Need to file Pro Se in Virginia

[markinva]

In VA here, too but doing a Chap 13 in the Western District - Big differences in income limits, exemptions, allowable expenses, etc. between Eastern and Western Districts. At least take advantage of the free consultations that atty's offer. To take on a 7 case, they want their fee up front - in the 3K range. WRT to the car, take it to Carmax to get a written offer use can use to prove value. We all love our cars but try not to get too hung up on it - it's just a piece of property. Following is pasted from the Bankruptcy Law Network which I found useful for basic research. When you are considering a trip, usually, you make substantial preparations in anticipation of that trip. You make travel arrangements; you make sure you have a place to stay; you make reservations for any activities in which you wish to participate. You will often make significant plans and preparations for any “big” event. Bankruptcy is no different. It is a significant life event that demands some thought and preparation before you embark on it.

In talking with potential bankruptcy clients, it seems that a lot of them wait until the last minute before contacting a bankruptcy lawyer to find out how bankruptcy may help them. While visiting a bankruptcy lawyer most likely does not rank high on most people’s “bucket list,” if you are struggling financially, it most likely makes sense to determine if and how bankruptcy can help you sooner rather than later.

So, how can “preparing” for bankruptcy help? First, you will need to have the fees for the lawyer and for the court available. For now, for a chapter 7 filing, just the filing fee is $306.00. Additionally, before you file, you must complete a consumer credit counseling session and get the certification that must be filed with the court. If you “fail to plan” for your bankruptcy filing by finding out what you need ahead of time, when your car is on the verge of getting repo’d, you may not have the time and/or money to retain a bankruptcy lawyer.

Second, you can carefully go over your income and expenses and see where the trouble lies. Certainly a bankruptcy lawyer can help you identify the problem (with appropriate information) but you also need to know how you got into this financial mess. Some problems are easy to identify–temporary loss of income; extraordinary medical bills; overspending for a bit, etc. Bankruptcy can assist in overcoming those past problems but you need to be aware of the problem so that you can avoid it in the future. Bankruptcy is designed to be a “fresh start.” You can greatly assist in obtaining that “fresh start” by breaking or modifying some of the habits that perhaps got you here in the first place.

Third, make sure you know who you owe and how much. Find out if there is any collateral associated with the debts and gather up loan documents. Your lawyer will need this but, more importantly, you need to know your own financial picture. Credit reports are freely available and can be a big help. Also, if lawsuits or foreclosures have been filed against you, make sure you have that paperwork–all of it! It is important!

Finally, change your mindset. In dealing with individuals facing financial problems, it is often much more difficult instead of dealing with distressed businesses. That is because a business looks at assets and liabilities and can make a rational decision as to whether keeping an asset is worth the corresponding liability. Understandably, people are attached to their “things.” But, after all, they are just “things” and you have to consider carefully whether retaining a “thing” is worth the potential stress and headache. As an example, if you suffered a decrease in income and you have two relatively late model cars. No one wants to give up one or two cars but sometimes it is better to surrender a vehicle or two in order to keep your house (if that is important to you). There will be some emotional attachment to some “things” but it is imperative that you do this. Determining what is important to you is important for your bankruptcy lawyer in setting achievable goals for your bankruptcy filing.

Finally, do some research. There is a lot of information about bankruptcy that is freely available. However, you should exercise extreme caution in considering the information. Not that the information is inaccurate (some info may be outdated or simply inapplicable) but it takes an experienced profession to know what is appropriate and what is not. But, by familiarizing yourself with some basic bankruptcy information, you will be in a better position to appreciate and assist your bankruptcy lawyer in setting realistic and achievable goals.

After all, the real goal of a bankruptcy filing is a “fresh start.” Good luck to you!

[ValleYum]

Thanks for catching all of that with the car, Don. I was unaware of the cross-collateralization when I gave that tidbit of advice as you noted.

Now it will be a new part of my caveats on 'car advice' to ask if a vehicle is financed at a credit union. LOL

Hope your weekend is great!

[doni49]

Just an update with this credit union. I had my auto loan with them as well, which is now paid in full. This letter is becasue of the unsecured loan of $14k that I am to go to GD Court for this coming week.

I received a letter from them today:

As of Sept 28,2011 the above loan was paid in full. We wanted to let you know that your title has not been released for one or more of the following reasons:

Charged off account
Deliquent account

The cross collateralization clause in the "What the Security Interest Covers/Cross Collateral Provisions" section of your Loan and Security Agreements Disclouse Statements states the following about your title:... The security interest also secures any other loans, including any credit card loan, you have now or receive in the future from us and any other amounts you owe is for any reason now or in the future, except any loan secured by your principal residence ...We will not be able to release your title until the matter has been taken care of. if you have questions or of we can be of assistance, please call us at XXX

Any thoughts would be great More stress to the already burning fire

The CC clause is a killer aint it! You basically have a $14,000 loan secured by your car. Now since the car is worth less than what you owe, the exemptions will do you NO GOOD. If you really need/want to keep the car, there are only two options:

1. Reaffirmation: You agree to continue to pay the loan after discharge. You MAY be able to negotiate the balance down.
2. 722 Redemption: Section 722 of the U.S. BK code basically allows for a secured debt (many different types of security--one being a car) to be split into two separate debts. The first being secured up to the value of the security. And the second debt being the portion of the original debt that is over and above the value of the security. This second debt will be discharged along with the other dischargable, unsecured debts. The trick with this is that you need to pay the full value of the car NOW.

I'm sorry to say this but if you're still unemployed I don't see you keeping the car.

[doni49]

So, as long as your car is worth less than 6k you are in great shape. If it is worth a little more, you can use the state's Wild Card (in lieu of using the full homestead exemption) to (hopefully) help cover the additional amount.

Be very careful on this. You indicated in another thread that the CU is holding title to the car due to a personal loan you have with them. I've been told that MOST CUs (and mine was one of them) have cross-collateralization clauses in all of their loan documents. What this basically means is that when you get a car loan with them, the car also acts as collateral for ANY CURRENT OR FUTURE LOAN you have with them. If that's the case then even though you may THINK you're car is paid for, they can still take it from you. Read every word of every loan document you have from them. If you're not 100% positive that you know the answer, consult an attorney. Go to one with whom you have not already consulted and ask them for their opinion about your loan docs.

EDIT: When I started my reply, I didn't even realize there was a second page. After submitting the reply, I now see the second page and you're already discussing this issue. Sorry to have jumped the gun.

[souprebel]

Just an update with this credit union. I had my auto loan with them as well, which is now paid in full. This letter is becasue of the unsecured loan of $14k that I am to go to GD Court for this coming week.

I received a letter from them today:

As of Sept 28,2011 the above loan was paid in full. We wanted to let you know that your title has not been released for one or more of the following reasons:

Charged off account
Deliquent account

The cross collateralization clause in the "What the Security Interest Covers/Cross Collateral Provisions" section of your Loan and Security Agreements Disclouse Statements states the following about your title:... The security interest also secures any other loans, including any credit card loan, you have now or receive in the future from us and any other amounts you owe is for any reason now or in the future, except any loan secured by your principal residence ...We will not be able to release your title until the matter has been taken care of. if you have questions or of we can be of assistance, please call us at XXX

Any thoughts would be great More stress to the already burning fire

[souprebel]

:-) You're most welcome!!!!!! Then what you'd do is use $1,500 of your Homestead exemption for your car, plus your full VA car exemption...
The rest should be more than fine!!!

HOWEVER - like LadyintheRed said - do NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! rush the filing - I know showing up in GD court is NOT what you want to do, but stick to the script!!!! do NOT admit anything and they have to give you a trial date about 1 to 2 months out....

Sounds good

I'll admit it scares me to go to GD Court and not admit anything. So I'll have to practice that! It is my debt...but I also paid these money grubbers like 12k on this 14k loan, that they still want the whole 14k!! Insane rate of 24%!

[souprebel]

My intent was never to be hurtful, Soup. My prior posts on this site sustain that (actually you congratulated someone earlier today who I spent a lot of time helping) so I will stand by what I said to you and apologize if you took in in the wrong way - darn written words without inflection.

But, I never said you should get a lawyer - only that you appeared (to me) to be in no shape to file by the 18th. I did mention that I had a lawyer.

You never really mentioned exemptions - just that you wondered whether you could keep your car, so I was unaware from your prior postings (because I did look) of what you knew about your car or what you had researched.

Again, my heart was in the right place even if I sounded like a condescending asshat.

Take care.

Yes, and I wish I WAS that person (LOL), I wish I was in their shoes... with all of this behind me and my stomach free from the acid burn I am feeling. I've had a migraine every single day this week from this and the stress of this judgement. Take a 2 hour nap, 3 advil, put cold ice on my head...it really sucks LOL.

Oh, I know you meant well...plus I like the word asshat...it makes me laugh Plus, I don't think your an asshat at all. You were only trying to make me realize and not screw up ;)

If I could hire a lawyer, I would. Unless the cash falls from the sky, my only option is to file by myself. Scary and daunting task and I'm trying to be positive from reading all the Pro Se filers on here.

[IamOld]

:-) You're most welcome!!!!!! Then what you'd do is use $1,500 of your Homestead exemption for your car, plus your full VA car exemption...
The rest should be more than fine!!!

HOWEVER - like LadyintheRed said - do NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! rush the filing - I know showing up in GD court is NOT what you want to do, but stick to the script!!!! do NOT admit anything and they have to give you a trial date about 1 to 2 months out....

[souprebel]

this is a link for pro-bono or sliding scale legal help for VA BK court

Here in Maryland they have free 1 hour consultations with attorneys at the courthouse every Thursday from 10-2 perhaps there is such a program in VA.

Ohhh, thank you!

I will look at this right now

[souprebel]

Excellent - then you have $5K for anything that you like to use including cash!!!!! (bank account) - plus there are specific exemptions for clothes, wedding bands, etc.

Thank you IamOld. I ran the KellyBB on my car and it came out at $6500. Cash in the bank, what's that (LOL), wedding bands (none... since 1995) I have the usual furniture and a treadmill.

[ValleYum]

My intent was never to be hurtful, Soup. My prior posts on this site sustain that (actually you congratulated someone earlier today who I spent a lot of time helping) so I will stand by what I said to you and apologize if you took in in the wrong way - darn written words without inflection.

But, I never said you should get a lawyer - only that you appeared (to me) to be in no shape to file by the 18th. I did mention that I had a lawyer.

You never really mentioned exemptions - just that you wondered whether you could keep your car, so I was unaware from your prior postings (because I did look) of what you knew about your car or what you had researched.

Again, my heart was in the right place even if I sounded like a condescending asshat.

Take care.

[malf1204]

http://apps.americanbar.org/legalservices/findlegalhelp/freehelp.cfm?id=VA

this is a link for pro-bono or sliding scale legal help for VA BK court

Here in Maryland they have free 1 hour consultations with attorneys at the courthouse every Thursday from 10-2 perhaps there is such a program in VA.

[IamOld]

Excellent - then you have $5K for anything that you like to use including cash!!!!! (bank account) - plus there are specific exemptions for clothes, wedding bands, etc.

[souprebel]

Soup!!!!!!!!! Car exemption is NOW $5,000 in VA - changed this past summer!!!!!!!!!!!

Also, VA has a $5,000 homestead exemption - if your house is underwater (no equity) or you rent, you can use that $5K for anything BUT you have to file the appropriate homestead deed (a form) with your local CIRCUIT court BEFORE at the latest your 341 hearing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hello!

Thank you and that is great news! I rent, no house.

[IamOld]

Soup!!!!!!!!! Car exemption is NOW $5,000 in VA - changed this past summer!!!!!!!!!!!

Also, VA has a $5,000 homestead exemption - if your house is underwater (no equity) or you rent, you can use that $5K for anything BUT you have to file the appropriate homestead deed (a form) with your local CIRCUIT court BEFORE at the latest your 341 hearing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!