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should I bother filing now that I live outside the US?

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    should I bother filing now that I live outside the US?

    Hello all, I am new to this forum, and have searched the posts and found some relevant information, but not quite what I need to know. Here is my family's background and questions:

    We moved to Costa Rica last September (have not returned to US since) and had around $100K in CC and student loan debt at the time. Our last place of residence was in WV, but we have had our mail sent to a PO Box in Miami, which will expire this Sept (we do not plan to renew the PO Box, after which time we will have no US contact location). By now our debts would be significantly more due to interest payments. We have made no payments on anything since we have left.

    There have been many notices sent to our post office box in Miami and many calls made to our family members, but there has been no actual contact with us since we have essentially dropped off the planet (haven't had phone access until the last few weeks even, as it takes so many months down here to get a phone hooked up). We have no assets in the US anymore. Since we do not plan on returning to the US to live, we are not concerned about our credit or liens/judgments, BUT we are concerned about any potential arrest warrants being issued.

    If I understand correctly, if we were to be sued, this would be a civil matter, not criminal, and no warrant would be issued? What if we were called to a hearing and didn't show up, could a warrant be issued then? We would like to be able to visit the US occasionally to visit family, and are concerned that when crossing the border, if there are any warrants for our arrest, they could be triggered. Is there any legitimacy in this?

    We are willing to file chp 7 bankruptcy and would do so ourselves if need be, but if not necessary, we would prefer to just ignore the whole deal and avoid the stress and hassle of this matter (especially since we have two small children we would have to take back to the US with us to deal with the 341, etc), not to mention the expense, and we are trying to live VERY simply/inexpensively (we moved down here with the intention of attaining self sufficiency and producing most if not all of what we need, ie avoiding the need for much money). If we did file, would we need to file out of WV? Would we be able to submit everything online or by fax, and then just show up for the 341, or would we have to be in the US for more than that?

    Also, what about the potential changing of the US laws; if things get bad enough that stricter laws are passed on debtors, would we be grandfathered under the old laws, or could warrants be issued under any potential new laws?? What is the SOL in WV for any such issues? OH, one more VERY important issue is that of obtaining residency in Costa Rica...in order to do so, we will need to have a criminal background check done. If any suits are filed against us, would this show up on a criminal background check, or is that considered totally a civil matter, non related??

    Thanks so much for any help on this....I've read alot online but it is very hard to find info pertaining specifically to debtors no longer living in the US. Take care, Jamie and family
    Last edited by lrprn; 05-29-2009, 10:01 PM. Reason: Created paragraphs to improve readability

    #2
    Since you don't intend to return to live in the US but do want to visit relatives here, if a warrant is in place (and it would be a civil, not criminal case) and you are seen in the US, you can be arrested by returning here.

    Contact a few WV bankruptcy lawyers to set up free initial consulations over the phone to discuss your situation with them. Find out if you do qualify for Ch 7 or 13 and what will happen if your case is filed with you being outside the U.S.

    Good luck - I hope everything works out all right for you and your family.
    I am not a lawyer and this is not legal advice nor a statement of the law - only a lawyer can provide those.

    06/01/06 - Filed Ch 13
    06/28/06 - 341 Meeting
    07/18/06 - Confirmation Hearing - not confirmed, 3 objections
    10/05/06 - Hearing to resolve 2 trustee objections
    01/24/07 - Judge dismisses mortgage company objection
    09/27/07 - Confirmed at last!
    06/10/11 - Trustee confirms all payments made
    08/10/11 - DISCHARGED !

    10/02/11 - CASE CLOSED
    Countdown: 60 months paid, 0 months to go

    Comment


      #3
      OK this is contrary to what my initial, albiet very limited understanding of this is. I thought that no warrants could be issued for civil suits? And as for which state from where to seek a lawyer, I would need to use a WV lawyer, even though I will not have been a resident in the states for over a year by the time I do file, if I do?? Thanks again, Jamie

      Comment


        #4
        I moved to Denmark last year and was advised to "walk away" from my debts. But guess what... I got laid off from my job, my work permit got denied and after 6 months without a job I was forced to move back to the US. Thank God I did not listen to friends and the attorney who told us to "walk away and don't look back". Personally, I would not burn bridges. You never know what life will hold or what your future brings you. I am now back and biting the bankruptcy bullet but I feel good about the decision.

        You can potentially get into trouble for returning if you are "discovered". I don't believe they would have like your picture up at the airport or anything saying "if you see these people arrest them" but for that much debt I believe returning to the US would be risky.
        BK Ch 7 Discharged 09/2009 | Anything I say can and should be used as friendly advice and sharing of experiences with an unbiased viewpoint.
        Scores: EQ 745 EX 704 TU 710 as of 08/15/2012

        Comment


          #5
          Is there a way I can find out if there are lawsuits that have been initiated against my husband or I? Is this what the PACER stuff is about?? Since we will not have a US mailing address after Sept there will essentially be no contact for us. What if there were suits filed, we showed up to the hearing, knowing we would loose the case, but then tell them we can't pay anyway, what can they do? Would this be a case where a warrant could be issued??
          Basically what we so need to know is WHAT exactly would trigger the issuing of a warrant for arrest?
          Jamie

          Comment


            #6
            Have you checked your PO BOX? I'm sure you would have received notice and since they can't contact you any other way it would be there.

            However it might be to soon for that depending when you last paid.

            Extradition is only done for criminal warrants, civil warrants do exist but are only in force in the United States.
            May 31st, 2007: Petition Filed by my lawyer
            July 2nd, 2007: 341 Meeting Held
            September 4th, 2007: Discharged and Closed.

            Comment


              #7
              Pay a BK lawyer, file BK, come back for your 341, and leave with a clean slate.

              You won't have to worry when you come back, if you need to.

              You don't have to worry about credit in Costa Rica.

              If you ever have an emergency with a family member in the States, you won't have to decide between your own well being (potential warrant issues, if any) and your family and their needs. I would hate to not be able to say "Good buy" to a family member if you were worried about coming back, if that situation arose.

              Your SL will always be an issue until you pay them off, you cannot discharge them.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by jwilcoxcr View Post
                OK this is contrary to what my initial, albiet very limited understanding of this is. I thought that no warrants could be issued for civil suits? And as for which state from where to seek a lawyer, I would need to use a WV lawyer, even though I will not have been a resident in the states for over a year by the time I do file, if I do?? Thanks again, Jamie
                A warrant could be issued if you were subpoenaed and didn't show up, or something similar to this. Contempt of court is criminal, and this can happen as a result of a civil suit.
                Chapter 7 Filed: 12/22/08
                341 Meeting: 1/22/09
                Discharged and Closed: 3/24/09

                Comment


                  #9
                  there is civil contempt and criminal contempt. they are not the same thing.

                  generally, before anybody can issue a warrant in a civil case, there has to be a summons or subpoena that's actually served on you, which means somebody hands a paper to you or at the very least puts it in the place where you live. then they would issue the warrant only if you have been served but didn't show up. it would be next to impossible for anybody to serve if you are not in the US. however, not all judges would necessarily care about this fundamental piece of due process. so you'd certainly be taking a risk.

                  also, i thought i read that under special circumstances you can do the 341 meeting in writing by affidavit. i'm guessing if you don't live in the US you might qualify.
                  filed ch7 May 09
                  341 june 09
                  discharged, closed Aug 09

                  Comment


                    #10
                    do you keep a blog about your move by any chance? I know of a blog about this situ, wonder if it was yours...
                    Read the Blog: My Personal Experience With Bankruptcy

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by CatsInTrouble View Post
                      do you keep a blog about your move by any chance? I know of a blog about this situ, wonder if it was yours...
                      No, I don't blog about our move. There are plenty of Costa Rica bloggers, though!

                      OK, doing the 341 by writing would be FANTASTIC! I could probably ask at the Federal Court in WV, yes??? Not only do we live outside of the US, we have two small children (actually, the second is due to be born any day now which may really up our chances of qualifying.

                      Another question: what is a general timeframe before lawsuits are usually begun? We stopped making all payments last September when we left the states. Up until maybe last month, we were getting lots of statements/notices in our Miami PO box and our family members were getting calls from the CC companies themselves, but now this seems to have stopped, and some have passed messages on to our families that they will no longer be able to deal with us on these issues as the matter is being sent to a collection agency. So basically it sounds like most of our debts have just recently been sold to a collection agency. From this point, can anyone roughly say how long we would have until a lawsuit may be issued? Is it important to file BEFORE any lawsuits are issued, or does it make any difference at all?

                      Thanks again everyone, Jamie

                      Comment


                        #12
                        search for "interrogatories in lieu of appearance" and see what the requirements are in your district. good luck.

                        again, to sue you they have to serve you. now they only have your family's phone number and a po box. your family isn't you. make sure your family knows that they are not authorized to give out any info about you (except that you are no longer in the us) or to take any messages. you and your family are under no obligation to make it easy for someone to sue you. i don't know how long before they start trying... but if they can't find you, it will take them longer.

                        do you really need the pobox until september, by the way? i think they give you a partial refund if you close it early.
                        filed ch7 May 09
                        341 june 09
                        discharged, closed Aug 09

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by lrprn View Post
                          Since you don't intend to return to live in the US but do want to visit relatives here, if a warrant is in place (and it would be a civil, not criminal case) and you are seen in the US, you can be arrested by returning here.

                          Contact a few WV bankruptcy lawyers to set up free initial consulations over the phone to discuss your situation with them. Find out if you do qualify for Ch 7 or 13 and what will happen if your case is filed with you being outside the U.S.

                          Good luck - I hope everything works out all right for you and your family.
                          Warrants are criminal not civil. Only a summons can be issued in Civil actions. He fails to appear, its only a default judgment.

                          Comment

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