Legal Extortion?

[david2]

[newbie2]

Your 17 year old shoplifted and you're being hounded for $200? Something doesn't make sense here. What exactly is the $200 for?

[david2]

The letter states it is for a statutaory civil penalty claim I looked it up online
Florida Statutes Section 772.11 and it looks legal to me

[newbie2]

Wow. I've never heard of that. If your 17 year old works, or has a savings account, I would certainly have him pay for the $200. If not and you cannot pay it (sounds like it would be a hardship to do so) then ask your attorney about including it in your bk.

[fireworks]

It's my understanding that things like speeding tickets are not dischargeable, though that may be a state thing. I imagine that a civil penalty like this would fall under the same rules.

As someone else said, get your kid to pay for it. If he's not working at a job now put him to work around the house doing SOMETHING to compensate you for the $200. Maybe he can mow some neighbor's yards.

[BobMango]

My nephew had a situation where he was caught stealing from K-Mart (as an employee) and he settled with K-Mart for the value of the goods, (well, plus losing the job). They allowed him to pay over time and as long as they didn't have to involve collections or legal action they said they would not pursue any additional charges or penalties.

He paid it off early and then got a letter from a law firm wanting another $600 payment. He never paid it as it was outside the terms of the agreement and there were no repercussions (suits, credit report, collections, etc.) I wrote a letter to the law firm for him and we never heard another word. This was over 5-6 years ago.

So the long way around is that I think that if they do come after you this would be dischargable since it's not a penalty to the court but would be the result of civil action. The trustee will ask if anyone can sue you, say yes and explain.

[ben1381]

Experience with my son too

My 16 year old son was arrested 5 years ago in a similar situation at the local walmart(allegedly for stealing about $12.00 worth of merchandise) and my son I got a similar letter from Walmart demanding $500. I looked up New York Statute's and a civil suit can be brought if I remember correctly for 5 times the value of merchandise stolen. But I'm not certain a parent can be held civilly liable for the actions of a 16 year old or 17 year old . I called Walmart headquarters in Arkansas and when I told them the perp was under 18 they dropped the demand. I almost feel that Walmart is trying to steal from me when they seem to ask for more than the law allows but I didn't attempt to pursue criminal charges against Walmart for extortion.

[david2]

[DYLAN150]

I read about this same kind of collection over two years ago. Seem's like it is fairly common for major stores to do so.

[BCA2009]

Well, if the FL stautes allow for a specific amount (five times the value or whatever) and that's what they are asking for, I'd let them sue my son. What's the worst that can happen? You go to court and then pay the amount. Can they sue you as his Guardian? I don't know the answer to that. If they didn't call the police at the time, they would have a hard time pressing criminal charges now i believe. Did you sign anything admitting he stole the product?

Anyway, I would probably call their bluff and list them in your BK. You can list anybody as a potential creditor. It won't cost anyting to add one more to the list.

The only thing I'd worry about is if they did take you to court and they won, would you have to pay there attorney fees and court costs? Maybe your BK attorney could answer that for you.

Either way, I'd call the bluff for a while and see how it progressed.

But, I wouldn't tell my sone I'm trying to get out of paying. I would make him save and give you the money, you could then give it Walmart or a charity or something, but he definitely needs to learn there are consequences for stealing.

[DYLAN150]

This seem's to be a very big business. It's all about making money. They are making a "civil demand". Accordingly to several sites, the store can sue you for damages and a penalty. This can be many times the value of the stolen goods plus attorney fee's.

[Mensa1]

Have you already filed a Ch 7, or is it an eminent event?
If Ch 7 has not been filed, or if filed and the event did occur before your filing date, then this claim should be dischargable by Ch 7 Bk. If so, then I would write the counselor a cordial letter advising them of your intent to file Bk within the near future, stating specific time frame if you know, or case number if you have already filed and the event is prior to the filing. They will not waste time if they are convinced that they will be discharged in Ch 7 bk.

The statute does CLEARLY obligate the parents of a minor children, so you are on the hook here. This is a good article about the statute written by Jeffrey A. Adelman, Esq

[BKOnce]

Civil or criminal?

If they did not called police before (because only small $12 item and he was a kid?), or did they took picture of stolen item and made police report filed?, if they let the boy go easy then they didn't have enough evidence in court (for filing complaint before) and they've lost chance for criminal by then. Now, only civil choice left for them to pursue.

[SMinGA]

I'm guessing something was signed when your son was picked up @ the store. Something where your wife acknowledged the crime in order to avoid having the police involved.