Just back from 341 Meeting...didn't go so well

[HHM]

can they really force you to give up your house if your current on the mortgage, just because the trustee thinks you can't afford it and wants you in something cheaper so you have more disposable to fund a Ch-13 ?? That makes no sense, as you would be defaulting on a secured loan and adding to the debt you would be discharging hurting a creditor that you were planning on paying.

They can't literally force you to sell, but they can deny the expense. The net result, if you can't pay your mortage + living expenses + chapter 13 payment, something has to give, your house or dismissal of your chapter 13.

Realize, it is the job of the trustee to object, they will find something in about 95% of cases, so you shouldn't be alarmed that you got an objection, the issue is what can be done about. This is the beginning of negotiations.

Also, the idea of talking to your home equity holders is a non-starter. They can't do anything.

[albacore44]

can they really force you to give up your house if your current on the mortgage, just because the trustee thinks you can't afford it and wants you in something cheaper so you have more disposable to fund a Ch-13 ?? That makes no sense, as you would be defaulting on a secured loan and adding to the debt you would be discharging hurting a creditor that you were planning on paying.

[lrprn]

Yet, my $75/mo entertainment expense on schedule J is excessive. (I thought they had to go by B22C when above median).

Whether the local court or court district weights the Means Test or Schedules more heavily varies across the country. Allowable monthly entertainment expenses is most likely driven by the custom in your local court.

I think I am going to write letters to my home equity loan holders and see if they will treat their loan as unsecured. Sort of voluntary stripping. If I surrender the house, they get $0. If they agree, they will get about 40% and the other unsecureds will go from 24% to 40%. Maybe that is enough to appease the trustee.

DO NOT DO ANYTHING WITHOUT CHECKING WITH YOUR LAWYER FIRST! You can really screw up your case going around your lawyer contacting your creditors yourself after you've filed.

Your creditors can't do anything now since you've already filed anyway - they are under the automatic stay and are not allowed to be in contact with you regarding what you owe them. You are stuck with what you had in place when you filed unless your lawyer files an amended plan.

[TooMuchCredit]

Just because the trustee has issues doesn't mean that you can't fight back by providing proof of your expenses, your charitable contributions, etc. These kinds of trustee issues turn up frequently in 13s - they are a lot more common than you realize. That's why your lawyer is in a good position to rebut them because he/she knows the history of these issues in your local court.

Get your paperwork together that proves what you put on your Means Test and Schedules and provide it to your lawyer to give to your trustee. Unless you did inflate your figures and/or can't prove them, you've got a fighting chance to turn things around. Don't become a passive "oh woe is me" passenger on your own bk and not use your own power in this situation - you have more than you realize.

What does your lawyer say about your trustee's issues?

He said that he can talk to the trustee about some of the items. He implied it will be an uphill battle though as the trustee thinks the house is too far underwater and the car is too expensive. The good faith objection was on the car.

The plan actually was paying $500 instead of the $400 DMI B22C indicated. Yet, my $75/mo entertainment expense on schedule J is excessive. (I thought they had to go by B22C when above median). The trustee originally remarked it was a 0% plan, but that was due to a typo. When my lawyer said the amount was filed in on the petition, the % was just left 0 and it was actually 24% plan, the trustee said he still did not feel 24% to unsecured is enough.

I think I am going to write letters to my home equity loan holders and see if they will treat their loan as unsecured. Sort of voluntary stripping. If I surrender the house, they get $0. If they agree, they will get about 40% and the other unsecureds will go from 24% to 40%. Maybe that is enough to appease the trustee.

Don't know what I will do about the car. I don't have thosands of $ for a down payment on a different one at this point.

[lrprn]

Just because the trustee has issues doesn't mean that you can't fight back by providing proof of your expenses, your charitable contributions, etc. These kinds of trustee issues turn up frequently in 13s - they are a lot more common than you realize. That's why your lawyer is in a good position to rebut them because he/she knows the history of these issues in your local court.

Get your paperwork together that proves what you put on your Means Test and Schedules and provide it to your lawyer to give to your trustee. Unless you did inflate your figures and/or can't prove them, you've got a fighting chance to turn things around. Don't become a passive "oh woe is me" passenger on your own bk and not use your own power in this situation - you have more than you realize.

What does your lawyer say about your trustee's issues?

[TooMuchCredit]

Well, I got the good ole Good Faith objection due to the expense of my car. ($654 - the allowance is $489).

The trustee had alot of other objections...
I have to submit proof of my charitable contributions (it was on my paystub - United Way) its 1% of my salary. Have to send in proof of my medical expenses. They frowned on my 401K contributions - 5% of my salary. They also objected to my $75 a month entertainment expense on schedule J. They also felt I was too underwater on my house. I was asked why I wanted to keep it. There was a typo in the plan that said I would pay 0% to unsecured (the amount was listed, but the % was 0), but it's really 25%. When told that they said they still objected to the $75 a month expense. Good grief, $75 is not alot! What am I supposed to do, be a hermit for the next 5 years (I am over median so 60 months is a given)?

So I guess I need to now look to see what sort of rental house/apartment I can find that will allow a large pet (have an 80lb dog. Most apartments have a 20lb limit.

I drive out of town 100 miles each way once a week so I have to go find what sort of car I can get now with my trashed credit with nothing to put down.

Not a good day!