Unperfected Title-for HHM and Dam

[Minnymouth]

Minnymouth in Ky here,
Lost my home in recent Chapter 7, Chapter 13 could not do.
Long story short - Deed on land was valid but title on mobile home was never recorded at the courthouse and no liens taken by the bank. (Title Company did a lousy job at closing). Legally, I did not own the mobile home all 7 years (just the land), mobile home still in name of seller. Yet Trustee still took it all for resale. Question, how can he TAKE SOMETHING (like the mobile home being in someone elses name), that is not legally mine and sell it.
Did not know about any of this till I claimed bankruptcy. Then SURPRISE at the creditors meeting!!!! Trustee found all this.
So now the bank owns the land (they had a lien on land only) and the Trustee has control of the mobile home (wants me to BUY IT BACK at "full market value") or goes to auction.
My lawyer failed to represent me in my best interest. We never even went to court, he never reponded to any summons, or adversary complaints when they filed to take the home. He let it all slide by and when I asked WHY, I was told I HAD NO CASE - suggested I find an apartment.
I feel ALL MY LAWYER HAS DOWN IS - COVER HIS OWN ASS FOR NOT CHECKING SOMETHING AS IMPORTANT AS A LIEN. HOW STUPID!!!!!!
Bad Chapter 7 - devistating to me, mentally, emotionally, physically, and financially. I had over $80,000 invested in my home in payments, additions and improvements.
LOST IT ALL..... Been going on for almost a year now.
Have brought in a "silent lawyer" to work with me negotiating with my lawyer, trustee and bank. Trying to buy my land back and my home back. Silent lawyer is "friend" of many years - retired. He is offering advise daily. He suggested that he step in a negotiate for me as my representative. I intend to give him legal right too. Sorry about my lawyers luck.
Do not have money to hire another lawyer and fight all this... am single, 56 years old and on limited income.
Bankruptcy was due to 4 years of caring for invalid parent at home. Expenses were overwhelming, spent 4 years working two jobs after her death trying to "dig out".....then my health started failing.
Bankruptcy was a "last resort" - fought it for 4 years.
My lawyer told me from DAY ONE that I WOULD NOT LOOSE MY HOME......
WELL - SURPRISE I DID..... no thanks to his help....
Any suggestions anyone??
How can the Trustee "take" something that is not legally mine and sell it. It is still recorded as belonging to the seller, title an all.
This forum has really helped me over the last year. Lots of moral support and well wishes from all of you.
Thanks so much
:o

[HHM]

First, don't hate me, but let me defend your lawyer for a minute, typically, doing title searchs and responsding to adversary proceedings is outside his scope of representation. But it sounds like he may have dropped the ball to a certain degree.

That title issue is messy. And I really don't have any good idea's for you. How long did you live in the Mobile Home? If the BK case is still open, you might be able to file a motion to determine proper title. At the very least, you have some sort of equitable title to the Mobile home, regardless of the recorded deed (this will depend on State Law).

[Minnymouth]

Unperfected Title for HHM

You decided to defend my lawyers actions. If I were a lawyer and accepted your money to represent you - then that's what I would do. I would also take the time to verify that something as "important as a lien" was valid. The adversary complaint was a part of the Chapter 7 case, my lawyers actions of letting it "slide" till they took a judgement against me was uncalled for. He should have contacted me to see what I wanted to do. His failure to represent me "in MY BEST INTEREST" cost me my home and a great financial loss.
I had been in my home 7 years.
Presently case is still active - negotiating possible buy back of land and home thru an investor.
The bank who loaned the money to buy the home, and the mortgage company who bought the loan, the Title Company who "screwed the closing up" are all responsible for "lender negligence........
I had purchased title insurance at closing to protect my interest in my home and thanks to my lawyer did not have the opportunity to appear in court to present it.
I was deprived of the opportunity to appear in court or to be represented in court. My lawyer just DID NOTHING. He attended the 341 Meeting and that was it.
Also since all was discharged and my home was taken, the bank has contacted me 3 TIMES in regard to the loan against the home with them suggesting I make arrangements to catch up my payments. I believe this is "harrassment", they are NOT SUPPOSED TO BE CONTACTING ME. This Bank is the same bank that failed to perfect their title and lien. They have no lien against the home only the land.
Yes it is a mess and very nerve wrecking. But all will come out in the end.
Hopefully we can salvage my home thanks to a "friend" of mine.
Thanks for the comments, appreciate your interest and well wishes.
Minnymouth

[Minnymouth]

Question???

Does the "judgemet" the court grants the Trustee to take my home allow him to also come back later and take a lien against my home if I'm able to purchase it back from the court and/or purchase a new home?
I was reading the thread where you were discussing judgments and liens....
No one in my case had filed a lawsuit or had been granted a judgement against me - only the Trustee in the process of getting a judgement from the court to take my home.
Will not BUY another home if they can come in and take a lien against it to justify previous BK debts.

[mmp2004]

minnymouth

hey it looks like i am in the same situation that you were in. I recently tryed to file bankruptcy on my credit cards and my layer told me if i did i would loose my mobile home because their was never a title made to mine. When i bought my MB the title was supossed to of been surrendered and looks like it was not so i do not know what to do. he is going to try to call Kentucky Housing who i have my loan with and see if we can get a title and then see if they will put a lien on the home... This is so upsetting to me because i am only 26 and this is my first home and i do not want to loose my home.. But it sounds like i do have a better lawyer than you did because the first thing he told me was it their was no title then i could loose my MH.......... Wish me luck :

[mmp2004]

can i still get a title

can i still get a title for my mobile home if one has never been issued and the place i bought the MH from has went out of business???? if so will i still loose my home??? how long do i have before my creditors will sue me????
please help i am out of options and time

[Minnymouth]

unperfected title

Regarding title on MH - pull off serial #, make model. Go to courthouse and have them run a ownership check on the serial #. This may produce what you need. Then apply for title in your name.
BE SURE YOU GET THAT TITLE IN YOU NAMEwith the lien against it if one. Otherwise the Trustee considers it an asset - free and clear - to sell even if your name is not on it. At least your lawyer is trying to help you - but you may have to do most of the leg work....
My deed showed land only - no mobile home - yet the mobile home was bought sitting on the land. My title still had the sellers name on it.
FIRST, you need to get the title corrected, then hopefully it will be exempt for you.
Its been a year, and I'm still fighting to get my home back. Trustee now owns it, and the bank holds a lien on the land.
Mine was supposed to be a "simple Chapter 7", me reaffirm on my home. IT DIDN'T HAPPEN.....
Had been in my home 7 years.
Keep me posted - will help if I can - but remember the
"strong survive".....and keep an eye on what your lawyer does. I've had to call in another lawyer to help clean up the MESS.
Good Luck - chin up...........

[Minnymouth]

An addition

It amazes me that they can take something that's NOT LEGALLY MINE - according to the paperwork - and RESELL IT AS MINE TO PAY DEBTS. DUH........it still legally belongs to the SELLER.... I could not take a loan against it, sell it, nor could anyone take a lien against it if its not legally mine. Thats like me being able to sell YOUR HOUSE without you knowing it......
Something with this is NOT RIGHT...
A BIG LEGAL MESS HERE - still trying to untangle and hopefully buy it back....Time will tell.
If you have questions - please ask this Forum.....and your lawyer. If your lawyer won't answer questions - BEWARE.
Good luck, keep in touch.

[Minnymouth]

Status on Chp 7

Everything discharged - home and land taken.
Trying to buy it all back thanks to a friend.
Otherwise - its all down the tubes.
Trustee has offered home back to me at reasonable price, still waiting on Bank's decision about the land and what it takes to buy it back.
But hopefully I can still salvage it all.
Its a shame - I have invested $80,000 in my home - land/mobile home/improvements to property over 7 years.
NOW I HAVE TO BUY IT ALL BACK - or take a total loss on it.
My lawyer said "a simple Chapter 7" -NOT HARDLY.
CAUTION - Be Aware of "what" you lawyer is "doing" and "not doing" for you!
I hope non of the rest of you EVER encounter this situation.
Very hard on the nerves. I'm supposed to retire in 5 years. SURE...
Check those titles folks - FIRST THING - and any liens you have against your property.....make sure they are correct BEFORE YOU FILE.
Good Luck

[HRx]

that's to bad...........you should have had the opportunity to pay for a search at the beginning of the home purchase process!

[Minnymouth]

Attn Todd

Todd, title search was done at purchasing of home/land.
Title was transferred at closing - but title company failed to record at title court house and failed to put Bank lien against property/home.
Thus title to home still being in sellers name after my purchase 7 years ago.
Only thing recorded at courthouse was deed to land with
Bank holding a lien against land only. The bank was supposed to have a lien against house and land.
I also paid "title insurance" at closing as a buyer to "protect my interest" in case of problems later.
My lawyer was very insistent on keeping this out of court - said "I had no case - the house was free and clear".
But legally it wasn't even mine because of paperwork on it. Legally the Seller still owned it 7 years later.
How can they take and sell something thats NOT EVEN MINE LEGALLY and sell it as mine?
Had I "had my day in court" this would have been brought out along with title insurance. But my lawyer insisted - I had no case....
So I lost my home and my investment - all down the tubes.
Hopefully I can buy it all back, thanks to a friend.
Chapter 7 was not a "fresh start" for me - it was a complete "wipeout".
$80,000 financial loss (downpayment, improvements, payments), 7 years of hard work in house/land/garage improvements.
The strong survive and I will too. But I'm not a happy camper - I feel like I have been "royally screwed over", by the bank, title company, my lawyer, and the court.
Not been a good year.
Sad part - I retire in 5 years, too old to start again - no time, no more money.

Bankruptcy has been going on all most ONE FULL YEAR AND STILL GOING. A year of stress, nerves, and per panic. This has been extremely hard to deal with alone.
But THANKS TO THIS FORUM I have had moral support from all of you.
THANKS TO ALL OF YOU FROM THE BOTTOM OF MY HEART!

[The Big B???]

Minny,

Off topic a bit but I wanted to reply to you. Trust me when I tell you that this too shall pass and you will find happiness and stress free days. I spent 3 years of my life tormented by my ex wife. I was forced to travel back and forth across the country every month for a year to spend time with my infant son. I never thought I could handle all of those miles driving alone, yet I did.

I was pushed to the brink emotionally and financially by the experience and by her need to keep the legal battle going in an effort to ruin my life. I never thought the divorce process would end, but it did.

I lost the love of my life due to the stress and pressures that my ex wife put on our relationship and ultimately we broke up a year ago. I never thought I would recover from that, but I did and in fact the love of my life is now my second wife as of New Year's Eve just passed.

I started with ZERO custody of my son 4 years ago. And I was so frightened that he would never know me let alone get to spend time with me, learn from me and truly have me as his father. I fought with every penny I had to be able to be in my own son'e life. I jumped through every hoop the system placed before me to prove that I am a capable and loving parent. I never thought the day would ever come when I would actually have the opportunity to be my son's father, but it did. I now have my son over 40% of the time and at 4 years old, we have an incredible bond already that even with her constant brainwashing his mother can never break.

So now I find myself standing before another of life's challenges. My wife has come down with breast cancer and starts chemo tomorrow as a matter of fact. Interestingly enough, I think her illness has brought us even closer together. As I stand here today I think to myself, I wonder if we will get through this? But deep down inside I know that we will. And when we do there will be a much better life on the other side.

My decision to go forward with this BK is just another obstacle to overcome, and life offers many. I no longer worry or panic. I find the humor and good in everything that comes my way. In the end I just view it as enjoying all that life has to offer, experiencing a color at a time off the painter's pallet if you will.

It's never too late to rebuild Minny. Your just going to be building something different this time.

Good luck to you.

[Minnymouth]

Sounds like your slate has been full of problems over the years too. I too have had my share - I have dealt with being a caretaker for 4 years for a parent and have buried both -but I had no problem handling those situations (and had lots of problems) cause I worked also.
I was always in control of the situations.
The bankruptcy thing was out of my control completely - I had "no say" in it. Tried to backout when they discovered the title - but they wouldn't let me. Tried to do a Chapter 13 and my lawyer said NO.
Being out of control is what has destroyed me. I'm not depressed or anything - just pure MAD.
Mad because its all out of my control.
But I will survive - I always have and smile and get on with life.
Thanks for the input and my best wishes for you and yours on your next challenge in life.
Minnymouth