paying the lawyer - how?

[NOVA]

Here is my question - for almost a year now, we have stopped paying our c.c.'s. We are pretty much on a monthly budget, that is all accounted for, w/ minimum disposable income left. (schedule J)

I need to get $ 1300 to my lawyer - my mom is going to send us money in cash -what would be the best way for me to do?

-just go ahead and deposit the cash and explain to trustee where it came from? ( around $500-600)

- make small deposits over the next 2-3 month?

- deposit the cash and say it's from my kids's piggy banks? - which they also have money in there - I could borrow that and pay them back after the BK-

there is no way, I can save up the $ 1300 in 2-3 month and pass the means test (and the schedule J)

gosh, that this make any sense? lol

thanks for any responses!

[chad9162]

Whatever comes from mom would be considered income if given within 6 months of filing BK...If the difference doesn't prevent you from Chap 7 then its a non-issue.

- deposit the cash and say it's from my kids's piggy banks? - which they also have money in there - I could borrow that and pay them back after the BK-

You'd need a paper trail. You can't fake the math. A withdraw and a deposit would be easy to track and would probably get caught lying. Then you'd have a lot of explaining to do. If the money in the "kids" account is from you then who cares. Technically it was your money that funded thee account. If its from someone else then I believe it would be considered income.

- make small deposits over the next 2-3 month?

Sure if you're willing to wait.

there is no way, I can save up the $ 1300 in 2-3 month and pass the means test (and the schedule J)

That's confusing a bit and contradicts the last statement? Do you think that if you don't "pay expenses" that you don't qualify for the means test? I'm sure people have sacrificed on "expenses" to come up with attorneys fees.

The expenses in the means test are based on long term and designed to see if you would have disposable income in the future. So if one or two months you ate peanut butter and jelly sandwiches to come up with attorney fees, it wouldn't change the means test. They don;t expect you to eat PB and Jelly sandwiches forever

I'm sure the trustee knows that filers have to cut expenses somewhere to pay attorneys, especially when the filer shows less than $109 or even negative monthly disposable income.

[chad9162]

Also, I don't think the trustee scrutinizes where the attorney fees come from. Instead I think they just assume you cut expenses somewhere to pay them. You have to remember that the trustee makes zero money if you do not file.

[Doghouse]

Just deposit the money into your account and pay the lawyer. That shows a paper trail. Or have your mom pay the lawyer directly on your behalf. With over 1.3 million BK filings, the trustees know many people borrow or have family members help them pay the attorney fees for their bankruptcy filings.

[StartingOver08]

Yes, have your Mom pay the lawyer directly.

Or, if you don't want to do that for some reason, remember the lookback period is the 6 full months so if you file anytime in May, your lookback is Nov 08 thru Apr 09 and no deposits are reviewed for May 09. Paying attorney fees is perfectly allowed and receives no scrutiny.

[HHM]

You guys are overblowing this, the money given to you to pay the lawyer is not going to count as income for BK purposes, the trustee and court don't care how the attorney is paid, it's an allowable expense.

[MichiganMan]

Yep

You guys are overblowing this, the money given to you to pay the lawyer is not going to count as income for BK purposes, the trustee and court don't care how the attorney is paid, it's an allowable expense.

He is right. And I bet your attorney has no problem taking cash! Cash is King!
After you file that will become your battle cry.

[NOVA]

great, thanks you all! I went back in my bankstatements and I can actually show, where I withdrew around $ 1600 last year july - I think, I'll just tell everybody, that I put that money in the save as emergency fund - and are now using it for the lawyer. I guess, I'll pay w/ money order - so I wont' even have to deal w/ showing it on my check. account.

That should be ok right?

AGain, thanks y'all!

[epiphany]

great, thanks you all! I went back in my bankstatements and I can actually show, where I withdrew around $ 1600 last year july - I think, I'll just tell everybody, that I put that money in the save as emergency fund - and are now using it for the lawyer. I guess, I'll pay w/ money order - so I wont' even have to deal w/ showing it on my check. account.

That should be ok right?

AGain, thanks y'all!

That's not going to be necessary 'cause no one's going to ask.

That said, don't lie to the court.

ep

[chad9162]

don't lie to the court.

ep

Yep, I agree. Most of the people here are filing BK because of the economy and the housing meltdown. I am not judging you or anyone else but I question people's character when they openly say, "I'm going to lie" or "How do I lie?"
I don't think anyone here wants to help you commit a crime!! Most people who lie and cheat their way through life get caught, the only exception to this rule are politicians...

[SobStory]

Yep, I agree. Most of the people here are filing BK because of the economy and the housing meltdown. I am not judging you or anyone else but I question people's character when they openly say, "I'm going to lie" or "How do I lie?"
I don't think anyone here wants to help you commit a crime!! Most people who lie and cheat their way through life get caught, the only exception to this rule are politicians...

I think Epiphany gave good advice. I think a statement like: "I question people's character" IS judging and unnecessary here.

Many of us feel like (i) we have been hit by a Mack truck (ii) we don't know what we are supposed to say (iii) if we say the wrong thing, we will get kicked out of court and bankruptcy. Epiphany gave good advice and I think that should suffice.

[NOVA]

Chad- I'm not lying - thanks for the quick assumption on my character. I'm not going to cheat - but I do want to make sure, all my ducks are in the row, when I do file, b/c I only have a one time shot right now (can't pay out any more to my lawyer). I can't wait either - so I need to make sure, that my cash on hand is accounted for the right way.

From what I have heard, there are no set rules - a lot is up to the trustee's interpratation (sp?).

My thing was - either pay w/ cash or money order - put the money in the bank account (that I already have on hand) or pay w/ money order. Anyway, this discussion is dead, as I found the advise I needed.

I'm just a bit hurt by the quick assumption of me lying and cheating.

[Kansas1960]

I know how you feel

I have been reading this forum for a long time. There have been many stories of TTs going crazy with all types of requests and questions. When I had my initial consultation I asked the attorney how strict the TTs were in this district. He kind of looked at me with suspision and said he always wonders when someone asks this question what they are trying to hide. This shocked and hurt me too. Then I felt I had to justify my question by saying I have read stories about some districts being tough and I just wanted to make sure I was ok if I got one of those. He said I seemed to be a nervous person, which I am. I did not choose this guy since he made me feel worse. But then on the other hand when I asked him about the stuff that worried me he said it is no problem to everything I asked. Then he said we can file right away if I wanted. I think he was just wanting me to go with him and then find reasons for a delay once he got my money. So I know how you feel.

[chad9162]

I think a statement like: "I question people's character" IS judging and unnecessary here.

If you're going to quote me how about including everything I said...

"I am not judging you or anyone else but I question people's character when they openly say, "I'm going to lie" or "How do I lie?"

[chad9162]

I went back in my bankstatements and I can actually show, where I withdrew around $ 1600 last year july - I think, I'll just tell everybody, that I put that money in the save as emergency fund - and are now using it for the lawyer.

- deposit the cash and say it's from my kids's piggy banks? - which they also have money in there - I could borrow that and pay them back after the BK-

Chad- I'm not lying - thanks for the quick assumption on my character. I'm not going to cheat - but I do want to make sure, all my ducks are in the row, when I do file, b/c I only have a one time shot right now (can't pay out any more to my lawyer).

My bad, I misunderstood....