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A few more questions, please?

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  • A few more questions, please?

    Is this chart...

    http://www.justice.gov/ust/eo/bapcpa..._standards.htm

    an accurate depiction of allowable expenses? Is that what the Trustee goes by? I was wondering if the $480/month I spend on my family of three ($120/week) was an outrageous amount, but then I saw that chart, which allows up to $639, so $480 is acceptable, right?

    Our schedule J is supposed to depict living a normal life post-discharge, right? As opposed to skimping on things that we deprived ourselves of when trying to pay my creditors (like clothing, and regular haircuts)?

    And, what category would diapers fall into? Hygiene?

    And, although I'll be filing bk sans my husband, we will be receiving a joint tax refund. Does this mean that I only have to exempt half the amount? It will include a child tax credit, as well.

    And, since our car is titled me AND my husband, the trustee can't just take it away, can he? Its value is low enough that I can exempt it, but I was wondering how that works. Would I exempt half the value of the car (I assume they don't come with a chainsaw and cut it in half )? I live in Tennessee.
    Filed Chapter 7: March 19, 2012
    Discharged! June 28, 2012
    Closed! August 8, 2012

  • #2
    Originally posted by lotsahats View Post
    Is this chart...

    http://www.justice.gov/ust/eo/bapcpa..._standards.htm

    an accurate depiction of allowable expenses? Is that what the Trustee goes by? Yes.

    I was wondering if the $480/month I spend on my family of three ($120/week) was an outrageous amount, but then I saw that chart, which allows up to $639, so $480 is acceptable, right? It is but $480 per month doesn't equal $120 per week. 52 x $120 ÷ 12 = $520 Claim what you spend!!!

    Our schedule J is supposed to depict living a normal life post-discharge, right? As opposed to skimping on things that we deprived ourselves of when trying to pay my creditors (like clothing, and regular haircuts)? Absolutely.

    And, what category would diapers fall into? Hygiene? I would personally put them in Personal Care. hehe


    And, although I'll be filing bk sans my husband, we will be receiving a joint tax refund. Does this mean that I only have to exempt half the amount? It will include a child tax credit, as well. I think so, but please check this!! I didn't see a specific exemption for the tax credit in TN either...

    And, since our car is titled me AND my husband, the trustee can't just take it away, can he? Its value is low enough that I can exempt it, but I was wondering how that works. Would I exempt half the value of the car (I assume they don't come with a chainsaw and cut it in half )? I live in Tennessee. Again, I think so, but please check this!!
    You can post your projected Schedule J and folks here will gladly critique it!!
    ~~ Filed Over Median Income Chapter 7: 12/17/2010 ~~ 341 Held: 1/12/2011 ~~ Discharged: 03/16/2011 ~~
    Not an attorney - just an opinionated woman.

    Comment


    • #3
      An attorney in your area would be happy to let you know what flies with your local Trustees.
      Any information posted by me is for general informational purposes only. While I am an attorney, I am not YOUR attorney and any information I provide is not legal advice.

      Comment


      • #4
        Thanks, ValleYum.

        Yeah, I found a bunch of stuff on Florida, California, New Jersey, New York, Washington, etc., but Tennessee might as well be Narnia.

        I'll get my schedule J up in a bit. Thanks!
        Filed Chapter 7: March 19, 2012
        Discharged! June 28, 2012
        Closed! August 8, 2012

        Comment


        • #5
          That is not the current list of national standards. The one effective November 1 is here: http://www.justice.gov/ust/eo/bapcpa..._standards.htm I didn't check to see if there are any differences.
          LadyInTheRed is in the black!
          Filed Chap 13 April 2010. Discharged May 2015.
          $143,000 in debt discharged for $36,500, including attorneys fees. Money well spent!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by LadyInTheRed View Post
            That is not the current list of national standards. The one effective November 1 is here: http://www.justice.gov/ust/eo/bapcpa..._standards.htm I didn't check to see if there are any differences.
            Thanks for that, Lady. So, I guess, if I'm not able to file before March of next year, then I need to check again for any updates.
            Filed Chapter 7: March 19, 2012
            Discharged! June 28, 2012
            Closed! August 8, 2012

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by lotsahats View Post
              Thanks for that, Lady. So, I guess, if I'm not able to file before March of next year, then I need to check again for any updates.
              I am so glad she caught that - -I didn't notice. Duh is me (but it was late/early heehee)!
              ~~ Filed Over Median Income Chapter 7: 12/17/2010 ~~ 341 Held: 1/12/2011 ~~ Discharged: 03/16/2011 ~~
              Not an attorney - just an opinionated woman.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by ValleYum View Post
                I am so glad she caught that - -I didn't notice. Duh is me (but it was late/early heehee)!
                I had the old page bookmarked. I didn't notice, either.

                This is overwhelming.
                Filed Chapter 7: March 19, 2012
                Discharged! June 28, 2012
                Closed! August 8, 2012

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by lotsahats View Post
                  Thanks for that, Lady. So, I guess, if I'm not able to file before March of next year, then I need to check again for any updates.
                  I doubt it will change before March. But, you should double check anyway.
                  LadyInTheRed is in the black!
                  Filed Chap 13 April 2010. Discharged May 2015.
                  $143,000 in debt discharged for $36,500, including attorneys fees. Money well spent!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    What is that 5% figure they have toward the bottom of the page?

                    http://www.justice.gov/ust/eo/bapcpa..._standards.htm
                    Filed Chapter 7: March 19, 2012
                    Discharged! June 28, 2012
                    Closed! August 8, 2012

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      From 11 U.S.C. § 707(b)(2)(A)(ii)(I):

                      In addition, if it is demonstrated that it is reasonable and necessary, the debtor’s monthly expenses may also include an additional allowance for food and clothing of up to 5 percent of the food and clothing categories as specified by the National Standards issued by the Internal Revenue Service.
                      My attorney included the additional 5% on my petition. Because these are nationwide standards, my suspicion is that if you live in an area with a higher than average cost of living, you won't be questioned if you add the 5%. But, that is just a guess.
                      LadyInTheRed is in the black!
                      Filed Chap 13 April 2010. Discharged May 2015.
                      $143,000 in debt discharged for $36,500, including attorneys fees. Money well spent!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        This memo saved my sanity so many times while I was trying to get my numbers straight with our attorney. (NOTE: The car part is outdated due to the January decision by the Supreme Court in the Ransom case and $$ amounts listed (if any) should be double checked as they may have changed) http://www.justice.gov/ust/eo/bapcpa...ne_by_line.pdf

                        This memo is written line by line to Trustees about the US Trustees position on various entries on the Means Test. The info on the memo about the entry for Line 39 on Form 22A should explain that 5% to you much better than I can.
                        ~~ Filed Over Median Income Chapter 7: 12/17/2010 ~~ 341 Held: 1/12/2011 ~~ Discharged: 03/16/2011 ~~
                        Not an attorney - just an opinionated woman.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Okay, here's my Schedule J...

                          $2,871.00......gross income
                          -500.00....taxes withheld
                          $2,371.00
                          -654.00.....rent
                          $1,717.00
                          -88.00.......electric
                          $1,629.00
                          -55.00.......water
                          $1,574.00
                          -55.00.......phone/internet
                          $1,519.00
                          -125.00.....two cell phones
                          $1,394.00
                          -65.00.......home maintenance
                          $1,329.00
                          -585.00.....food
                          $734.00
                          -185.00.....clothing
                          $559.00
                          -20.00.......laundry
                          $539.00
                          -220.00......gasoline
                          $319.00
                          -95.00........auto insurance
                          $224.00
                          -16.00........renter's insurance
                          $208.00
                          -20.00........hygiene
                          $188.00
                          -40.00........diapers
                          $148.00........DMI

                          I upped the food a bit from my previous quote, to $135/week (I figure it would be okay to start buying a bit of organic).

                          Also, my transportation costs go outside the standards for my region, which is $244, but I really do spend $95.00 on auto insurance, and $220.00 on fuel. It is what it is.

                          Well, tell me what you think. Good? Bad? Ugly?
                          Last edited by lotsahats; 11-10-2011, 10:36 PM.
                          Filed Chapter 7: March 19, 2012
                          Discharged! June 28, 2012
                          Closed! August 8, 2012

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            You need to get it down lower.

                            I don't see any medical expenses? Is health insurance deducted from your paycheck?



                            You are allowed $60 per person for medical expenses by the national standards - you can put your expenses for medical on Line 7 of Schedule J.

                            No recreation, clubs and entertainment, newspapers, magazines, etc.?

                            Any charitable contributions?

                            Insurance looks low - can you lower your deductibles? There may not be credit cards to fall back on to cover a high deductible in case of an accident. Do you have replacement value coverage on your renters?

                            Also, term life insurance would be good as an expense and to have for your family.. just in case.

                            ~~ Filed Over Median Income Chapter 7: 12/17/2010 ~~ 341 Held: 1/12/2011 ~~ Discharged: 03/16/2011 ~~
                            Not an attorney - just an opinionated woman.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by ValleYum View Post
                              You need to get it down lower.
                              How low?

                              I don't see any medical expenses? Is health insurance deducted from your paycheck?
                              We don't have health insurance, yet. We are looking into it, but I can't assume we'll have it by the time we file.



                              Hahahahahahaaaaa!

                              You are allowed $60 per person for medical expenses by the national standards - you can put your expenses for medical on Line 7 of Schedule J.
                              Do you mean out-of-pocket? We don't really go to the doc much, so I don't have any way of justifying that expense.

                              No recreation, clubs and entertainment, newspapers, magazines, etc.?Not really.

                              Any charitable contributions?Not on a monthly basis. Every once in a while, I'll make a small donation to something, but it's not in our budget.

                              Insurance looks low - can you lower your deductibles? There may not be credit cards to fall back on to cover a high deductible in case of an accident. Do you have replacement value coverage on your renters?
                              Yes, the auto is low, but it's a full coverage plan. It was almost double when we lived in Atlanta.

                              Also, term life insurance would be good as an expense and to have for your family.. just in case.
                              Duly noted.

                              Thanks for the input, ValleYum.

                              Honestly, that $2871 isn't our income, yet--it's really much lower, at the present, but my husband is supposed to start a new position at work in a few weeks. Rotten timing. I'm hoping that getting health insurance will save us from a 13.
                              Last edited by lotsahats; 11-10-2011, 11:29 PM.
                              Filed Chapter 7: March 19, 2012
                              Discharged! June 28, 2012
                              Closed! August 8, 2012

                              Comment

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