2007 but I will certainly get them.

I can document every penny as well, I just need to get going on it.

Good luck.

[Help!]

It is very important to get copies of any missing CC statements BEFORE you file. We were missing a couple and the CC companies (especially Chase) refused to issue copies. B of A told us they would mail them, then didn't. I'm sure they "got lost in the mail".