top Ad Widget

Collapse

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Want to keep my home -- too much equity?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Want to keep my home -- too much equity?

    My new attorney (long story) is very thorough. Much more so than my former attorney. But I am worried about one thing...

    We bought our current house in 2005 and had quite a large down payment thanks to the INSANE appreciation of the house we sold when we moved to CO. Even with the ridiculous real estate market, we probably have a good bit of equity in our home.

    Right now we owe $215,000 between our first and second mortgages. We are current and want to keep our home.

    The exemption in CO is $60,000.

    I had a home appraisal done in December when I thought I could refinance myself out of this mess and it came back at $309,000. I thought that was high, but at the time I wasn't complaining.

    First lawyer took a look at that number and then took a look at our county property appraisal which is $295,000. He shrugged, took the $295,000, lopped off 10% for "quick sale" expenses, realtor fees, etc. and came out with $265,500. He said, "$265,500 minus the $215,000 you owe is well under the exemption. No worries."

    My new attorney is a bit more cautious. He said it's tight, and Trustees are VERY shy about taking houses in this economy, but he's having me get a CMA from a realtor.

    In Zillow (FWIW...) I'm at $268,000. On CyberHome I'm actually at $261,000. NOTHING in my neighborhood has sold for anywhere near $300,000 recently.

    What seemed odd is that my new attorney is deducting the same 10% but only off the DIFFERENCE between a hypothetical "sell" price and what I owe.

    For instance...

    $300k minus $215k = $85k - 10% = $76,500 "profit" which means I'd either have to come up with $16,500 to pay the court or they'll sell my house. I've NEVER seen real estate costs handled that way. I've only ever seen them come off the actual sell price of the house.

    With values all over the place, I am scared.

    What is the generally accepted practice for valuing a home for a Chapter 7?

    I can deal with $309k from the appraiser if I get to take 10% off the top for quick sale expenses. That puts me close -- within $3000 -- of my exemption.

    OTOH - I doubt there's any way I'd actually sell my house for that - even in December when the appraisal was done. There's a house that is the same model as mine down the street except it's got an extra bedroom, fireplace in the master, bay window -- all the upgrades -- and it's LISTING at $295,000.

    So I have a realtor coming tomorrow. He knows I have no interest in selling, but is willing to do a CMA as requested by my lawyer. I offered to pay him and he said he'd do it for free.

    I don't want to lose my house. We can afford the payments. I'm afraid if I did have to move I'd actually have to pay MORE per month than I am now. I certainly couldn't qualify for a 5.9% mortgage like I have now.

    If this CMA comes back high, what are my options? Would a Chapter 13 work? Lawyer just said, "Let's see what your CMA comes back at and we'll go form there..."
    Filed Chapter 7 - 7/8/09
    341 - 8/24/09
    Discharged - 11/3/09
    Closed - 12/10/09

    #2
    Originally posted by FakeName View Post
    If this CMA comes back high, what are my options? Would a Chapter 13 work?
    The problem is that even in Ch 13, the same bk exemptions are in place. If you are over the homestead exemption in Ch 7, you'll still be over the homestead exemption in Ch 13 too. (And, btw, Zillow and CyberHome aren't reliable sources of the true current market value of your home. Both tend to be high.)

    Ask the realtor to run "comps" (comparables) of the actual selling prices of homes similar to yours in your neighborhood over the last 60 days. That's the real current market value of your home.

    Lawyer just said, "Let's see what your CMA comes back at and we'll go form there..."
    I think your lawyer is very wise. Find out where you stand before getting overly worried about things that might never happen.

    Given the current state of the real estate markets across the country, I'm betting you'll be fine and your house equity will be under the allowed homestead exemption when you file. Keep us posted about what happens when the appraisal is done, and hang in there!
    I am not a lawyer and this is not legal advice nor a statement of the law - only a lawyer can provide those.

    06/01/06 - Filed Ch 13
    06/28/06 - 341 Meeting
    07/18/06 - Confirmation Hearing - not confirmed, 3 objections
    10/05/06 - Hearing to resolve 2 trustee objections
    01/24/07 - Judge dismisses mortgage company objection
    09/27/07 - Confirmed at last!
    06/10/11 - Trustee confirms all payments made
    08/10/11 - DISCHARGED !

    10/02/11 - CASE CLOSED
    Countdown: 60 months paid, 0 months to go

    Comment


      #3
      My bet is that this is no problem whatsoever.

      Your realtor will run the comparables and then give you a net proceeds sheet.
      This will be the value of your house minus all the fees of selling.

      Comment


        #4
        So my realtor provided some comps and a CMA and said if he was going to list my home he'd list it at $299k and hope for $280k given that nothing in my 'hood has sold anywhere near that in the last 6 months (other than new construction where you're basically paying the builder for a house that doesn't exist yet).

        I was straight up with him and told him my situation. I told him I need a fair, accurate, bottom-line price for my attorney of what the house could potentially sell for tomorrow in an as-is sale.

        He said, realistically homes in my area have been on the market for around 6 months and blah, blah, blah -- he worked some real estate magic and said that if the home was to sell quickly and as-is he'd list at $264,000 and that I'd be lucky to get $255k out of it.

        He did a net proceeds sheet saying that I'd be lucky to walk away with $238,000 after paying selling expenses. Needless to say, this is quite a relief. Seems that a lot has changed in the 6 months since my "official" appraisal in December and that there is a big difference between saying what a home is "worth" and saying what you could actually sell it for in this market.

        This is a load off my mind. In addition, I got an updated property tax assessment from the county and my home's value fell $3000 in terms of property tax appraisal. This is the one and only time in my life I'm relieved to see my property value on the decline.

        I'm hoping I'm a lot more obsessed over this than my attorney or trustee and that this won't even come up again. According to my calculations (based on the realtor's calculations), someone would have to be able to actually sell this house for something close $300k for me to be over my CO exemption. According to the comps from the CMA and my county tax assessor (as well as the Zillow and Cyberhomes reports), I'm not even in the ballpark.

        Thanks for the support, folks. Next I need to get all this -- and the 3" high pile of paperwork I've amassed -- to my new attorney so we can hopefully get moving on this thing and get it done!
        Last edited by FakeName; 05-04-2009, 03:07 PM.
        Filed Chapter 7 - 7/8/09
        341 - 8/24/09
        Discharged - 11/3/09
        Closed - 12/10/09

        Comment


          #5
          Good deal!

          Net proceeds is the key, not sale price. You should always ask for a new proceeds sheet with the appraisal.

          Comment


            #6

            Your realtor will run the comparables



            What happens if you live in a small rural town and nothing has sold for the last year? The closest town is 18 miles away and they are at least 8000 people in one and 10-15K in another one. This town is less than 200 people.

            You can't do comparables with those bigger towns because they are completely different. I don't even have a gas station here.
            Filed 5/11/09 Chapter 7
            341 Meeting 6/5/09
            Discharged 8/5/09
            Case Closed 8/6/09

            Comment

            bottom Ad Widget

            Collapse
            Working...
            X