Fears about Writ of Execution

[BrokeIn2010]

My experience with American General was a lawsuit. They had a branch located in a nearby town. When I defaulted several years ago, they immediately went to small claims court. They did this themselves and did not hire any legal firm. Pretty simple to file small claims in Oregon and AG knows this. I encouraged them to proceed with wage garnishment, which they did. The ~ 1500 judgment was paid off in a couple of months.

Citifin had a local branch office until a year ago. I haven't seen much suit action out of them in the local courts. I think it is interesting to note that in my area citifin wrote loans up to the small claims amount. With the loss of the branch office, they are out of the small claims suits. An attorney cannot represent either party in small claims in my state. I'm sure when they had the local branch they had folks trained in small claims.


C1 and Citi (credit cards) also have judgments against me. C1 is the most recent. After 6 months citi has still not filed a writ of garnishment. I called C1 and told them to get moving, but they still have done nothing. As of a few weeks ago, the department of education (student loans) has a permanent garnishment order for 15%. I don't know if it is worth C1 or chiti's time to try for the other 10%, as the writs for these folks would only be good for 90 days at a time.

I also have a past-due amount of taxes owed. I have encouraged the local state revenue office to use their 25% garnishment powers. They don't seem very interested. In terms of filing all past taxes, I am current. I just owe for back taxes. I can agree to a wage assignment, however, this does not count toward my 75% wage garnishment exemption. If they will file a garnishment with my employer, i think they move to the front of the garnishment line. That would be great if they would do this as this debt would be paid off in a few months. I'm sitting on the sidelines waiting to see what the state wants to do.

What I am trying to point out is that i am not exactly a ripe fruit for an unsecured private judgment creditor. They have to get in line behind the government garnishments for whatever "seconds" are available.

I believe that the most likely occurence in the future will be for the judgment creditors to sell or assign the judgments for collections.

Bottom line is if you can afford 25% of takehome pay to go toward judgment creditors, this can be beneficial. I can't get out of the student loans or back taxes, so encouraging these folks to get in the front of the garnishment line is quite beneficial to me.

A BK 13 would settle all of my debt issues, but to each his/her own.

Keep in mind much of the above is speculation on my part, since I can't read the minds of my creditors.

Interesting that you brought that up: one of the first attorneys we spoke with suggested the same thing (I guess it's the same). Let one bill get a garnishment for the whole allowable amount, then let the rest shuffle up and get in line to wait their turn, stop paying anything unsecured, and ride it out till we qualify for a Chapter 7. File chapter 7, and strip the garnishment then. It'd be about 6 to 9 months (give or take) of tight[er] living, but in the end it would only serve to benefit us. It's the same effect as a Ch. 13 so why pay trustee and legal fees and get locked into a screw job of a repayment plan when this gives us the option of going for the nuke when we're able to.

[treehugger1]

My experience with American General was a lawsuit. They had a branch located in a nearby town. When I defaulted several years ago, they immediately went to small claims court. They did this themselves and did not hire any legal firm. Pretty simple to file small claims in Oregon and AG knows this. I encouraged them to proceed with wage garnishment, which they did. The ~ 1500 judgment was paid off in a couple of months.

Citifin had a local branch office until a year ago. I haven't seen much suit action out of them in the local courts. I think it is interesting to note that in my area citifin wrote loans up to the small claims amount. With the loss of the branch office, they are out of the small claims suits. An attorney cannot represent either party in small claims in my state. I'm sure when they had the local branch they had folks trained in small claims.


C1 and Citi (credit cards) also have judgments against me. C1 is the most recent. After 6 months citi has still not filed a writ of garnishment. I called C1 and told them to get moving, but they still have done nothing. As of a few weeks ago, the department of education (student loans) has a permanent garnishment order for 15%. I don't know if it is worth C1 or chiti's time to try for the other 10%, as the writs for these folks would only be good for 90 days at a time.

I also have a past-due amount of taxes owed. I have encouraged the local state revenue office to use their 25% garnishment powers. They don't seem very interested. In terms of filing all past taxes, I am current. I just owe for back taxes. I can agree to a wage assignment, however, this does not count toward my 75% wage garnishment exemption. If they will file a garnishment with my employer, i think they move to the front of the garnishment line. That would be great if they would do this as this debt would be paid off in a few months. I'm sitting on the sidelines waiting to see what the state wants to do.

What I am trying to point out is that i am not exactly a ripe fruit for an unsecured private judgment creditor. They have to get in line behind the government garnishments for whatever "seconds" are available.

I believe that the most likely occurence in the future will be for the judgment creditors to sell or assign the judgments for collections.

Bottom line is if you can afford 25% of takehome pay to go toward judgment creditors, this can be beneficial. I can't get out of the student loans or back taxes, so encouraging these folks to get in the front of the garnishment line is quite beneficial to me.

A BK 13 would settle all of my debt issues, but to each his/her own.

Keep in mind much of the above is speculation on my part, since I can't read the minds of my creditors.

[LoadedGuns]

Wow, so they were going to take everything, not just the computers used to secure the loan? Of course, like OHBOY noted, I wonder how being a secured loan might have made this different from unsecured credit cards.

Yes they would photograph everything and auction it, and whatever items sold, they would come collect.

Like I said in my original post. It was secured. I've defaulted on 6 other unsecured loans around the same time and only Crap 1 shows any interest to pursue a judgment.

Also, on a side note. American General was a local retail store location. I applied on line, and signed my life away only 5 miles from my front door. They knew I was a homeowner. I guess they had no interest in a lien on the house?

[LoadedGuns]

'LoadedGuns':

Yes, that is interesting !
However your default was, as you stated, on 'secured' assets, vs. credit card defaults which generally have the 'unsecured' status.

Would love to find out where which state you are located...?

Delaware.

[seFlaDude]

I have a final judgement and a writ of execution entered against me and a debtor's exam this past April and have yet to have them take any action,

[desperatio]

Wow, so they were going to take everything, not just the computers used to secure the loan? Of course, like OHBOY noted, I wonder how being a secured loan might have made this different from unsecured credit cards.

[OHBOY]

'LoadedGuns':

Yes, that is interesting !
However your default was, as you stated, on 'secured' assets, vs. credit card defaults which generally have the 'unsecured' status.

Would love to find out where which state you are located...?

[LoadedGuns]

Well I had a secured interest personal loan with American General for $5K. It was secured by 3 computer I owned. How they got that value I have no idea? Anyway I defaulted, lack of income and a 28% interest rate to boot. SO they got a judgment about 7 month after the default. Almost 1 year later the local sheriff comes knocking and loud with a writ to levy my personal property. I was not at home at the time. I called and they said they have a writ to photograph all my property in my home and auction it off at sheriff sale in the tune of $7K. If I did not comply by allowing them access to my home, they would go back to the judge and have a bench warrant issued for contempt and my bail would be equal to the judgment amount.

In the end I settled 2 days later with AG for $5K cashiers check.

[BrokeIn2010]

True. If they're coming after personal property, they either know or think you're hiding something with some value to it. Which means, either you are hiding assests and you've got bigger problems than your dirty underwear; or there's nothing to find, they'll waste their time, their money, and piss off the local cops when they don't find anything and put the cops of mind not to be to inclined to help out the creditors anymore on stuff like this.

[GoingDown]

Actually, after having gone back over many threads in these fine forums, I think I've only actually found one instance of a writ trying to get at someone's personal property, and in the end the creditor stopped the writ after the individual went to the judge with his exemptions. And even in that case, they were most interested in a car he owned. I'm now wondering, has anyone hear ever heard of a debtor actually having their personal belongings (as in household items) hauled off?

In my situation, I have no car, wages, or bank accounts. I certainly don't have a $5000 painting on the wall or a collection of rare coins, and now I'm starting to see as other have pointed out that a creditor isn't going to try to recoup their losses on my 5 year old computer (which was by no means state of the art when new) and 8 year old Playstation 2.

But I guess when you have very little you become afraid of losing it.

The only times I have heard of it happening is when it is a matter of revenge from the angry ex-spouse in a divorce case or from the angry family of someone killed by manslaughter (wrongful death). Those are very rare instances. I have never heard of a consumer credit card debt rising to this level of revenge and spite. It would be a bad business decision for them. They want to make money, not lose money.

Now, on the other hand, if you get on the phone with a debt collector and tell them you own a painting or a coin collection worth a lot of money, that might come back to haunt you. The only way they would know about it is if you told them about it. Or if you were foolish enough to brag about your assets on Facebook or something like that.

[desperatio]

Actually, after having gone back over many threads in these fine forums, I think I've only actually found one instance of a writ trying to get at someone's personal property, and in the end the creditor stopped the writ after the individual went to the judge with his exemptions. And even in that case, they were most interested in a car he owned. I'm now wondering, has anyone hear ever heard of a debtor actually having their personal belongings (as in household items) hauled off?

In my situation, I have no car, wages, or bank accounts. I certainly don't have a $5000 painting on the wall or a collection of rare coins, and now I'm starting to see as other have pointed out that a creditor isn't going to try to recoup their losses on my 5 year old computer (which was by no means state of the art when new) and 8 year old Playstation 2.

But I guess when you have very little you become afraid of losing it.

[BrokeIn2010]

This is my point exactly.

In theory, it could happen, but...

Why have we never or at least very rarely ever heard of it happening?

#1. It is simply not profitable for the credit card company to sift through mountains of low value items in order to get paid. They are not set up to do this, and it would end up costing them more than it was worth to them. They want only wages, checking accounts, and liens on real estate (and very rarely liens on cars with a lot of equity). Everything else is usually a waste of their time.

#2. The sheriff has serious criminals who pose a major threat to society to go after every day of the year. If his deputies and constables are busy sifting through the smelly contents of my underwear drawer looking for a jewel, while people are getting killed on the streets of Phoenix, then he probably won't get re-elected.


The only times I've ever heard of anything even remotely similar happening is when it is a civil judgment for divorce, child support, and sometimes wrongful death, where the judgment creditor doesn't care about making a profit, they just want revenge, and they are willing to pursue the debtor to the ends of the earth to get back at them. But credit card companies and junk debt buyers want to make a profit, so they go low hanging fruit... checking accounts, wages, and real estate. They don't do things for spite.

Were it me, I'd make a point to make it a PR nightmare for the police dept. and the judgment-creditor. A nice big deal about your tax-dollars being used to bully people for the big credit card companies or some such. How drug dealers are selling to our kids, but Capital One (for example) has the cops going through my house looking for something that doesn't exist.

[GoingDown]

'desperatio':
I have mulled the same scenario, and also find the thought of a sheriff coming to pick up my junk that unnerving. Here in FL it certainly is a possibility as they do allow just that, with the affidavid of exemptions submitted AFTER levy....

However, I agree with others that I too have never heard of it...just would not be too cool to become the first one....

Did read (on this forum) about a guy in NYC where the Marshall tried to get his belongings......

All one can do is take the attitude: 'come and get it'....at least after any first levy, and (hopeful) recuperation of the exempt personal property of family members, everybody knows to put the furniture on rollers for the next judgment creditor that comes knocking with a writ to levy.....

This is my point exactly.

In theory, it could happen, but...

Why have we never or at least very rarely ever heard of it happening?

#1. It is simply not profitable for the credit card company to sift through mountains of low value items in order to get paid. They are not set up to do this, and it would end up costing them more than it was worth to them. They want only wages, checking accounts, and liens on real estate (and very rarely liens on cars with a lot of equity). Everything else is usually a waste of their time.

#2. The sheriff has serious criminals who pose a major threat to society to go after every day of the year. If his deputies and constables are busy sifting through the smelly contents of my underwear drawer looking for a jewel, while people are getting killed on the streets of Phoenix, then he probably won't get re-elected.


The only times I've ever heard of anything even remotely similar happening is when it is a civil judgment for divorce, child support, and sometimes wrongful death, where the judgment creditor doesn't care about making a profit, they just want revenge, and they are willing to pursue the debtor to the ends of the earth to get back at them. But credit card companies and junk debt buyers want to make a profit, so they go low hanging fruit... checking accounts, wages, and real estate. They don't do things for spite.

[WhatMoney]

Sorry for the double-tap, but I just realized that in Arkansas you can use either state OR federal exemptions (which are much more generous) when filing BK. I can't seem to find out if you can also choose to claim state or federal exemptions from judgment execution in states that allow both. Has anyone ever heard of anything like that?

You are restricted to State exemptions for civil judgments, which are only governed by State statutes and processed in State courts, AND to a few Federal law exemptions (Supreme Court Decisions) that apply to all states, such as Social Security benefits, and Federal wage garnishment law (which Arkansas statutes follow).

Since BK is a Federal law processed in Federal court, some states allow Federal or State exemptions. You can not choose the Federal bankruptcy exemptions when you are dealing with a civil judgment in State court, whether or not the state allows Federal exemptions for bankruptcy court.

[jacko]

That is a good question. I to can use the federal exemptions. If I don't file for now, can I use the federal exemption to counter a judgment?

Sorry for the double-tap, but I just realized that in Arkansas you can use either state OR federal exemptions (which are much more generous) when filing BK. I can't seem to find out if you can also choose to claim state or federal exemptions from judgment execution in states that allow both. Has anyone ever heard of anything like that?