Did the means test today

[santadawg]

Boy what a long day, first of all we in the were there for 5 hours. We should be under the medium. They said they wanted the means test to be zero at the end. Then we did our expenses and got to zero, so we had to cut 600.00. Then I noticed our earnings were wrong (there fault). Then we had to try to add 1000.00 to our expenses. Back and fourth. We left after 5 hours I think there still trying to figure it out. Why does it have to be at zero, I thought you were suppose to be under. We have no assets.
Anyways the lawyer comes in to talk us and thinks we should go ch-13. Because both are cars are with a credit union along with a credit card.
Car #1-owe 18000.--worth 10000.
Car #2 owe 5000.-- worth 5000.
credit card--5000.
He said to keep the cars it is better to go ch-13 and get a lower payment. or we let the cars go in a ch-7 and have no cars.

Our other cc cards=75000.

[soleprop]

hmm, it doesn't seem like you have equity in the cars; i'm not clear on why those numbers and the credit union link indicate a CH13 for you. as for the means test; my understanding is that if you have $100/month disposable income available each month after expenses, you are borderline CH13. best to be close to zero, or barely negative. barely negative indicates you could modify your lifestyle somewhat to afford all of your expenses, you just need bk relief from extenuating debt circumstances (high interest rates, collection attempts, foreclosures, etc).

[GreenInkOnPaper]

Talk to another lawyer. The means test shouldn't take 5 hours, and CH13 on $80K credit cards? No thanks!

[santadawg]

I had to adjust it right to zero, no more no less. I don't have any equity in my cars. He thinks I should go ch-13 so I can adjust the loans on my cars and dump the cc card. I just don't agree. But my DW thinks we should keep the cars and the ch-13 is a sounds good.

[santadawg]

Already paid him 3100.

[GreenInkOnPaper]

But you can't dump the credit cards in a 13.

[santadawg]

He said

1) go ch-7 and let the cars go
2) fight the credit Union on the collaterallize
3) go ch-13 keep the cars

[endisnear]

i'd still get a 2nd opinion...

[santadawg]

No, he said I can dump the cards and just pay the KKB trade in value on the cars, for 3 years or for 5 years. Doesn't make sense to me.

[mmenz22779]

you can keep the cars in a 7, one is negitive equity and the other is break even equity. Keep in mind that under a 13 you will be watched for 5 years. If you win the lottery too bad, you give it to the trustee, your income increases guess what so will your payments in the future plus you are paying his fees and the trustees fees along with what ever debt you are paying back.

If you are boarder line on the means test you can eaisly get more expenses, such as term life insurance, increase your tax withholdings those are 2 easy ones. Take out a 401k loan (you can use the payments agaist your disposable income)

your lawyer sounds fishy to me. I have three cars, one on loan, i am 30000 over the means test and still qualify for a chapter 7.

Get more advice or try the online means test at legalconsumer.com

Do a chapter 7 and you only have 2 months of misery vs chapter 13 (5 years).

Also a chapter 7 should cost you 1/2 of that 3100. The high carpayment is also helping you with your means test.

Go see other lawyers even if you paid this one already and get free consults. Something does not sound right.

[GreenInkOnPaper]

He said

1) go ch-7 and let the cars go
2) fight the credit Union on the collaterallize
3) go ch-13 keep the cars

Just so you know, I am NOT arguing with you ! BUT:

Why pay on $80K in credit cards just to keep two cars? My hub is going 7 and keeping a car that is paid for, and one that he has noooo equity, will let it go after the discharge.

[santadawg]

Green I agree with you, but if we keep the cars it will cost us 28000, because of the credit union.

[TEW]

Green I agree with you, but if we keep the cars it will cost us 28000, because of the credit union.

give them the car back

[Doghouse]

Yeah, above lawyer does seem fishy to me too. The first lawyer I saw on initial consults wanted me to do a ch 13 because I was way over median salary, without going over my expenses. He even told me to go ahead and get a new car since it will be included in the 5 yr payment plan. Of course, a ch13 was $3849 all of which must be paid before he'd even file the case. Saw three other lawyers that said I would qualify for a ch 7 based on household size and expenses.

As TEW said, give back the cars. I doubt the CU will want them back if you filed CH 7 as long as you are still current on the payments. Unless I intend to keep a house, I just don't see any reason why I'd want to put myself through 3 to 5 yrs of a rigid ch13 repayment plan where anything can happen and where any extras such as increased pay or bonuses is taken by the court. Especially if you can qualify for a 7.

[GreenInkOnPaper]

My gut tells me that this attorney is trying to go the 13 route so that he can make more $$$. I think you would serve yourself well to get a couple of free consults, buy the Nolo Ch7 book, and go back with guns blazing.