Political Discussion

[Bandit]

I beg to differ with you Bandit - that scandal was totally our business. We were paying the President's salary and we payed for the ads he aired on tv where he lied, and then later apologized for lying. Now his wife is running and if she wins, he'll be the 'First Man?". Totally our business.

And yeah - Chelsea could have turned this negative into a positive for her mother.

To be honest, as a woman - I have to question her 'forgiveness' of that situation esp since it was so public. I don't know any woman who would have forgiven that bs unless there is a greater prize in eye. I mean, let's be realistic - when your spouse disrespects you that much - it's hard not to be resentful. I believe she did so because she had presidential aspirations back then and she thought 'forgiving' him would look better in the public eye. And - well, if she had divorced him over it - she would have been shut out of the very circles she needed to be where she is at now. Ambitious? Yes. But she's a woman without integrity.

Very few realtionships survive something like that. That tells me there is something greater there between the two of them than you give them credit for.

You make it sound like Hilary is the one who cheated & did wrong but it was Bill who did it so Bill is the one who lost his integrity not his wife.

I am in agreement with you that at the time it was the publics business but at this present time it is over & it is not anyones business. One can not put the sin or mistake of one man onto another like you are trying to do.
YOu sound like you want to put all the blame on the wife which I do not understand, but hey I guess you can blame whoever you want to. I do not hold those types of grudges against people for that long of time the way you think they should.

The only persons business it is NOW, is his wifes & she obviously did forgive it & has moved on.

[Bandit]

The details of the scandal were very public, so public that most of us eventually got sick of the constant coverage. But what we don't know, and will never know, is what REALLY happened in the aftermath between the husband and wife, behind the scenes. None of us knows. And therefore I think that none of us should jump to conclusions and much less, judge.

I think your statement that Hillary is "a woman without integrity" may be little hasty, presumptuous, and also harsh. You don't KNOW exactly why the Clintons remained together. Maybe they do love each other deeply? We just don't KNOW.

My mom didn't have a "greater prize in the eye" to quote you. But my mom did forgive my dad an affair he had 12 years into their marriage, which produced an illegitimate child. In the small town they lived in, this was a full-fledged SCANDAL in capitals. They loved each other and weathered it out. It took a few years, but my mom finally fully forgave my dad, accepted the child (whom he supported totally), spent time rebuilding their relationship, and remained quite happily married for 37 years until he passed away. No one ever questioned my mom's integrity for remaining with my dad, who was a well-known attorney and councilman.

I've learned to be very, very slow to judge others. If ever.

That time was more boring to me than a soap opera. I never understood the thrill about butting in to other peoples personal relationsships.
Bill & Monica -YES
but Bill & Hilary- NO

I never understood why they try to make the wife look bad when it was the man who did it. Makes no sense to me.

Love will conquer that kind of thing but very few can do it. I am just very serious about relationships when two people make a commitment unless it is one of those open ones where anything goes with no real commitment.

I am glad your parents survived. But seriously, that is no ones business either, other than what you chose to share but it stillmakes it none of our business

I can relate to your
post very well, FLBK7.

[HRx]

I guess it is your business if you want to be nosey or keep something that is over & dead going forever. She had nothing to do with what her husband did or did she?

What two consenting adults do behind closed doors is no one elses business as far as I am concerned. However, if this were something happening right now & she was doing the cheating then I would agree that it is our business because I do not like leaders who cheat on their spouses.


so if you cheated on your spouse 15 years ago does that make it my business? or only if you want to be president & or only if it was your spouse who did the cheating?

Again, you're missing the point, take a moment to think, and internalize the posts before you respond. It is MY/EVERYONE'S business when the President of the US is getting a BJ while on work on my/everyone's tax dollars that's paying his salary. You're lacking the ability to differeniate between respectfully asking an important question that could highlight Clinton's attributes...to her benefit. Chelsea should've been prepared to answer this question from her mother's staff. She's a grown up woman now...she has to face the real reality like everyone else. Furthermore, and answer like, "it's none of your business" is a stupid answer that Bush would give to a question he didn't like.

[Bandit]

Again, you're missing the point, take a moment to think, and internalize the posts before you respond. It is MY/EVERYONE'S business when the President of the US is getting a BJ while on work on my/everyone's tax dollars that's paying his salary. You're lacking the ability to differeniate between respectfully asking an important question that could highlight Clinton's attributes...to her benefit. Chelsea should've been prepared to answer this question from her mother's staff. She's a grown up woman now...she has to face the real reality like everyone else. Furthermore, and answer like, "it's none of your business" is a stupid answer that Bush would give to a question he didn't like.

well I disagree with you & still feel what happens between Bill & Hilary is none of your business.

[Runnin on empty]

When Bill raised his right hand and became the President of the United States, it became our business.

Hillary has no integrity. She smiled and looked the other way when Bill was busted with Monica, and now has been busted for lying about ducking sniper fire. And let us NY'ers never forget that she ran for her Congressional seat promising to support us, when we knew all along that she was going to do nothing but campaign for the Democratic nomination.

I don't like any of the candidates left.

Hillary is a bold-faced liar and a closet raving egomaniac.

Obama seems genuine, but lacks experience IMO.

McCain seems like he wants to make a difference, but is unfortunately so trapped by party lines.

All that being said, I feel McCain is the best of the 3, unless something else comes to light between now and November.

The problem is, the general public isn't astute enough to make a conscious, informed decision. They'll vote for whomever comes up with the best smoke and mirrors tactics. I'll concede that the Democrats will probably win the Presidency for two reasons:

1 - The Hispanic vote. With the Republican track record of very anti-immigration policies, they'll be voted against just on that alone.

2 - The "change" buzz. Everyone in this country knows that things are all messed up, and they automatically assume that the best way to bring all of that about is to just vote the opposite guys in office. This happened during the last congressional elections, the Dems promised all this change, and what happened? Bupkus.

Get rid of the special interest politics, and you cure 75% of what is wrong with this country. The candidate that will get rid of that will get my vote, although I know it will never happen.

[Bandit]

Hillary is a bold-faced liar and a closet raving egomaniac.

LOL! It is so true that she is a bald face liar but that describes them all, not just her. That is no dirt that the law recognises when running. it is acceptable to do that when you run for an office.

The problem is, the general public isn't astute enough to make a conscious, informed decision. They'll vote for whomever comes up with the best smoke and mirrors tactics. I'll concede that the Democrats will probably win the Presidency for two reasons:

JUst a guess, are you in that 20% who still supports Bush just because he is a Republican?

I do agree with you that people vote (or at least campaign) on the most smoke, but that does not mean voters & non voters are not informed & very aware of what is happening. It is kind of hard to to vote when everyone at the table wanting to be head honcho is a big fat liar.

When Bill raised his right hand and became the President of the United States, it became our business.

He was very much so punished for doing what he did & he probably should have been impeached but the courts saw it differently.

How is it that what is between a husband & wife 10 years after the fact is your business? Or does that just apply to people in politics?

When a governer cheats oh his wife & gets impeached, do you still want to to know about his relationship with his wife, if his wife who did no crime decides to become governer 10 years later?

I am guessing you feel the public should make the decisions on wether people in politics should stay married after they mess up. For example: Hilary should divorce Bill if she wants to have integrity? Is that what you mean?

[HRx]

My intention isn't for you to agree with me, because your opinions are yours. However, you keep missing the point of peoples' interest in how Hillary handled the scandal. It's fair game to want to know how she handled it. People aren't asking about sexual specifics, or if Hillary and Bill slept in separate beds, etc. This question isn't about people being nosey either. Politics is politics, and if a politician isn't up to answering or dealing with a few personal questions that was caused while in the "game" they shouldn't be in this line of work, or running for President for that matter. Whenever a politician screws up while in the "game" it's public information.

[HRx]

I do agree that Obama does lack experience...but I think his vision is solid, promising and refreshing; and not stale like Clinton, or same-shit-different-toilet, like McCain. He has also demonstrated that he has a good head on his shoulders too, and the the guy is also very intelligent as well; unlike our current fearless leader. I think he will address his inexperience by surrounding himself with quality like-minded, more experienced constituents that will advise him well. Obama has also demonstrated that he is also strong enough to defend, and support ideas/opinions he has that goes against the/a majority opinion too, which is another an excellent quality for a President to have. More importantly, the man is also open to listening/hearing public opinions/advisements and will acknowledge bad decisions he has made.

[Bandit]

Fair enough. But maybe she chooses to save it for a book when she retires?
Maybe she really feels it is no ones business & that is what her daughter was supposed to say?
Maybe she is still recovering?

Maybe she will talk about her personal relationship when she is ready to talk about it. You cannot force people that way when they have done no crime.

I would say the same thing about the Bush family, the Obama family & Spitzers family. If they choose not to talk about it afterward, & say it is none of your business, that is their right as a husband & wife & I respect that.

I have no problem keeping family life separate from their jobs. It was unfortunate that it happened on the job with Bill but that is not the wifes fault.

It's fair game to want to know how she handled it.

Last I heard which was 10 years ago, She felt that the opposing party (or something like that) may have set Bill up to have him fail & maybe she really believes something like that & that would be a pretty hard thing to try & prove or talk about. No one really knows but I could care less about stuff like that.

[Bandit]

I do agree that Obama does lack experience...but I think his vision is solid, promising and refreshing; and not stale like Clinton, or same-shit-different-toilet, like McCain. He has also demonstrated that he has a good head on his shoulders too, and the the guy is also very intelligent as well; unlike our current fearless leader. I think he will address his inexperience by surrounding himself with quality like-minded, more experienced constituents that will advise him well. Obama has also demonstrated that he is also strong enough to defend, and support ideas/opinions he has that goes against the/a majority opinion too, which is another an excellent quality for a President to have. More importantly, the man is also open to listening/hearing public opinions/advisements and will acknowledge bad decisions he has made.

Wow. That was agreat post, HRx.

We are not that far apart on our views. But what would you do if I was not hear to make rumbles? The only thing there I see different from you is that Hilary & Obama are two peas in a pod & are in agreement on almost every issue & if one of them is talking stale so is the other one.

Especially the bolded part which we have not seen for many years is probably his best attribute as he does listen to the people & that speaks volumes.

& yes McCain is pretty much the same sh** different toilet.

[Minnymouth]

McCain is from the "old school" of fight, fight, fight!!! And being raised entirely military (3 generations), its born and bred in him!! You would have thought that his time as a prisoner of war would have changed his thoughts about fighting in other countries. But once a military man, ALWAYS a military man especially if your a 'LIFER'. I feel like McCain is looking at Iraq thru Vietnam eyes. And he has a score to settle personally.

Don't misunderstand me, I do appreciate his past devotion as a military man, and I was sadden when they took him as a POW for so many years and what he suffered thru. I wouldn't wish it on anyone. But his future as a President is not just built on THAT.

Our candidates this election are all as different as day and nite, winter and summer. Even the same party members stand on different platforms. Really makes it interesting.

A "lifer" military man, a woman (a former First Lady), and a black man are our candidates. All three have been in the Senator or Congress. All from entirely different backgrounds. All with different standards, morals, ideas, and priorities. All are married (happy-?),family orientated, and all are true died in the wool polititians. They KNOW the ropes, they KNOW what John Q Public "wants" to hear. What their "true goals" are, no one really knows. They all want to be President.

One is considered "too old - too old fashioned - and too military". He is from the old school and old way of thinking.
One is a woman - many a man would object to that. How would she handle the stress, the problems that would arise? Would her emotions get in the way? Does she use her own mind or her husbands?
One is black - which many might object too. His religious beliefs, associates, and past religious trainings are in question. Will he be sworn in on a bible or a Koran?

Will they all survive being in office? All three could be targets for one reason or another if they became President.

Yes, this should be a VERY INTERESTING election..............

[HRx]

Wow. That was agreat post, HRx.

[Bandit]

Will they all survive being in office? All three could be targets for one reason or another if they became President.

Yes, this should be a VERY INTERESTING election..............

I was talking with a co-employee & he said something that may be true & that is that the peoples votes may not matter at all in this election for the dems because it looks like neither of them are going to get enough delegates to win. Which means some more big shots will be making the final decision & makes our votes worthless. This was similiar with Bush & Kerry & also Gore.

Florida & michigan are already not being heard because of politicians mistakes. Some people want the other 10 states voices to not be heard by having Obama or Clinton drop out & that is just not right. It is ridiculous.

I am in agreement about them becoming targets. It appears that every primary & main election gets stranger as to what happens & how they get elected these days.

I would not want to be any of them living at the white house, that is for sure.

[Runnin on empty]

LOL! It is so true that she is a bald face liar but that describes them all, not just her. That is no dirt that the law recognises when running. it is acceptable to do that when you run for an office.

JUst a guess, are you in that 20% who still supports Bush just because he is a Republican?

No, I think he's the dumbest stump to ever walk the face of the earth, but at the time, I believed him to be the lesser of two evils.

How is it that what is between a husband & wife 10 years after the fact is your business? Or does that just apply to people in politics?

When a governer cheats oh his wife & gets impeached, do you still want to to know about his relationship with his wife, if his wife who did no crime decides to become governer 10 years later?

I am guessing you feel the public should make the decisions on wether people in politics should stay married after they mess up. For example: Hilary should divorce Bill if she wants to have integrity? Is that what you mean?

Because his wife is now running for political office. If you want the title, you have to deal with the foibles. It is no different than a football/basketball/baseball/hockey player wanting the big multi-million dollar contract, throngs of adoring fans to buy his jersey, but doesn't want to have to take interviews with reporters or to stay after a game and sign autographs. Can't have it both ways. Yes, I do believe that they should have lives outside of their respective sports, but they knew all this hoopla was involved when they went into it.

And as far as a government official is concerned, yes, it is relevant. If a man is willing to cheat on his wife, what other morals is he willing to compromise? Elliott Spitzer was busted with call-girls, and it is very likely that he used taxpayer money to fund these outings.

[Minnymouth]

I'd hate to think my hard earned money paid for his "good time"........... I want my money back!!!! I don't pay taxes for this!!!!