BOA considering adversary proceeding. Advice/comments please.

[tobee43]

OK, I am thinking we need to settle also. I guess I will call our attorney tomorrow. Maybe I can see if he could negotiate a little less on it. We will have to borrow from family which sucks, but I see no other alternative at this stage. We already have a DIL in progress with the bank for the house, and it was stipulated on that we will not sign until after discharge, we can stay until then, and no foreclosure action would be started. So I think opting out and refiling at a later date would screw that all up to.

I just want it all over with...this would drive me to drinkin' if I had the cash for a beer!

yes, i really think that is the best way for you to go in this situation....however, as i think most of us here pointed out...don't let your atty get off the hook...i still would approach them about why this happened and ask them for a logically explanation etc.

best of luck and let us know how it works out for you!

[wnguyen]

i actually think it will depend on where you are and how the courts view the 90 day law...

where we filed according to our atty, no ap can be filed until the charge was with the 90 period prior to the filling date. it appears to me if you last charges were 7/11..and being that you 341 is 11/8...not looking good...that's NOT even 90 days between the last charge you did and your 341.

now, seriously...i'd call your atty on this....what the heck was he or her thinking...???? one of the main questions any atty asks you prior to filing is;

have you charged anything within the past 90 days...and if so, before we file for you we must let some more time pass between now and filing????if the answer from with you was YES they he or she should have replied ok..then we need to wait until we file your petition or we could and most likely WILL run across a problem or two or three or ten........END OF STORY!!

i would be extremely upset with my atty on this...because actually, at this point your only way out would be, to, indeed settle with boa...(YUCKKKKKK) or take it all the way and end up having to pay the full amount..

if it were me...i'd would chose to opt out of this bk and ask the case be dismissed.....wait the time period and refile ....after all a new atty would cost you LESS than what BOA is asking you to pay them...i'd make the darn atty you have do it for nothing!! and......file a complaint against him or her.

tobee

Your ideas sound pretty interesting and good in terms of costs but here is one possibility. Even if the OP chose to opt out of this bk and asked the case be dismissed BOA would still win the AP, then the charge would become permanently nondischargeable even if he refiles 6 months later. If I'm wrong about this, please anyone, especially those with legal background, correct me. In his original post, he stated that his attorney advised him to wait 6 months but for some reason he didn't wait. Right now what I think would be best for him is to settle with BOA.

[tobee43]

tobee

Your ideas sound pretty interesting and good in terms of costs but here is one possibility. Even if the OP chose to opt out of this bk and asked the case be dismissed BOA would still win the AP, then the charge would become permanently nondischargeable even if he refiles 6 months later. If I'm wrong about this, please anyone, especially those with legal background, correct me. In his original post, he stated that his attorney advised him to wait 6 months but for some reason he didn't wait. Right now what I think would be best for him is to settle with BOA.

yes, wn, in rethinking the situation, i believe you are correct.

it just makes me upset that these atty's do not advise their clients correctly. i doubt it really, that if the OP's atty said...look we can be in some trouble here and you may have to pay out of pocket do you still want to proceed....now if that was done and OP chose to continue the process i would just feel better about the situation as a whole...it's the atty that bothers me in this situation, of course, that's assuming the OP was not advised...and we ALL know what one says about assumptions..LOL!!

[wnguyen]

I agree tobee. Either that or his atty didn't try hard enough to convince him to delay his filing, such as only saying to wait 6 months without explaining to him the reasons/consequences if not wait.

[tobee43]

I agree tobee. Either that or his atty didn't try hard enough to convince him to delay his filing, such as only saying to wait 6 months without explaining to him the reasons/consequences if not wait.

personally we waited over 2 years...to be able to honestly and legally answer many of the petition questions as "NO". it took time and to say it was stressful is an understatement..but we had to, so that we could be honest. ( i'm not referring to charge accounts...just some certain questions on the petition itself).

however, by doing that, that also did put tons of time between any charges and our filing date, which was helpful, i believe in our situation even tho, the charges which were over 200k where for medical expenses...clearly not luxury items.

for many, and i do know someone that was advised by her atty to put more time distance between her and her filing date, she still ended up having to pay a few because i guess she blatantly charged and the creditors still filed ap's and won.

[wnguyen]

I couldn't wait for that long, tobee. I was roughed up by many creditors and especially citi was so eager to sue me and honestly at that time, I was scared. One way or another, it was both stressful and truthful to the core. If I could wait as long as you are, I would. My only "luxury" item I charged before filing 6 months was a used laptop and it died before I even filed. Strangely enough, my atty didn't tell me any of this 6 months delay, probably she knew I already did

[tobee43]

I couldn't wait for that long, tobee. I was roughed up by many creditors and especially citi was so eager to sue me and honestly at that time, I was scared. One way or another, it was both stressful and truthful to the core. If I could wait as long as you are, I would. My only "luxury" item I charged before filing 6 months was a used laptop and it died before I even filed. Strangely enough, my atty didn't tell me any of this 6 months delay, probably she knew I already did

well, i must say vacating our home after 33 years and packing it in and moving to another state......basically in the middle of the night...getting a new unlisted number...telling all our neighbors of 33 years...each of them a different place we were moving...and not one of them being collect...did keep the creditors at bay during our 2 year wait...they simply could not find us....

a bit of karma associated with that was...and actually this is pretty funny...we couldn't understand by the caller id why BOA, CHASE, discovery etc were calling us..or how the Heck they found us....well come to find out the people that had our NEW number...it was their number and they owned everyone and their mother and their mother's mother too!! LOL!!! so we were STILL getting the calls...they didn't believe me when i told i wasn't the people....they just keep insisting we were lying and we were them...LOL!!!!!!! that's what WE get.

it did finally stop!

[wnguyen]

Wow, 33 years. I'm sorry to hear this tobee. Long enough to be probably a third of your life. I'd be devastated to lose a home like that. About the creditors, they're notorious and somehow have their ways of finding you, no matter what.

[tobee43]

Wow, 33 years. I'm sorry to hear this tobee. Long enough to be probably a third of your life. I'd be devastated to lose a home like that. About the creditors, they're notorious and somehow have their ways of finding you, no matter what.

thank you kindly wn....but in retrospect...it was the BEST thing that ever happened to us...we just left the house and not the memories...

once we realized there was no way to keep it, we just had to take out the mountain of emotions and make a sound business decision for the betterment of our future. it was really hard at first...and sometimes i wake up in the morning and forget where i am...yikes...but it's good now....LOL! it was not quite even 1/2 my life since i moved in there when i was about 20...but change is always hard i know.

also ...it needed about 150k worth of work was too big to manage and now we are in resolve but happy!!

thanks again for your kind thoughts! home IS where the HEART IS...really it is.

[McMark]

To be fair, our attorney did say we should wait 6 months and put some time between us and the cash advance, but to continue paying the minimum payment. He said the risk was the $4,000 CA could be non-dischargeable.

My wife had lost her job in January of 2009, and it took to March of 2010 to find another. Creditors began leaving messages for her at work, and we got nervous about her possibly losing her job over it. Didn't want that.

Then doing the math...our minimum payment on that account was $540 a month, so in 6 months we would have paid roughly $3,200 anyway so we thought why put off the inevitable. Unfortunately no one apparently thought of the stuff we charged to clean up after the floods this past summer. No flood insurance to help out, regular homeowners did not cover that "Act of God", and FEMA denied any help to our area. There were people who had it worse, they could no longer go into their homes as the foundations literally washed away, and FEMA is not helping them either.

I guess we were just hoping after our research that the $4,000 would have been all that was disputed, but the CC would have offered something lower. Instead, we end up with a $5,000 offer.

Sorry to hear your story tobee, 33 years is a long time, but I hear what you say about leaving the house and not the memories. We had hit a rough spot about 5 years back, and I was so upset we were going to lose our house. My mom gave us several thousand to help us through, and things turned around and we were able to give it back to her 6 months later. This time, when I knew this was going to happen, the house became just a building and not that important at all. I put alot of work into it in the 9 years I've been in it, so some days I look around and feel sad...but then I bump my head on the low basement ceiling and cuss a little and say I can't WAIT to get the heck out of this place.

[tobee43]

To be fair, our attorney did say we should wait 6 months and put some time between us and the cash advance, but to continue paying the minimum payment. He said the risk was the $4,000 CA could be non-dischargeable.

My wife had lost her job in January of 2009, and it took to March of 2010 to find another. Creditors began leaving messages for her at work, and we got nervous about her possibly losing her job over it. Didn't want that.

Then doing the math...our minimum payment on that account was $540 a month, so in 6 months we would have paid roughly $3,200 anyway so we thought why put off the inevitable. Unfortunately no one apparently thought of the stuff we charged to clean up after the floods this past summer. No flood insurance to help out, regular homeowners did not cover that "Act of God", and FEMA denied any help to our area. There were people who had it worse, they could no longer go into their homes as the foundations literally washed away, and FEMA is not helping them either.

I guess we were just hoping after our research that the $4,000 would have been all that was disputed, but the CC would have offered something lower. Instead, we end up with a $5,000 offer.

Sorry to hear your story tobee, 33 years is a long time, but I hear what you say about leaving the house and not the memories. We had hit a rough spot about 5 years back, and I was so upset we were going to lose our house. My mom gave us several thousand to help us through, and things turned around and we were able to give it back to her 6 months later. This time, when I knew this was going to happen, the house became just a building and not that important at all. I put alot of work into it in the 9 years I've been in it, so some days I look around and feel sad...but then I bump my head on the low basement ceiling and cuss a little and say I can't WAIT to get the heck out of this place.

well, as odd as this sounds mcmark, i'm somewhat glad that you made the decision with your eyes open...that makes me feel better about your atty.

we could wait since we both lost our jobs and had nothing between us and creditors...leaving the state also helped since they could not locate us. actually the first they heard after a very long time was notice of filing of bk..at which point our new address was on the petition, but they could not contact us...nor ever tried....besides we listed our address in care of , as we were just staying somewhere temporary and had no home.

i know it sounds sad, again, it was the best thing for us. and those memories of bringing my babies home from the hospital and watching them walk through it when leaving for college will always remain in our hearts...

and let me give you our list....BLACK mold, cracked foundation...flooding yearly after the town changed the road so we were getting our entire first and second floors drenched every year running around like mad people with sub pump...and we are getting too old for this....needed a new septic, leech fields...heat tank..a HUGE job...a new well...a new huge fence around the pool area and so on and so forth...the house was so big we had all the room shut off except for 3 and even then the heat and electric was running us well over 1100.00 a month!! and we kept our heat at 65!! it was a nightmare really..and thinking back our plan was to pay off our house and retire in 5 years...when i got sick and ran up over 200k worth of medical expenses..we were still doing fine paying off at the least 5k a month on the credit card bill...but then all the creditors for NO reason took all of our cards and after some of being with, for over 25 years raised our interest rates from 5-7% to over 39.99%....even one that we had cashed in our 401 and pd 48k the month before knowing we needed the line for more life saving surgery...the bank not only upped the interest rate, but cut the line when they knew i was using 20k that very day to pay a doctor....just closed our account. then another job lose...nothing we could do but get out of town..LOL!! and that's exactly what we did...we felt like criminals on the run and in a way i guess that's exactly what these people made us feel like...people who held respectable jobs their entire lives never late not even once in 40 years...with the exception of the mortgage which i was told by chase i MUST be three months behind before they would consider loan modification...what a scam...

and i'm going on and on again...but once again...i'm not sorry at all.

mcmark, you'll be fine as long as you went through this knowing and making your own decision...after all it's ONLY you that knows what's best for you and yours.. best of luck and let us know what happens!!!

[McMark]

WOW tobee, your "money pit" as I refer to the house, was worse than ours is! I really wanted to see it all fixed up, but then again, I want to be around to see our grandkids grow up. We have the black mold now too, and I don't want them around this place because of it. I also had chest pains for the past year or so, one trip to the ER and they said it was brought on by stress. After we decided to file, like magic those pains went away. The kids were happy to hear that part.

Several of our CC's had juiced us with that rediculous 39% rate too a couple years ago, for being 30 minutes late with our online payment. And we struggled through 6 months at that rate to get them to bring it back down, but they would not go to the 7% we had before, only to 18%. I feel the CC's have brought this all on. Seriously, if people are struggling to make payments at 7 and 8 percent, how is making it 39% going to help anyone? Loan sharks...thats what they are.

I'll be sure to report back as our case progresses. I just hope we don't have any more BIG surprises like this turned into.

[tobee43]

WOW tobee, your "money pit" as I refer to the house, was worse than ours is! I really wanted to see it all fixed up, but then again, I want to be around to see our grandkids grow up. We have the black mold now too, and I don't want them around this place because of it. I also had chest pains for the past year or so, one trip to the ER and they said it was brought on by stress. After we decided to file, like magic those pains went away. The kids were happy to hear that part.

Several of our CC's had juiced us with that rediculous 39% rate too a couple years ago, for being 30 minutes late with our online payment. And we struggled through 6 months at that rate to get them to bring it back down, but they would not go to the 7% we had before, only to 18%. I feel the CC's have brought this all on. Seriously, if people are struggling to make payments at 7 and 8 percent, how is making it 39% going to help anyone? Loan sharks...thats what they are.

I'll be sure to report back as our case progresses. I just hope we don't have any more BIG surprises like this turned into.

well mcmark you should know you are in excellent company here...and when your house is beginning to make you ill, like ours was..what more of a sign can one have?? and, apparently, the banks are accountable to no one so they can do what they want and when they want it...now they have to write off our money....so they really got ahead of themselves..i'm sure they feel just great losing customers of over 25 years...they stink!

i know you'll be just fine. hopefully, no more surprises for you!!

[2manybills]

The only charges that would be allowable that close in are "necessary living expenses". But remember that it will cost BofA a lot of money to file an AP also. Let your attorney negotiate for you. Get it as low as you can and don't throw in the towel easily. I wouldn't dismiss and file later, it's far easier and less risky to settle with BofA. Remember a lot of these guys are all bluff!

[tcreegan]

Hi McMark,

Btw; this is illegal under the new Fair Debt Collection Practices Act...

Creditors began leaving messages for her at work

Amen to this brother...

Seriously, if people are struggling to make payments at 7 and 8 percent, how is making it 39% going to help anyone? Loan sharks...thats what they are.

Hang in there,

Tom in Colo