why do they call and hang up on you?

[IOIOIO]

I have a CPO-recommended recorder on my phone and here is the verbatim transcript of a call I just got:

me: Hello.
cfg: I'm looking for ---- please.
me: Who's calling please.
cfg: My name is ----. I'm calling from CFG.
me: From "CFG"?
cfg: Yes.
me: What's "CFG"?
cfg: It's Creditors Financial Group. Is ---- available?
me: What is this in regard to?
cfg: <hangs up>

I googled Creditors Financial Group and indeed they're a collector. Fine. My question is: what on earth is the strategy behind calling me and hanging up before stating their business? I don't get it: the phone call took 28 seconds and I would have told them that it was indeed me on the line after they give some clue as to why they're calling, the same as I do with any caller I don't recognize. I mean, isn't their whole idea to nag me to the fullest legally permissible extent? I found this phone call so odd I had to ask for opinions here.

[allavdj]

You didn't follow the script, if you want them to talk to you, you gotta follow the script!

[treehugger1]

It does seem odd, but I think the laws are quickly working against many CA's.

I've always been of the mind that one should never identify themselves until the caller itentifies him/herself. Once they have identified themselves, I acknowledge my name and address. I state that any further business must be done via written correspondence. I will never give up the last four of my SSN or any other non-public information to a CA. I even tell them that I can review anything written. The truth is, why would anyone give out other personal info in this day of "identity thefts." H*ll, you can even tell the caller that.

What you need them to do is send you a dunning letter. Once they identify themselves, they have 5 days to send notice to you. Perhaps they are getting more and more validation requests and cease&desist letters these days. Both of these make it harder to collect. There is no reason to go down without a fight and exercising the rights Congress granted to you.

[chpxiii]

I've always been of the mind that one should never identify themselves until the caller itentifies him/herself. Once they have identified themselves, I acknowledge my name and address. I state that any further business must be done via written correspondence. I will never give up the last four of my SSN or any other non-public information to a CA. I even tell them that I can review anything written. The truth is, why would anyone give out other personal info in this day of "identity thefts." H*ll, you can even tell the caller that.

Yep!

My first thought was that they were probably confirming they had the correct phone number and you just helped them out.

What you need them to do is send you a dunning letter. Once they identify themselves, they have 5 days to send notice to you. Perhaps they are getting more and more validation requests and cease&desist letters these days. Both of these make it harder to collect. There is no reason to go down without a fight and exercising the rights Congress granted to you.

Also agree.

[IOIOIO]

My first thought was that they were probably confirming they had the correct phone number and you just helped them out.

Actually, I want them to know that they have the correct phone number for the name they asked for. That's my best play to keep them calling me and not legally calling others in order to find me. I have no control over what they're willing to do illegally. If someone calls me at my home phone number and asks for me by name, that's all I need to at least say it's me and go ahead and state your business. I have no problem transacting legitimate, legal business with people and want to encourage them to act within the law. I don't need to play games ducking people and will deal with violators of the law when they appear and not live in fear and constraint.

But this doofus from CFG didn't even begin to transact business with me before she quickly hung up. Since I assume she's on a script dictated by her employers who are in the business of making money, my question is what possible strategy is there in hanging up on people you're supposed to be harrassing for money to the fullest extent of the law? My experience with all collectors so far is that within five days of the phone call, I'll receive the dunning letter, to which I'll respond with a cease and desist. That's all proceeded by the book so far, as I posted here:

http://www.bkforum.com/showthread.php?t=15897

I've sent out about twenty cease and desist letters, none of which have been violated. The strategy of the cease and desist letter is also to verify for the collector that the home address information they have for me is correct. There's no other way to get them to cease and desist until you do that. The suggestion that you should somehow duck them and prevent them from verifying your address and phone number when you know they already have it is wrongheaded and just invites endless harrassment that would be totally within the law. If someone is willing to use illegal means to harrass you, you have to deal with that differently, but waiving your legal means to prevent legal harrassment would just be foolish.

But my original question is: from the collector's business standpoint, what is the strategy of calling a debtor and quickly hanging up on them? I just don't see the percentage in it.

[chpxiii]

I've sent out about twenty cease and desist letters, none of which have been violated. The strategy of the cease and desist letter is also to verify for the collector that the home address information they have for me is correct. There's no other way to get them to cease and desist until you do that. The suggestion that you should somehow duck them and prevent them from verifying your address and phone number when you know they already have it is wrongheaded and just invites endless harrassment that would be totally within the law. If someone is willing to use illegal means to harrass you, you have to deal with that differently, but waiving your legal means to prevent legal harrassment would just be foolish.

I wasn't saying to do that.

[qwertysue]

You might have also gotten a rep who was being pressured to make a certain number of calls.

Call centers will sometimes focus on number of calls made, and talking to you for the little bit that they did would count as a call. I've worked several places where upper mgmt was more concerned about numbers than productivity! And most of those business have filed for bk themselves ;)

[BKcrazy]

I have a CPO-recommended recorder on my phone and here is the verbatim transcript of a call I just got:

me: Hello.
cfg: I'm looking for ---- please.
me: Who's calling please.
cfg: My name is ----. I'm calling from CFG.
me: From "CFG"?
cfg: Yes.
me: What's "CFG"?
cfg: It's Creditors Financial Group. Is ---- available?
me: What is this in regard to?
cfg: <hangs up>

I googled Creditors Financial Group and indeed they're a collector. Fine. My question is: what on earth is the strategy behind calling me and hanging up before stating their business? I don't get it: the phone call took 28 seconds and I would have told them that it was indeed me on the line after they give some clue as to why they're calling, the same as I do with any caller I don't recognize. I mean, isn't their whole idea to nag me to the fullest legally permissible extent? I found this phone call so odd I had to ask for opinions here.

This made me laugh. I'm sure it wasn't supposed to, but it sure did. Good way to get rid of calls.

[FreshLikeADaisy]

But this doofus from CFG didn't even begin to transact business with me before she quickly hung up. Since I assume she's on a script dictated by her employers who are in the business of making money, my question is what possible strategy is there in hanging up on people you're supposed to be harrassing for money to the fullest extent of the law?

Per FDCPA, they cannot reveal that they are collecting a debt to a third party. This may be that person's asinine way of handling it: you were behaving as though she was talking to a third party, and she'd just gotten herself into having to reveal her business or make something up fast. Why she couldn't use the magic words "private business matter" is beyond me (which have themselves become code for "I am a debt collector") but there you go.

[IOIOIO]

Per FDCPA, they cannot reveal that they are collecting a debt to a third party. This may be that person's asinine way of handling it: you were behaving as though she was talking to a third party, and she'd just gotten herself into having to reveal her business or make something up fast. Why she couldn't use the magic words "private business matter" is beyond me (which have themselves become code for "I am a debt collector") but there you go.

Then that's good news, I suppose: she was being legally conscientious even if rude. I suppose I can just say it's me one round sooner than usual since if they have my name and my number then I have no reason to hide my name or my number. I expect I'll have their dunning letter within a week in any case, so now my ringer's turned off until I send out my cease and desist letter.

I wonder if they could just say "CFG is a debt collection company" because that wouldn't actually be saying they're calling to collect a debt.

[CPO]

The point of recording phone calls is to catch collectors violating the law, even if they did not intend to do so and you "steered" them into it.

Sorry for sounding so "militant" about the whole thing, but I really don't feel like being fair and honest to a gaggle of dirtbags that are out to harass anybody and everybody they can get a SSN and a phone number on.....

If you don't want to be harassed or bothered, nor feel the need to take their money, don't answer the phone. Period. It's quieter and far less stressful.

If you want their cash...

Get creative. You have to hold them on the phone, get them talking and asking questions and making statements.

This is a game in which your part entails "fishing" these morons into saying something that is illegal.

You lie, you role play, you provide just enough information to keep them interested and make them think you have swallowed their bait.

I'm not saying it's easy.

Your game will not work with every call.

But, you want their money, and your looking for a way to get them, as stupid as they are, to say something that will trap them into paying you off.

Cry, whimper, act helpless, act stupid, tell them you'll do anything they want then retract on your offer, ask them if you could go to jail, ask them if they will call all night, ask them if they are going to sue you, ask them if they will tell your boss and all your friends.....or the IRS...

Hey, get creative.

You must keep your wits about you. You must remain in complete control at all times. Your not talking to them on their terms. Your talking to them on your terms. Remember that.

Get sneaky, just like they are.

Third party debt collectors are scum of the earth.

They deserve your best tactical thought and planning.

You deserve their money.

You gotta be better than they are at their game.

Best of luck,

CPO

[IOIOIO]

I studied the whole CPO methodology and was preparing myself for it (for example, my phone recorder), but I quickly discovered that I am never called by a person, always a robo-call telling me to hold. Since I will never sit on hold for a robot, I simply went the route of stopping the annoyance as efficiently as possible, which means unplugging my phone until the dunning letter comes and replying with my cease and desist. I've been a little disappointed that they're all in compliance because I really thought I could counterclaim substantially when the time came, but the benefit is that I'm unharrassed and no poorer than before. Apparently the CPO's of the world have disciplined these people and there's no longer easy money to be had from scofflaw collectors.

This latest call caught me by surprise because I usually screen calls, but expecting another caller I picked up. For about the first time ever it wasn't a computer calling, but an actual person, so I didn't just hang up and I had my second "conversation" ever with a creditor, despite about a million calls over the past year. I'm only posting here about it because the call was so stupid and unbeneficial to the collector that I was befuddled as to why they act this way. I mean, if you were an evil but law-abiding collector and had your victim on the line and had received no cease and desist letter, why wouldn't you harrass the crap out of them as far as legally possible? You'd have nothing to lose.

[nazstar]

I keep getting a call from a creditor and it's annoying the crap outta me. They call and when I pick up, it's a robo-machine. I wait and wait and then just give up. They never leave a message. One of these days, I will be in a place and time where I can hold - I use a cell phone as my home phone.

[treehugger1]

Google TCPA and look up some interesting info on the telephone consumer protection act. I do not believe any electronic person is allowed to call a cell phone without identifying who they are. There are some interesting discussions out there on some other boards. Try "creditnet" or "debtorboards." I'm not sure of all the details, but there are some interesting case laws out there related to contacting a cell number. Best to you.

[wingnut]

Music!

Whenever they call me, I just say "Sure he is, hold on a second". Then I set the phone down in front of my computer speaker, and play a random set of funny and/or somewhat offensive music.

If I'm out, I say the same thing, but then either put them in my pocket or on the passenger seat.

Given all of the time I've spent on hold, I think they owe me.

This way, they know they have the right person. The stranger the music, the longer they wait!

Good Luck,

WINGNUT