Most Americans Still Believe in Homeownership, Poll Says

[catleg]

Also, even when you own your home debt-free, it can always be seized from you for non payment of property taxes. So even when you're debt free, you're not. In NJ these are substantial amounts, probably an average 10,000/year/house. So it's like servicing an extra 200k loan you can never pay off.

[treehugger1]

I have owned a few houses here and there, but about 20 years ago, I realized I should only own/buy a house for a "home." In other words, I believed then, ans it has served me fine in this downturn, that one should not buy a house as an investment. Buy a house as a home. My stock/bonds/metals portfolios have fully recovered plus some extra since everything went to hell. However, in my area, homes are still down 25% - 30% of their "value." Well, their value is exactly what they are currently worth, nothing more, nothing less. Be patient as housing prices will slowly grow again, but a smart homeowner should expect no more than .5% -.7% value increase per year, if they are lucky. In addition, build your retirement on the side. Don't let your housing value be part of your retirement plans in this new era. Just my not-so-humble opinion.

I have to add that most folks will never actually "own" a home. What I mean is that they will never have that deed/title paid-in-full. Without the deed free and clear, the house still belongs to the bank, like iit or not. I get really sick of hearing folks say, "I own my own ome." In my opinion, until you have the final deed in your name only, with no outstanding debt against the house, you are simply renting from the bank.

[catleg]

Apples offshores all the "good" mfg jobs.
Google launders its profits through Ireland and the Netherlands.
California is productive, but megacorps HQ'd there are skilled at keeping the profits elsewhere.
Look at MSFT..it is doing the Skype purchase with overseas funds.
And by the way all the employees are being laid off and their options terminated...they get nothingburger out of the deal.
ND may be doing some things right vs California but sadly as it turns out there is no way to legislate that these companies
keep good jobs in America..their lawyers are too smart.
So is it then true that the only good states to live in are the "extraction" states where something is pulled from the ground?
No particular opinion expressed here, just frustration.

[banca rotta]

Are you serious? California if ranked as a country has the fifth largest economy in the world. North Dakota receives $2 back for every $1 sent to the federal gov't. California, has Google, HP, Apple, Intel, Oracle, FaceBook, Twitter, Craigs List etc.. Good luck living in North Dakota were housing is hard to come buy.

Yes I am serious. The good people at google, facebook and the rest have to eat.

The point I am making is everyone needs food and energy. Other then restaurants that were kept open by loose credit, the food industry and the states that produce food were never in a bubble. However if farm subsidies happen to end when the US defaults food prices may soar again.

California on the other hand is heading for the mother of all crashes since they have a 500 billion dollar unfunded pension system. This state issues IOU's.

California needs a few hundred Googles to generate enough jobs to close down all of those tent cities and to balance it's budget.

[jacko]

Are you serious? California if ranked as a country has the fifth largest economy in the world. North Dakota receives $2 back for every $1 sent to the federal gov't. California, has Google, HP, Apple, Intel, Oracle, FaceBook, Twitter, Craigs List etc.. Good luck living in North Dakota were housing is hard to come buy.

True tobee43 it won't crash as hard in an area that didn't have a bubble.

Farm states such as N. Dakota or Oil rich states have a true productive capacity. The industries and jobs over their are the real deal vs. a California burger flipper also flipping real estate.

The only issue the productive states may have after the bubbles fully burst will be all of the unemployed every where else will head over to these farm states and pick mellons and cabbage for spare change just like the Mexicans do now which will drive down wages of the current workers.

In a nutshell the USA must create a productive economy like we had and out law bubble creation or at least let the bubble masters go down with their ships and don't save them.

[banca rotta]

True tobee43 it won't crash as hard in an area that didn't have a bubble.

Farm states such as N. Dakota or Oil rich states have a true productive capacity. The industries and jobs over their are the real deal vs. a California burger flipper also flipping real estate.

The only issue the productive states may have after the bubbles fully burst will be all of the unemployed every where else will head over to these farm states and pick mellons and cabbage for spare change just like the Mexicans do now which will drive down wages of the current workers.

In a nutshell the USA must create a productive economy like we had and out law bubble creation or at least let the bubble masters go down with their ships and don't save them.

[dspii]

Bottom line....politics and greed found a way into America's sacred investment vehicles. Individuals and families from all walks of life could work hard, save money and purchase a home. Over time that investment would grow through sweat equity and a would increase in value "naturally" over time...the good times and bad. Real estate was a safe place for the commoner to build wealth for his family and offer the security and stability that families need.

As I look back 13 years ago when I bought my home, I saved money for a down payment, used equity I had in my prior home, a stable job and decent credit. These basic fundamentals of a mortgage seemed to have been lost some five years ago. Last November, I put the home on the market due to a job relocation. In May an offer was put on the home....I paid $140k in 1998....in 2011 the offer was $102k. I wasn't expecting to walk away with any money...except maybe the mortgage paid in full! Three CMA's revealed it was a semi-fair offer.........13 years and my home was worth $38k less than I paid for it!

Times are tough and sh1t happens...I'm an adult, sometimes you loose......but at the scope of disaster for the housing market is beyond what I could have ever imagined. Politics and greed allowed so many companies to write loans that they knew could never be paid, although they continued.....they had no reason not to. They immediately sold the loans to the government and walked away with billions in fee's and commissions. You probably have noticed that the all the strip mall mortgage companies no longer exist....I wonder why. I have many friends that bought during this time, some of whom are still in the home making payments....some walked because the interest reset or they were stupid and bought 2X what they could afford, in hopes of a better future.

[tobee43]

Home ownership is still good if you wait until the current depression is at it's peak.

The current real estate bubble began to blow up 1999/2000 and once it's been fully deflated only then will it be a good move to get back into owning a home.

Just look at what's happening with so many Americans. College grads are getting low paying jobs (if they get any jobs), they are living home with parents a lot longer and in doing this their are less and less house holds being created.

Inflation and taxes are wiping out the middle class's disposable income, so fewer people can move and upgrade their current homes.

All this stagnation is keeping home prices depressed and will continue to decrease prices until McDonalds workers can afford a home.

My best guess is home values will crash to about 20% of their 2005 peak and at that time it will be a great time to buy a home.

See who says I'm always negative? The youth will own cheap homes while earning low income and their parents who caused the bubble will all be upside down in their homes.

Somebody wins somebody loses. The banksters will probably be the biggest losers since they won't have the resources to forclose on 100 million homes.

i very agree with so much you have stated.

one thing i find interesting these peeks and valleys vary as to what part of the country you live in. we have seen some states really not being effected as greatly as others in example unemployment stats or foreclosure stats...i.e. North Dakota ....and Vermont as examples...we don't see many on this forum from Wyoming..( see http://financialedge.investopedia.co...n-America.aspx for source info).

however for those states like Nevada, Florida, Arizona and much of Calif....i think we have just a bit to go before we hit that all time low (although i tend to believe at this point florida is at it's bottom, at least one would hope while seeing a once 800k home for less than 200k), but we'll have to wait it out to see.

the ONLY sails in this is when you stated...

Somebody wins somebody loses. The banksters will probably be the biggest losers since they won't have the resources to foreclose on 100 million homes.

not that i hate banks for no reason. i have good reason, a solid and good foundation for my hatred of the banking industry and their greed. i don't want to list all my reasons, but, i'm certainly most can make their own personal lists and we would match up like the match came....or family feud...LOL!!

[banca rotta]

Home ownership is still good if you wait until the current depression is at it's peak.

The current real estate bubble began to blow up 1999/2000 and once it's been fully deflated only then will it be a good move to get back into owning a home.

Just look at what's happening with so many Americans. College grads are getting low paying jobs (if they get any jobs), they are living home with parents a lot longer and in doing this their are less and less house holds being created.

Inflation and taxes are wiping out the middle class's disposable income, so fewer people can move and upgrade their current homes.

All this stagnation is keeping home prices depressed and will continue to decrease prices until McDonalds workers can afford a home.

My best guess is home values will crash to about 20% of their 2005 peak and at that time it will be a great time to buy a home.

See who says I'm always negative? The youth will own cheap homes while earning low income and their parents who caused the bubble will all be upside down in their homes.

Somebody wins somebody loses. The banksters will probably be the biggest losers since they won't have the resources to forclose on 100 million homes.

[tobee43]

Had instant equity on what is now our out of state rental house because husband was the builder when we moved into it 5 years ago, now its 30,000 underwater because the housing has dropped so much in that area. We are surrendering that property in the chapter 7 and have missed our first payments (1st and 2nd mtgs) this month. Our current home is current on payments (loan mod since last June), was built by my husband 2 years ago (moved in 1 month before his very first lay off ever!), has about $70,000 in equity at this time and we are trying to sell it right now before our filing date (husband wants to try). Between the 2 of us (second marriage for both of us) we have both owned several homes in several states over the course of our lives (late 40's). We have come to realize that its just "stuff", can be built or bought again if we choose but right now they are both PIA's! We have decided that after the filing later this year and then he graduates next May we do not want to be tied down with "stuff" that is dependent with what is going on with everyone else. We will happily rent and let it be someone elses headache and have the freedom to move wherever my husbands new career will take us. Even our 8 year old tells us that as long as the 3 of us are healthy and together he is happy. We are proud of what we built and have been here over 2 years now but its time to move and do what we need to do, our homes do not define us. We also cannot wait around until the market comes back around as it is clear that it will be another 3 to 5 years before things right themselves.

i see you are now in north carolina. our daughter moved there last year and shoot, the prices are still really high there. i begged her to buy, lucky for her she never listens to me...LOL!! she wanted to wait to see if they liked the area and now her husband got laid off so they are picking up and moving closer to where she works....and he's going back for yet ANOTHER masters degree. they moved to nc for him to teach, and they get up and sell her house up north, or took a land contract on it, and moved down. he got laid off two weeks ago! he tried over 5 years to get a teaching job up north, nc had a ton of openings...wish they (my daughter and her husband) had wondered why there were so many teaching jobs open. we can answer that now, no collective bargaining....no protection of job...etc. and on and on.

lucky he's always worked at a funeral home as a second job ...kinda funny a big man like that wiping little 6 year noses by day and picking up dead bodies at night. anyway, his personality has always been best with the dead, however, another masters to be a director was going to cost them 30k, now in NC since he already has two masters they are going to certify him in an 18 month masters program for 5k!! one thing that never stops...people being born, dying and drinking!! ( i suppose those employed with toilet paper companies may be included with this group), but some things are simply not as effected when an economy goes south!

[tobee43]

Well, as time goes by you'll build some and when you're a little old(er) lady, your kids will be glad it's there. They'll need it so they can pay someone to put your bib on and feed you the soup.

ROFL!!!!!!! i'm not going with either of my kids...LOL!! nope, just kidding, i have great kids, but i don't want the bib...i didn't make them where them, so i hope they won't make me.

and, you are correct, it will build up on it's own. actually since we purchase it the oddest thing happened here in this sub division. we just had one of the houses sell for over 100k more than all the other houses??? now first we are thinking about those rip off stories etc. but since i'm on the HOA finance committee, i pulled the paper work and this is what i found.

this was again, (just like ours) an owner financed property, most likely sold to a person who could not get a mortgage. i don't know if you recall, but i was asking you about our english friends who were combatting immigration...actually, then ended up, soon after i posted that, and left two properties here, after owning one for over a dozen years and the other over ten years. it appears now the scotts and english are leaving in hords in our area due to some type of immigration reform??? which i still do not get, you reponded about that in a thread and i also looked into it and you were correct, they could have done something to stay. anyway, back to the house story, so come to find out, this house is indeed owned by one of those english families whom just up and left and now, since no one is getting mortgages here (i am certain there are some, but not many), these people could of course up the price to suit their price. after all, what is there to lose? a nice downpayment in one's pocket, monthly income for most likely years. giving someone a chance at homeownership that really wants it. looks like a win win. although everyone is talking about the price gouging. i say we'll see more of it, since we did the same thing and did pay more, but only about 40k and that was only because it had a brand new pool and screen...shoot, we knew that was worth the 40k anyway. also, we should have this mortgage paid off in ...and i know i'm pushing it..but i'm going to say 5 years max. that is the goal.

i just don't think we will see the type of equity this area once had. this house sold for $395K (without the pool) it was 5 years old, but sat empty for 3 of those years, so it was basically "new". the owner put the house on the market while we were renting it, but i talked him into an option to buy. asked for that option early, and upped his asking price the 40k if he'd hold the mortgage....went to family begged for money (a loan)...LOL!!! so we came up with over half down on the house.

[debee]

We had to let go of rentals in our bk as well. We had instant equity when we bought both of those, but that was before the meltdown. They were both significantly underwater by the time we filed. We moved to an area with a completely different real estate microclimate - strong rental market, high rents, nothing under 600K is staying on the market, REOs under contract within three days of being listed, etc - while our rentals back in another part of the state dropped in value week after week. In fact property is still dropping in value there.

Anyway, good luck on the sale and the new career.

[Drazil65]

Had instant equity on what is now our out of state rental house because husband was the builder when we moved into it 5 years ago, now its 30,000 underwater because the housing has dropped so much in that area. We are surrendering that property in the chapter 7 and have missed our first payments (1st and 2nd mtgs) this month. Our current home is current on payments (loan mod since last June), was built by my husband 2 years ago (moved in 1 month before his very first lay off ever!), has about $70,000 in equity at this time and we are trying to sell it right now before our filing date (husband wants to try). Between the 2 of us (second marriage for both of us) we have both owned several homes in several states over the course of our lives (late 40's). We have come to realize that its just "stuff", can be built or bought again if we choose but right now they are both PIA's! We have decided that after the filing later this year and then he graduates next May we do not want to be tied down with "stuff" that is dependent with what is going on with everyone else. We will happily rent and let it be someone elses headache and have the freedom to move wherever my husbands new career will take us. Even our 8 year old tells us that as long as the 3 of us are healthy and together he is happy. We are proud of what we built and have been here over 2 years now but its time to move and do what we need to do, our homes do not define us. We also cannot wait around until the market comes back around as it is clear that it will be another 3 to 5 years before things right themselves.

[debee]

Well, as time goes by you'll build some and when you're a little old(er) lady, your kids will be glad it's there. They'll need it so they can pay someone to put your bib on and feed you the soup.

[tobee43]

The calculator's been around for years. In fact I probably posted it on an old thread myself.

Whether it's smarter to rent or buy definitely depends on geographical/individual circumstances -- and the house.

We made 80K instant equity when we bought the REO we live in and we're saving over 10K per year because we'd pay that much more to rent this same house.

There are some great deals out there for people in the right location, industry and circumstance.

especially now, it seems to be a mobil family...go where the work is. when you own a house it ties one right down. i think there has been a few threads...http://www.bkforum.com/showthread.ph...buying+renting i think that one was a nytimes one as well....that one had a a break down by some cities.

we know we aren't leaving here and don't much care about building equity any longer. odd for us...that word equity no longer mattering at all.