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Need sample letter, to send to creditor to inquire about the debt I owe.

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  • #16
    You're right. Each individual has to decide what is best for them.

    In general, only people who are judgment proof should hold off on filing bankruptcy, and if you have wages which can be garnished, and if that garnishment would mean the difference between whether you could pay your rent or not, then you are certainly not judgment proof.

    The only other reasons I would hold off on filing bankruptcy over a small amount is if one was uninsured and might incur some huge medical bills soon, or if one had several issues which might make it difficult for them successfully complete their bankruptcy, mainly due to adversarial proceedings because of things they did just prior to filing bankruptcy. Some of these people would be better off waiting until the time was right to file.
    The world's simplest C & D Letter:
    "I demand that you cease and desist from any communication with me."
    Notice that I never actually mention or acknowledge the debt in my letter.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by GoingDown View Post
      And of course, there are the "Collection Triggers" that tell them whether or not you are worth pursuing, as well.
      What do you mean by collection triggers?
      Filed Chapter 7: March 19, 2012
      Discharged! June 28, 2012
      Closed! August 8, 2012

      Comment


      • #18
        Google it.

        Look for information about it on Experian's, TransUnion's, and Equifax's website.

        What the collection triggers boil down to is this...

        1. Debt collectors can't sue everyone, and some of the accounts that they don't get any voluntary payments out of, go "dormant." Rather than wasting their phone jockey's time by calling these old dormant accounts which can not currently pay them anything, they put them in on an "inactive" list.

        2. Usually at this point they subscribe these dormant accounts to a collection trigger service offered by our good friends at Experian, TransUnion, and Equifax.

        3. This service passively monitors the dormant accounts for any new signs of life, such as applying for any new credit (checking accounts, car loans, credit cards, apartments, mortgages and refinancing) or applying for a job which checks your credit, or changing your address with the U.S. Postal Service, or getting a new phone number that they can find.

        [#3 is probably one of the main reasons why I have not been sued by most of my creditors. I stopped applying for any new credit back in 2005, I don't change my address with the U.S. Postal Service, I use only a pay as you go cell phone and Google Voice, and I'm mainly self-employed at this point.]

        4. When the service picks something up, it immediately forwards the new information to the debt collector, and they move your account back into active status. Sometimes this means that they start calling you again and sending you collection letters. Other times they send it to a new collection agency and they do it for them. Still other times, they find the new information so juicy that they send your account to a debt collection attorney, and they will generally send a demand for payment, and then sometimes follow up with a lawsuit. Most of these decisions are actually made by a computer program which takes all sorts of factors into account. For example, your Experian credit report actually assigns a geographic identifier number to your current residence and it indicates the relevant demographic information about the neighborhood where you live-- the median income for residents in that area, the median house values in that area, etc.-- which gives their computer program another tiny bit of info to help it decide if you are likely to be able to afford to pay off a judgment.

        I still think at a certain point there is a list of likely candidates for a lawsuit based upon the collection triggers and someone in the collection attorney's office goes through the list and does some simple asset searches and looks for employers before they actually file a lawsuit-- at least for most of them.

        There are of course some creditors (Cap One for example) and junk debt buyers (Unifund for example) which seem to employ a shotgun approach to the way they sue debtors.
        The world's simplest C & D Letter:
        "I demand that you cease and desist from any communication with me."
        Notice that I never actually mention or acknowledge the debt in my letter.

        Comment


        • #19
          Eventhough all of my debts are far beyond the statute of limitations, I still send them DV letters by email if they call me.

          Why?

          It's a cheap and easy way to get them to possibly admit the debt is beyond the SOL.

          They will often send a response letter that states exactly when the "date of last payment" was.

          A junk debt buyer recently did this for me.

          If they ever did sue me (very unlikely, I know), I could use their response as evidence against them. It would be Exhibit A attached to my written answer to a lawsuit, and I would use the Statute of Limitations as an affirmative defense against them.

          I have changed my DV letters to say only this now...



          " I dispute the validity.

          Send me written verification.

          It is inconvenient for me to receive telephone calls from you at any time and at any location."


          Using the word "inconvenient" preserves your right to sue for them violating the FDCPA if they continue to call you. It is a way to get them to stop calling you (most of them know it means to stop calling you now), but still lets them send you written verification of the debt, hopefully stating the date of the last payment, etc.


          Notice, I don't even use the word "debt" anymore in any of my letters.

          I never admit to anything.

          If I need to follow up with another letter-- for example, if they are still calling me on the phone after receiving this letter and they have either already sent me written verification (which is what I wanted to get from them) or they have already had a reasonable amount of time to send me written verification but have refused to send it to me-- then I send them this one:

          "I demand that you cease and desist from any communication with me.

          The Arizona Statute of Limitations has expired and I will file a written answer to any time-barred lawsuit filed by you using this as an affirmative defense. Since you have already been informed of this matter in writing BEFORE you filed any lawsuit against me, I will ask the court to award me all court filing fees and any other legal fees associated with responding to your time-barred lawsuit. I will also file a counterclaim against you at that time for any violations of Federal and State laws."


          The Federal and State laws I am referring to are the FDCPA, TCPA and any state collection laws which may apply, but I don't mention them. They know exactly what I mean without me having to use the word "debt" or even the "FDCPA" at all.


          You notice, I don't ever use the word "debt." And I don't go into a lot of details. It is enough to let the managers of the collection office know that I know enough to fight and win against their lawsuit, so it would be a waste of their time, and would cost them not only their own court fees and legal costs, but mine as well. I think it would be enough to keep them from ever bothering to actually file a lawsuit against me.

          Most of the time, when they sue someone after the SOL has expired, they are hoping for no response from the debtor and a nice default judgment. I let them know they won't get that from me.

          I should also point out that if I send anything by U.S. Postal Service rather than email, I NEVER sign any letters, and I always print out the addresses on envelops using my computer's printer. I don't want them to have my signature nor my handwriting on anything I send to them.
          Last edited by GoingDown; 09-17-2012, 12:11 PM.
          The world's simplest C & D Letter:
          "I demand that you cease and desist from any communication with me."
          Notice that I never actually mention or acknowledge the debt in my letter.

          Comment


          • #20
            I sent mine this letter about amonth ago asking for validation and haven't heard back from them yet..

            Re: Acct # ********
            To Whom It May Concern:
            I am sending this letter to you in response to a notice I received from you on 8/9/2012). Be advised, this is not a refusal to pay, but a notice sent pursuant to the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act, 15 USC 1692g Sec. 809 (b) that validation is requested.
            This is NOT a request for “verification” or proof of my mailing address, but a request for VALIDATION made pursuant to the above named Title and Section. I respectfully request that your office provide me with competent evidence that I have any legal obligation to pay you.
            Please provide me with the following:
            • What the money you say I owe is for;
            • Explain and show me how you calculated what you say I owe;
            • Provide me with copies of any papers that show I agreed to pay what you say I owe; ;
            • Identify the original creditor;
            • Prove the Statute of Limitations has not expired on this account;
            • Show me that you are licensed to collect in my state; and
            • Provide me with your license numbers and Registered Agent.
            If your offices have reported invalidated information to any of the three major Credit Bureau’s (Equifax, Experian or TransUnion), said action might constitute fraud under both Federal and State Laws. Due to this fact, if any negative mark is found on any of my credit reports by your company or the company that you represent I will not hesitate in bringing legal action against you for the following:
            • Violation of the Fair Credit Reporting Act
            • Violation of the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act
            • Defamation of Character
            If your offices are able to provide the proper documentation as requested, I will require at least 30 days to investigate this information and during such time all collection activity must cease and desist.
            Also during this validation period, if any action is taken which could be considered detrimental to any of my credit reports, I will consult with my legal counsel. This includes any information to a credit reporting repository that could be inaccurate or invalidated or verifying an account as accurate when in fact there is no provided proof that it is.
            If your offices fail to respond to this validation request within 30 days from the date of your receipt, all references to this account must be deleted and completely removed from my credit file and a copy of such deletion request shall be sent to me immediately.
            I would also like to request, in writing, that no telephone contact be made by your offices to my home or to my place of employment. If your offices attempt telephone communication with me, including but not limited to computer generated calls or correspondence sent to any third parties, it will be considered harassment and I will have no choice but to file suit. All future communications with me MUST be done in writing and sent to the address noted in this letter.
            This is an attempt to correct your records, any information obtained shall be used for that purpose.
            Best Regards,
            Your Signature

            Comment


            • #21
              The letter posted above is WAAAAAAAYYYYYYY too long, and reads like you copied and pasted it off the Internet. It does not appear like you wrote it yourself (which you didn't, because I've seen that very same sample letter on other websites) and the person on the receiving end will know that. Also, a lot of the things you ask for are not legally required from the collector, and a lot of the threats you make have no legal basis to back them up.

              I suggest keeping it short and simple, and of course, writing the letter yourself, so the person on the receiving end will see that YOU know your rights, and take a personal interest in this matter.

              Something like this would be better:

              RE: Account # xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
              Alleged balance: $xxxx.xx
              Dear Sir:

              I am writing to dispute the validity of the above-referenced debt. Please provide proof that the debt is legitimate, that I am the person who owes this alleged debt, and that the alleged balance is correct. Please also provide any further communications in writing only. It is inconvenient for me to receive ANY telephone calls at ANY time regarding this matter.

              Sincerely,

              Your Name


              I am requesting validation for the alleged debt

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by bcohen View Post
                The letter posted above is WAAAAAAAYYYYYYY too long, and reads like you copied and pasted it off the Internet. It does not appear like you wrote it yourself (which you didn't, because I've seen that very same sample letter on other websites) and the person on the receiving end will know that. Also, a lot of the things you ask for are not legally required from the collector, and a lot of the threats you make have no legal basis to back them up.

                I suggest keeping it short and simple, and of course, writing the letter yourself, so the person on the receiving end will see that YOU know your rights, and take a personal interest in this matter.

                Something like this would be better:

                RE: Account # xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
                Alleged balance: $xxxx.xx
                Dear Sir:

                I am writing to dispute the validity of the above-referenced debt. Please provide proof that the debt is legitimate, that I am the person who owes this alleged debt, and that the alleged balance is correct. Please also provide any further communications in writing only. It is inconvenient for me to receive ANY telephone calls at ANY time regarding this matter.

                Sincerely,

                Your Name


                I am requesting validation for the alleged debt
                You could shorten it even more...

                "I dispute the validity.

                I request written verification from you.

                It is inconvenient for me to receive telephone calls from you at any time and at any location."



                There! Done!

                Once they get that, they know exactly what it means, and they know that you know the law. You've disputed the debt, requested written verification of the debt from them, and you've put them on notice that it is inconvenient for you to receive telephone calls from them. Now if they call you, they will be violating the F.D.C.P.A., and they know it.

                In most cases, you will not hear from that particular debt collector again after they receive any one of the letters mentioned in this thread. And if you do, it will merely be a short paragraph stating when they bought the debt, from whom, and the amount of debt you owed at that moment. Sometimes they will also state the date of last payment on the account as well. Definitely save that letter, if they send you one. It may come in handy later on. But in my vast experience with this, they never send anything at all. They just bump it back to the creditor who then sends it on to a new round of debt collectors, and you have to do it all over again with the new debt collector.
                Last edited by GoingDown; 09-21-2012, 11:25 AM.
                The world's simplest C & D Letter:
                "I demand that you cease and desist from any communication with me."
                Notice that I never actually mention or acknowledge the debt in my letter.

                Comment


                • #23
                  I wonder why they don't bother to validate the debit once you send them the letter if they have the ability to do so..

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Most debt collectors want easy money, very few of them actually file a lawsuit against a debtor, and when they receive a DV letter from you, especially one that makes it illegal for them to call you on the phone, they move on to lower hanging fruit.

                    They send send your account back to the creditor, who then sends your account on to a new collection agency to try it all over again.

                    In my experience, they do this about 3 to 6 times and then either sell your account to a (new) junk debt buyer, or they do an asset and employment search to see if you are worth suing, and if they don't like what they find they put your account on the inactive pile and passively monitor your credit report looking for any new signs of life such as new credit applications, new jobs, a new address, new phone number, etc., then they will spring back to life.

                    All except one of mine fell silent after they didn't like what they found when they did an asset and employment search on me.

                    Years passed, and they are now all beyond the statute of limitations.

                    One of them sold the account to a new junk debt buyer after the SOL, and they started calling me and making legal threats, and when I responded to them in writing telling them I knew it was beyond the SOL, and to cease communications with me, they fell silent, too.

                    At long last, I think it is all over with.

                    I think they all now know they will never get paid by me.

                    Even my credit report is about be sparkling clean, with no negative accounts on it.

                    The long nightmare is finally over.

                    And I will never go back into debt for anything again.
                    The world's simplest C & D Letter:
                    "I demand that you cease and desist from any communication with me."
                    Notice that I never actually mention or acknowledge the debt in my letter.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by josephga View Post
                      I sent mine this letter about amonth ago asking for validation and haven't heard back from them yet..

                      Re: Acct # ********
                      To Whom It May Concern:
                      I am sending this letter to you in response to a notice I received from you on 8/9/2012). Be advised, this is not a refusal to pay, but a notice sent pursuant to the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act, 15 USC 1692g Sec. 809 (b) that validation is requested.
                      This is NOT a request for “verification” or proof of my mailing address, but a request for VALIDATION made pursuant to the above named Title and Section. I respectfully request that your office provide me with competent evidence that I have any legal obligation to pay you.
                      Please provide me with the following:
                      • What the money you say I owe is for;
                      • Explain and show me how you calculated what you say I owe;
                      • Provide me with copies of any papers that show I agreed to pay what you say I owe; ;
                      • Identify the original creditor;
                      • Prove the Statute of Limitations has not expired on this account;
                      • Show me that you are licensed to collect in my state; and
                      • Provide me with your license numbers and Registered Agent.
                      If your offices have reported invalidated information to any of the three major Credit Bureau’s (Equifax, Experian or TransUnion), said action might constitute fraud under both Federal and State Laws. Due to this fact, if any negative mark is found on any of my credit reports by your company or the company that you represent I will not hesitate in bringing legal action against you for the following:
                      • Violation of the Fair Credit Reporting Act
                      • Violation of the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act
                      • Defamation of Character
                      If your offices are able to provide the proper documentation as requested, I will require at least 30 days to investigate this information and during such time all collection activity must cease and desist.
                      Also during this validation period, if any action is taken which could be considered detrimental to any of my credit reports, I will consult with my legal counsel. This includes any information to a credit reporting repository that could be inaccurate or invalidated or verifying an account as accurate when in fact there is no provided proof that it is.
                      If your offices fail to respond to this validation request within 30 days from the date of your receipt, all references to this account must be deleted and completely removed from my credit file and a copy of such deletion request shall be sent to me immediately.
                      I would also like to request, in writing, that no telephone contact be made by your offices to my home or to my place of employment. If your offices attempt telephone communication with me, including but not limited to computer generated calls or correspondence sent to any third parties, it will be considered harassment and I will have no choice but to file suit. All future communications with me MUST be done in writing and sent to the address noted in this letter.
                      This is an attempt to correct your records, any information obtained shall be used for that purpose.
                      Best Regards,
                      Your Signature
                      No offense here, but letters like this get passed around for sheer comic amusement. No agency is going to gather up all that information and send it to you, and they are not required to.

                      You're going to get the agency name, the balance due and a copy of the statement/printout/file that was received by the agency.

                      At this time, nothing else really matters. The only time the actual documents will be presented will be at trial if you are sued, or in prediscovery if you request them.

                      A collection agency has very little to "prove" to the debtor.
                      All information contained in this post is for informational and amusement purposes only.
                      Bankruptcy is a process, not an event.......

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        I'm not to concerned about it. I stopped the phone calls back in 2009. Didn't hear anything until 3 months ago. I think me moving and the leasing office running my credit check put me back on their radar. I think the sol here in ga is 6 years and this month I'm at the half way point. I have no property no house. I run my own business that's all cash so they can't trace a pay roll check too me.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by josephga View Post
                          I think me moving and the leasing office running my credit check put me back on their radar. .
                          Indeed. You just hit a collection trigger.

                          Cash. It really is king isn't it!
                          All information contained in this post is for informational and amusement purposes only.
                          Bankruptcy is a process, not an event.......

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            I moved in feb 2011 heard nothing until 3 months ago another thing I was in macy's and purchased a shirt. they mentioned 20% off if I applied for a card. I knew id get rejected but figured id take that 20% until i saw this site I didn't know applying for a card would possible pull a trigger.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by frogger View Post
                              No offense here, but letters like this get passed around for sheer comic amusement. No agency is going to gather up all that information and send it to you, and they are not required to.

                              You're going to get the agency name, the balance due and a copy of the statement/printout/file that was received by the agency.

                              At this time, nothing else really matters. The only time the actual documents will be presented will be at trial if you are sued, or in prediscovery if you request them.

                              A collection agency has very little to "prove" to the debtor.
                              Yep.

                              The shorter and the simpler, the better.

                              I've read on other forums that the short simple letters actually make them more wary of you because they think you are likely to sue them for violating the FDCPA.

                              Just telling them in writing that phone calls are inconvenient triggers the FDCPA requirement that they must stop calling you permanently (even if they "verify" the debt later on), or risk losing an FDCPA lawsuit filed against them.
                              The world's simplest C & D Letter:
                              "I demand that you cease and desist from any communication with me."
                              Notice that I never actually mention or acknowledge the debt in my letter.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by josephga View Post
                                I moved in feb 2011 heard nothing until 3 months ago another thing I was in macy's and purchased a shirt. they mentioned 20% off if I applied for a card. I knew id get rejected but figured id take that 20% until i saw this site I didn't know applying for a card would possible pull a trigger.
                                That is a HUGE collection trigger for them.

                                It puts a hard pull on the inquiry section of your credit report, and if approved, it puts a new positive account on your credit report, and not to mention it will give them your new address and new phone number, and maybe even your new employer.

                                They love it when you do things like that.

                                My credit report has looked dead for years. No new positive accounts. No payments on any existing accounts. No pulls for new credit. Old, outdated phone numbers, and old, outdated employers, etc. It was probably very discouraging for them to look at my credit report.
                                The world's simplest C & D Letter:
                                "I demand that you cease and desist from any communication with me."
                                Notice that I never actually mention or acknowledge the debt in my letter.

                                Comment

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