Can Countrywide sue me after my discharge?

[tallberry]

Okay I don't know whether to be pissed off or worried. We received certified letters from the courts saying we are being sued by Countrywide. Our BK 7 was discharged on July 1st and they were included. I no longer own the house, how can they sue us for foreclosure now? What do I need to do? I certainly am not showing up to some stupid court hearing!! Countrywide has ignored our BK from the get go, continually sending bills that said "they were not trying to collect on the mortgage but can you pay what you owe" kind of things. Now this...I thought I read someone else having this experience but for the life of me, I can't find the thread. Anyone have any advice?

[Help!]

I would be incredibly PO'd to get something like this in the mail, but don't panic.

No, Countrywide cannot sue you if the debt was discharged. They can definitely foreclose, but they cannot try to collect on that debt. Many states require judicial foreclosure, so the letter you received is probably just the foreclosure process beginning in the court system. There is nothing to sue you for at this point - the home hasn't been auctioned so there's no deficiency. Even if there were, the debt was included in BK and all you would have to do is provide that documentation to the court.

Have you checked PACER to make sure they haven't filed a complaint and disputed your discharge (unlikely, but just to be safe)? The first thing I would do is check my case history. If nothing looks out of the ordinary, I would check "related cases" to see if there's anything from Countrywide listed as a separate case. The only way they can have your discharge vacated is to object to discharge alleging fraud. This would be tied in with your BK case and would show on PACER.

I know the feeling of "always waiting for the other shoe to drop" - you will have to do some detective work to figure out what exactly is going on.

[FreshLikeADaisy]

Tallberry, as you say you no longer own the house (and I assume that means you're no longer living in it, either ) whatever Countrywide is going after is not only going to be uncollectable, it seems to me to be a very clear violation of your discharge.

Whether you lost the house to foreclosure, or you short sold it, whatever you did, the fact is that if you did not sign a reaff specifically for Countrywide and your debt with them, their debt was discharged just like all the rest. Once you're out of a house and it's either sold or foreclosed, any remaining debt -- such as a deficiency judgement -- is unsecured and discharged in a Ch7 like any other. They didn't object within the 60 days? Tough.

In addition, even if they had a valid claim (and I don't believe they do, at all) and are just now getting around to suing for it, the fact is that pre-existing claims belong to the bk estate, and the claim itself was nullified by your discharge whether it was liquidated or not by the time the bk was closed.

Tallberry, think about giving your atty a call and run this by him. Let him advise you just to be sure there is no point of liability on your part. Me, I'd show up to the hearing with a copy of my creditor matrix, schedules, BNC notification, and discharge... just to see the red faces. I'd also bring the letters attempting to collect the debt while the automatic stay was in place -- the whole, "This isn't an effort to collect but pay what you can," is bulls**t. It WAS an effort to collect and it WAS a clear violation of the automatic stay. Now that your bk is discharged, you can use that as proof of bad faith, should you ever get the opportunity. But your discharge should be enough, and your atty can advise you what to do. He may submit a Motion to Dismiss based on the bk, he may just contact the plaintiff's attys directly. Either way, they don't have a leg to stand on.

The only exception to all this that I can possibly think of -- and if there are more, I hope someone else jumps in -- is if you incurred debt with Countrywide *after* your bk. Obviously, post-bk debt is not discharged by a bk... but you knew that.

Keep in mind that Countrywide (and the bank that bought them... wasn't it BoA?) is in incredibly bad shape, records in disarray and financially almost non-existent. I honestly would not be surprised to find that they *lost* your bk notification, or it never got to the right place, or it isn't in the right hands even now. Which is every bit *their* problem, btw. Check to make sure all your i's are dotted and your t's are crossed, and do what your atty says to do.

I wish you the best!!!

[tallberry]

Thanks...I was hoping I wouldn't have to call my attorney, but I agree I should check just to be sure. I did check my pacer acct and it is case closed as of 7/1/08. Nothing new and nothing out of the ordinary. Countrywide was well aware of the BK because they did the typical relief of stay during my BK so they could take possession of the house We haven't lived there since July of last year. I hate Countrywide...they are getting what they deserve (and I'm not usually mean spirited). Their greed brought their own demise! I'll keep you posted!!

[AngelinaCatHub]

One small warning. ANSWER the hearing, do not ignore it. Even if you simply go to it with your discharge paper in hand, you must answer the complaint. You may even be able to do that by mail. Your lawyer will probably handle it though. You do NOT want a default Judgment. ‘Hub

[deafbroke]

If you didn't reaffirm the mortgage they can't do anything.They do have to send you notice that they are going to start foreclosure and that is done through an attorney so maybe that is what is happening. As long as you didn't reaffirm you're fine. Also if you had an attorney for the bankruptcy inform him and send him copy of the letter you got. See what he says.

DB

[tallberry]

I got a message back from the paralegal. Basically, Help, you are right on. The state my house is in, is a judicial foreclosure state. I am going to send them the copy of my discharge papers and let them do there little voo-doo that they doo-doo so well. I live in FL so there isn't a snowballs chance in hell that I will be at the hearing in IN. Other than the discharge papers, do you think I should include anything else? Should Include a letter written by me stating my position or let my documentation do the talking?

[Priceless ProSe]

I got a message back from the paralegal. Basically, Help, you are right on. The state my house is in, is a judicial foreclosure state. I am going to send them the copy of my discharge papers and let them do there little voo-doo that they doo-doo so well. I live in FL so there isn't a snowballs chance in hell that I will be at the hearing in IN. Other than the discharge papers, do you think I should include anything else? Should Include a letter written by me stating my position or let my documentation do the talking?

The letter sounds like a good idea to me. Dont leave anything to chance.

[FreshLikeADaisy]

I got a message back from the paralegal. Basically, Help, you are right on. The state my house is in, is a judicial foreclosure state. I am going to send them the copy of my discharge papers and let them do there little voo-doo that they doo-doo so well...

That was so appropriate it made me laugh.

I agree, as long as you have to speak up, might as well use your voice to the fullest. You know exactly how to write it, too: brief, crisp, professional, exactly to the point. I have no doubt you'll do fine. Good luck!!!

[tallberry]

Thanks all...I appreciate the feedback. Glad I made you laugh, fresh. I think we have the same sense of humor! I'll write a letter you'd be proud of and put this "elephant" to rest once and for all!