When were you told that you need more docs?

[epiphany]

epiphany, go light weight. if you've already given your atty everything he/she will bring it with them. when we went only took dl and ss card. Any docs that were needed atty had w/her

(man the hokey pokey will never be the same)

Thanks Pa! That's what I am going to do. I was questioning this though as no one has asked for bank statements or anything else. I guess that's good news though.

ep

[laurannm]

Thanks Pa! That's what I am going to do. I was questioning this though as no one has asked for bank statements or anything else. I guess that's good news though.

ep

I was having the same questions leading up to our 341 last week, as we have never been asked for bank statements (or anything else except for that matter, other than the minimum 60 days of pay stubs and tax return required for filing).

So far not a peep from anyone, including the UST (keeping our fingers crossed). The trustee at our 341 didn't ask for anything either

[Lajazz947]

In my 1st case, I was notified of the extra documentation request just 3 days prior to my 341. It wasn't much though -- they wanted the new Lease Agreement (rental), Explanation of a few abbreviations from my paystubs like, ESPP, LTD, GTL etc., copy of my $4,000 rent deposit check, proof of $200/mo charity gift (church tithe) -- but no bank statements, no receipts. They had 2 years tax returns, 6 mos paystubs already with our filing. We are WAY OVER the median income, but also WAY OVER the median debt load too! My attorney basically forwarded me the email he received from the Office of the UST in my district (CA). If they don't ask for anything before, then the UST is probably not going to lift a finger on your case.

Keep me posted,
getouttadebt

Hi there,

I was reading your post with allot of interest.

I am in California as well and WAY over the median with a ton of unsecured debt ($200,000 plus and that's not counting student loans).

I cannot recall why your first BK was denied but I am glad your second is going well.

I am told by my attorney that he is presuming that I pass the means test but he is getting ready for questions.

Can you tell me (without driving yourself crazy) a few issues you encountered due to the median income issue and excessive debt?

Also, what district are you in? Maybe we are in the same one. Are the Trustees in your area hard to work with ?

Thanks for any help.

[danaf]

I filed pro se and found out within a week what additional docs the trustee wanted. So at this point, I think you are fine! Good luck!!!! (plus I honestly think when you file with an attorney, they request less docs then if you file pro-se - just my opinion)

[epiphany]

I was having the same questions leading up to our 341 last week, as we have never been asked for bank statements (or anything else except for that matter, other than the minimum 60 days of pay stubs and tax return required for filing).

So far not a peep from anyone, including the UST (keeping our fingers crossed). The trustee at our 341 didn't ask for anything either

This is great news! Thank you!

ep

[epiphany]

I filed pro se and found out within a week what additional docs the trustee wanted. So at this point, I think you are fine! Good luck!!!! (plus I honestly think when you file with an attorney, they request less docs then if you file pro-se - just my opinion)

Oooooooooo, I like it! Thank you!

Right now I am in listening to those things that I want to hear mode.

ep

[getouttadebt]

I was reading your post with allot of interest.

Can you tell me (without driving yourself crazy) a few issues you encountered due to the median income issue and excessive debt?

Also, what district are you in? Maybe we are in the same one. Are the Trustees in your area hard to work with ?

Thanks for any help.

Jazz, I am in the Eastern District of CA. My biggest problem with case #1 was that I had extra income from the sale of stock options and ESPP shares during the 6 month lookback. I was clueless about how a bankruptcy worked, etc. Well, the UST made what he believed to be "corrections" to my means test calculations to show I had excessive disposable income. It was all vapor money since it didn't really exist. But, it was enough for him to get his way and either make me convert to a 13 or dismiss. We chose to dismiss, and now we are about 3 weeks away from discharge in the 2nd case without any sign of an issue this time around.

Good luck,
getouttadebt

[Tabbygirl]

(plus I honestly think when you file with an attorney, they request less docs then if you file pro-se - just my opinion)

I believe the same thing. I'm not sure how I feel about that; I'm guessing from a trustee/attorney's position, pro se filers have something to hide or there is some presumption of abuse. I realize that while I have no skeletons in my closet (or tax return...) other people may not have that situation.

[b_girl]

What I noticed during our 341 is that the trustees and the attorneys seem to have a cordial relationship. We were the last ones out that day, and I saw our attorney and all of the 3 trustees laughing and joking together. That led me to conclude that they have a kind of 'trust' and working knowledge of each other which they wouldn't have had with me as a pro se filer, which made shelling out that $1200 for my attorney easier to swallow. So when my attorney assured me that our trustee is a 'good guy' who has no issues with our case, I now tend to totally believe him.

[Lajazz947]

Jazz, I am in the Eastern District of CA. My biggest problem with case #1 was that I had extra income from the sale of stock options and ESPP shares during the 6 month lookback. I was clueless about how a bankruptcy worked, etc. Well, the UST made what he believed to be "corrections" to my means test calculations to show I had excessive disposable income. It was all vapor money since it didn't really exist. But, it was enough for him to get his way and either make me convert to a 13 or dismiss. We chose to dismiss, and now we are about 3 weeks away from discharge in the 2nd case without any sign of an issue this time around.

Good luck,
getouttadebt

Thanks,

I have no extraordinary income other than my 1099 income so I guess that if the trustee wants to poke around for other income then he/she will be disappointed.

[duplantisjj]

Hi epiphany,

I received a letter from the UST about 1 week before my 341 stating that they disagree with my debts being primarily non-consumer and were requesting that I do the means test. I was above the median on the means test but still passed based on the rest of the test.

Bottom line for me which bumped me out non-consumer debt status was my home mortgage. I had $169K in unsecured debts related to a failed business and my mortgage was $185K. It wasn't a big deal, as I brought the means test to the 341, and the trustee was satisfied. I explained that I planned on keeping my home which is why I didn't count it as a dischargable debt for BK. I did have to come back for a 2nd 341 because the UST paralegal wanted to review my means test and wanted last yrs final check stub which I emailed to her after the 1st meeting. The 2nd 341 was very smooth.

I think unless you have some outstanding issues or a tough UST, the 341 should be pretty easy. The ones I sat through ahead of me were 5 minutes tops with just basic questions.

[catdance23]

I got a packet in the mail from my lawyer with a bunch of details about next steps and on one page was a list of docuements I needed to submit. Basically just pay stubs and bank statements from between the time we met with the lawyer and the time he filed (about week later). My 341 is next week and I haven't heard anything.

Good luck!!!!

[FreshLikeADaisy]

I filed pro se and found out within a week what additional docs the trustee wanted. So at this point, I think you are fine! Good luck!!!! (plus I honestly think when you file with an attorney, they request less docs then if you file pro-se - just my opinion)

I agree about the pro se'ers having to provide more docs, Danaf. I sure did!!! But like you, I knew within about 10 days of filing exactly what was needed, and though it was a long list it wasn't too much trouble -- it was nothing I didn't already have, for example.

Good luck, Ep!!!