Repo Company Takes the Wrong Vehicle

[walkthaplank]

having lived in florida, and still have a gun permit from there, i know and read every other day about someone getting shot for something simple..and getting away with it...as said earlier by someone...you dont have to retreat..or make a effort to run away..you have the right to stand your ground where ever you are ....much more often than not, people get away with shooting someone on the basis of feeling threatened and do not get charged...one instance i remember a homeless man walked into a business unarmed and asked if owner could spare some change...he was shot by owner because he felt threatened...and was not charged...in florida all you have to be is alive breathing and no criminal record and they HAVE to give you a permit if you want one....i also had a permit in california..and couldnt get away with any of what i could in florida..

The standard in California is that you are in fear for the life or safety of yourself or others. Period. It is up to the prosecutor to prove that you did not BELIEVE you or others were in immediate danger. It is a very difficult threshold, unless they can prove some other motive for the use of deadly force they'll usually walk away from it. In one of my CCW classes put on by the Sheriff's dept they even discussed a scenario where a liquor store clerk shot a robber in the back as he was running out the front door and how it was a justified shooting. Essentially the store was robbed by 5 gangbangers, he shot four inside the store and he shot the 5th one as he ran out the front door. There had been a gang doing take over robberies of stores in the area who had been using a rifle in the robberies, he told the investigators that he believed that the 5th robber was going out to get a rifle and he wasn't going to let that happen. Of course I live in a county where they are liable to measure your grouping and critique your technique rather than give you the third degree if you take out a dirtbag.

California has no duty to retreat, the real trick is not to say that you shot the guy for stealing your car, you shot him because he threatened you or your family.

[junker]

having lived in florida, and still have a gun permit from there, i know and read every other day about someone getting shot for something simple..and getting away with it...as said earlier by someone...you dont have to retreat..or make a effort to run away..you have the right to stand your ground where ever you are ....much more often than not, people get away with shooting someone on the basis of feeling threatened and do not get charged...one instance i remember a homeless man walked into a business unarmed and asked if owner could spare some change...he was shot by owner because he felt threatened...and was not charged...in florida all you have to be is alive breathing and no criminal record and they HAVE to give you a permit if you want one....i also had a permit in california..and couldnt get away with any of what i could in florida..

[justbroke]

Here you go. Someone repoing the wrong car (theft) on your property, is justifiable for lethal force.

I don'[t know how you jump to actual burglars (burglary of a residence), to killing trespassers. Perhaps you should retain a lawyer just in case you decide to exercise what you believe is your right. There are many people in jail now who believed that the force that they used was justified.

If you live in Texas, perhaps that defense may work. I would just strongly caution anyone even talking about shooting whoever enters their property... seek legal counsel now.

Whether you have an affirmative defense or not will depend on the facts as they are laid out. While States like Texas and Florida have very liberal "castle doctrine" and "stand your ground" laws... the authorities will still look at your particular circumstances and your State's laws will prevail.

[All Cash]

PS, I know of no state that allows you to shoot someone for the simple act of trespassing.

Here you go. Someone repoing the wrong car (theft) on your property, is justifiable for lethal force.

http://www.newser.com/story/31381/no-charges-for-texas-man-who-shot-neighbors-burglars.html

[junker]

quoting bigboy

am sure many people have read storied on how a demolition company demolished the wrong house. of course it would be illegal for me to bulldoze your house, but if I made a mistake and I was a licensed and bonded demolition contractor I am NOT going to jail over the mistake like if I just went to Rental Marts and rented a bulldozer and flattened your house.

Can we bring this "mistake" back into perspective. I don't know how you can think this raises to the level of a crime. I am not saying the repo people may not be arrested at that time, but they won't ever get charged for a 'mistake' and rarely do they arrested. end quote.....

so then if i mistakenly have tooo much to drink and then mistakenly drive out of bad judgement and run some one over...i can tell the police it was all a mistake???

if i go outside on new years eve or july 4th and shoot up in the air and bullet comes down and kills my neighbor...i just tell police it was a mistake and i never intended to hurt him....

if i jump in a bait car at local liquer store and am caught....just tell police it was a big mistake??? and they will let me go???

granted the police or DA will probably NOT pursue criminal charges BUT it is STILL a criminal act....last i heard you could NOT take someone elses property without their permisssion ....period....even if it was a mistake.....EVERY CRIMINAL IN THE WORLD WOULD PLEAD IT WAS JUST A MISTAKE...in California the prisons are FULL of people that just made innocent MISTAKES.....

[BigJohn]

Yep, I don't know where the guy is that said he would shoot, but you had better be right and within the laws when you do.
I have held CCWs in 3 states and know the laws pretty well in those.
And my father was a car dealer who used repo people all the time. They could not enter a locked or even a shut gate, nor your garage, locked or not, in CA. They could come onto the property, such as your driveway to claim the car.
And there, if the repo was not peaceable, by law then, it was illegal. Therefore most repos went down while you were asleep, or at work, so it made it easy. If you are not there to make problems it's peaceable by law.
And my daughter, who has to file soon, just had her truck repo'd too, in Phoenix in the middle of the night while she slept. She was going to surrender it in the BK anyway and was two payments back with Ford.

I know that TX has the castle doctrine and such. But even there according to what I have been told you cannot take a life for stealing or repossessing a car.

What was it ...... about a year ago a Texan couldn't wait for the police after he had called (911) and went out and bagged the thief who was stealing from his neighbor? I think that guy got off.


With the number of home invasions in Arizona, some home owners have fought back, even with the bad guys were on the run. Not too long ago one guy got shot for doing a home invasion - it turned ot his day job was a prison guard.



I think Arizona is a castle State or at least a pseudo - Castle State. I know some laws have been changed - actually hard to keep up with the changes.

[kenshirley]

kenshirley knows his stuff!

Brandishing a weapon can be a serious offense. Just carrying a rifle over your shoulder, can be construed as brandishing.

Now if a repo man is 'stealing' your vehicle in the middle of the night and the repo man makes threating motions and words and a person's life seems to be in jepordy (especially if the person is handicapped), then the court might side with the gun owner.

Now if the vehicle is behind a locked gate or behind a closed, locked garage door, that would give the gun owner even more credence.

If the repo man has a gun, which many repo men in Arizona have, and if he 'goes for his gun', that would help the gun owner in his defense.



Back in the early 90's, I had a brother-in-law who did repossessions. He went to one home to repo a truck and he took 2 other people. The truck owner came out of the house and shot one the people that was helping him do the repos right between the eyes. He dropped dead on the spot. The truck owner was arrested and convicted and went to prison.


A lot of people think Arizona is like the 'Gun Fight at the Ok Corral' until they find out, the gunfight was not at the OK Coral, and that Wyatt Earp and doc Holiday did get to spend time in jail for the fight, and when they had their day in court, they almost did not win.


But then, when it comes to repossessions, the police and courts have a tendency to look at repo people in a different light.

Yep, I don't know where the guy is that said he would shoot, but you had better be right and within the laws when you do.
I have held CCWs in 3 states and know the laws pretty well in those.
And my father was a car dealer who used repo people all the time. They could not enter a locked or even a shut gate, nor your garage, locked or not, in CA. They could come onto the property, such as your driveway to claim the car.
And there, if the repo was not peaceable, by law then, it was illegal. Therefore most repos went down while you were asleep, or at work, so it made it easy. If you are not there to make problems it's peaceable by law.
And my daughter, who has to file soon, just had her truck repo'd too, in Phoenix in the middle of the night while she slept. She was going to surrender it in the BK anyway and was two payments back with Ford.

I know that TX has the castle doctrine and such. But even there according to what I have been told you cannot take a life for stealing or repossessing a car.

[Bell30656]

Here in Georgia the OCGA is pretty clear you can only use a weapon if your LIFE or the LIFE of another is in mortal danger. And then you can only use the minimal amount of force necessary to remove the danger.

I have a former friend who shot someone in his home in the middle of the night and wound up spending a fortune on legal fees. He did eventually get a hung jury and the district attorney elected to not retry the case but he spent a couple of years of his life and quite a bit of money to beat the case.

The real insult to injury was that the burglar survived and from prison sued the home owner. Then the home owner's insurance company settled out of court with the burglar!

*Note* My neighbor who's truck was stolen by the repossession company received a check by FedEx from the repossession company this morning. The terms attached to the check say that by cashing the check he agrees that the matter is settled to the mutual satisfaction and that the "company" admits no fault or wrong doing. I asked him what he was going to do, he stated that he'd deposited the check and he's thinking about parking his truck closer to the neighbor's house so he can get some other sucker to repo it.

I think steaks are on him this weekend!

[BigJohn]

kenshirley knows his stuff!

Brandishing a weapon can be a serious offense. Just carrying a rifle over your shoulder, can be construed as brandishing.

Now if a repo man is 'stealing' your vehicle in the middle of the night and the repo man makes threating motions and words and a person's life seems to be in jepordy (especially if the person is handicapped), then the court might side with the gun owner.

Now if the vehicle is behind a locked gate or behind a closed, locked garage door, that would give the gun owner even more credence.

If the repo man has a gun, which many repo men in Arizona have, and if he 'goes for his gun', that would help the gun owner in his defense.



Back in the early 90's, I had a brother-in-law who did repossessions. He went to one home to repo a truck and he took 2 other people. The truck owner came out of the house and shot one the people that was helping him do the repos right between the eyes. He dropped dead on the spot. The truck owner was arrested and convicted and went to prison.


A lot of people think Arizona is like the 'Gun Fight at the Ok Corral' until they find out, the gunfight was not at the OK Coral, and that Wyatt Earp and doc Holiday did get to spend time in jail for the fight, and when they had their day in court, they almost did not win.


But then, when it comes to repossessions, the police and courts have a tendency to look at repo people in a different light.

[kenshirley]

You do need to review the laws in your state for use of deadly force.
Or you can go to jail for misuse of a gun.
It's your choice.
Don't get me wrong, I am very pro gun, but I have little use for people that don't know and follow the rules.

PS, I know of no state that allows you to shoot someone for the simple act of trespassing.

[kenshirley]

I know of no state that you can shoot someone over them taking your car, even on your own property.
Even here in AZ where I carry a .357 magnum 99% of the time open carry if you put your hand on the gun to threaten someone when your life in not in danger you have a problem.
Again, I suggest you review the laws of your state regarding deadly force.
Sorry my friend, but even as strong as you feel, I think you are wrong.
Not knowing where you live, it's hard to educate you.

[All Cash]

You do need to review the laws in your state for use of deadly force.
Or you can go to jail for misuse of a gun.
It's your choice.
Don't get me wrong, I am very pro gun, but I have little use for people that don't know and follow the rules.

If someone is trespassing on your property in my state at least, you have a right to stand your ground and protect your property, family from any threat. A repo person taking a wrong vehicle, on my property, constitutes theft, and deadly force can and will be used.

At this point I really do not want to hijack the OP's thread.

The End.

[kenshirley]

You do need to review the laws in your state for use of deadly force.
Or you can go to jail for misuse of a gun.
It's your choice.
Don't get me wrong, I am very pro gun, but I have little use for people that don't know and follow the rules.

[All Cash]

We have open carry laws in my state. If they tried that **** on my property, they would have been shot for trespassing.

[kenshirley]

If the truck had a handgun inside, that should get the police's attention. If the gun shows up missing, somebody will have to come up with a really good story as to what happened to the gun.

Sounds like some really good drama.

Not in my state it wouldn't as it's legal here to carry one in your car or truck. Mine just stays on my belt but sometimes I leave it in the car if I go in where it's posted no guns.