Partnet buying me out before I go Chapter 7

[pstallone]

Don't take offense at anything that has been posted here. It appears that you have it set in your mind that you have no value in the LLC, that you have no equity. All any of us are attempting to tell you is that the trustee may indeed see it very differently.

Find the best attorney that you can.

Im not set im my mind at all I have no trust in the courts, nor attorneys. I am not taking offense, I agree the trustee may see it differently thats my concern!

[tobee43]

Im not set im my mind at all I have no trust in the courts, nor attorneys. I am not taking offense, I agree the trustee may see it differently thats my concern!

that's why you should get an excellent atty. the one we hired, during the interview my main question, or one of them...was "and what type of past and current relationships to you and have you had with the trustee's in this district".

why? we also had an extremely complex situation with a business, properties owned by more than one party, deed exchanges...i don't even want to go on, however, my point being, the firm we hired had an excellent grasp on the trustee's and who they were and the general psychology of the system in our area. i found that to be extremely helpful. at least for us.

[pstallone]

My brother is not listed on the LLC, I am on the LLC with a business partner. The problem is my partner has no ability to buy out the trustee, the initial point is I can verify I have used up all the equity, but its not whether I am right or wrong the trustee can cause issues that my partner can't afford to defend against.

[pstallone]

that's why you should get an excellent atty. the one we hired, during the interview my main question, or one of them...was "and what type of past and current relationships to you and have you had with the trustee's in this district".

why? we also had an extremely complex situation with a business, properties owned by more than one party, deed exchanges...i don't even want to go on, however, my point being, the firm we hired had an excellent grasp on the trustee's and who they were and the general psychology of the system in our area. i found that to be extremely helpful. at least for us.

I agree 100%, its important to hire an attorney who is familiar with the exact jurisdiction and the trustee in your area.

It seems like I have a very strong case, BUT the trustee can still fight it. I dont know how else to protect the house.

[tobee43]

i understand. we just got to the point where we just accepted that we were throwing the chips in the air and may they land where they fell and we would deal with whatever was there to deal with.

unfortunately, you most likely will get to that point if you decide to file bk. one question i personally would like answered, however,is, if it leads to the wrong direction, at some point, before it gets to deep, you can request a dismissal. that would likely be one of my main questions to the atty. a just "in case" exit strategy.

[frogger]

i understand. we just got to the point where we just accepted that we were throwing the chips in the air and may they land where they fell and we would deal with whatever was there to deal with.

unfortunately, you most likely will get to that point if you decide to file bk. one question i personally would like answered, however,is, if it leads to the wrong direction, at some point, before it gets to deep, you can request a dismissal. that would likely be one of my main questions to the atty. a just "in case" exit strategy.

A Chapter 7 takes a life of its own, so the strategy of requesting a dismissal or letting it die is not the same as in a 13. Once you file a Chapter 7, it doesn't just go away.

[tobee43]

A Chapter 7 takes a life of its own, so the strategy of requesting a dismissal or letting it die is not the same as in a 13. Once you file a Chapter 7, it doesn't just go away.

don't i wish it would go away. actually, i was thinking on the lines of if or when it felt like it was moving in the wrong direction, just not showing up at the hearings or requesting a dismissal or any reason...i.e. a windfall of new income, etc. couldn't anyone request a dismissal, and if not, what could happen? this wondering mind would really like to know.

i have seen the question poised, but i never personally considered it, just was wondering if it may be a possibility?? you think not?

[Peeps]

You indicate that you have $0 equity left in the business. You also indicate you are still entitled to a partner's share. It won't matter how good your attorney is... if your interest in the business appears to be uncertain (and that uncertain appearance is usually achieved through conflicting statements) a trustee will swoop right in.

You ask how your partner can legally buy you out. If you have $0 equity in the business, then what's left to buy out? The partner's share? Something = nothing? The trustee won't see it that way. If the partner's share has any value, it becomes an asset. If you know personal bankruptcy is inevitable, transferring that asset to an unsecured creditor could be perceived as a preferential insider payment (or possibly even fraud).

Your attorney may have been putting it nicely when he/she indicated it would be difficult to know what the trustee might do. Trustees aren't really that hard to predict. They go after assets. You've got a home and possibly some kind of asset in a business that you indicate is functionally dead. The dead LLC has no direct business relationship with your brother. Any type of transfer goes through you, and that's where things get very sticky because you clearly know you're headed for bankruptcy. This isn't "risky," as much as it is "ripe."

You absolutely need to nail your story down and be sure you're talking about your interests and assets consistently. Otherwise you open the door to a lot of questions that appear to have conflicting answers. Even the most competent attorney would be challenged in representing that.

One last thing. There's talk about finding attorneys who are very familiar with the trustee. This might be plural in your case: the Bankruptcy Trustee and the US Trustee. You would be wise to plan for both. Best of luck.

[pstallone]

You indicate that you have $0 equity left in the business. You also indicate you are still entitled to a partner's share. It won't matter how good your attorney is... if your interest in the business appears to be uncertain (and that uncertain appearance is usually achieved through conflicting statements) a trustee will swoop right in.

You ask how your partner can legally buy you out. If you have $0 equity in the business, then what's left to buy out? The partner's share? Something = nothing? The trustee won't see it that way. If the partner's share has any value, it becomes an asset. If you know personal bankruptcy is inevitable, transferring that asset to an unsecured creditor could be perceived as a preferential insider payment (or possibly even fraud).

Your attorney may have been putting it nicely when he/she indicated it would be difficult to know what the trustee might do. Trustees aren't really that hard to predict. They go after assets. You've got a home and possibly some kind of asset in a business that you indicate is functionally dead. The dead LLC has no direct business relationship with your brother. Any type of transfer goes through you, and that's where things get very sticky because you clearly know you're headed for bankruptcy. This isn't "risky," as much as it is "ripe."

You absolutely need to nail your story down and be sure you're talking about your interests and assets consistently. Otherwise you open the door to a lot of questions that appear to have conflicting answers. Even the most competent attorney would be challenged in representing that.

One last thing. There's talk about finding attorneys who are very familiar with the trustee. This might be plural in your case: the Bankruptcy Trustee and the US Trustee. You would be wise to plan for both. Best of luck.

I am not looking to be entitled to anything, I just want my partner and the house left alone, I HAVE used up all my equity. I am not looking to be bought out at all. I truly have no assets. I can verify all checks I have written from the business account to pay my debts.

[pstallone]

don't i wish it would go away. actually, i was thinking on the lines of if or when it felt like it was moving in the wrong direction, just not showing up at the hearings or requesting a dismissal or any reason...i.e. a windfall of new income, etc. couldn't anyone request a dismissal, and if not, what could happen? this wondering mind would really like to know.

i have seen the question poised, but i never personally considered it, just was wondering if it may be a possibility?? you think not?

Thats a good question, I was told once you file Chp 7, its filed, its very hard to get it dismissed.

[tobee43]

Thats a good question, I was told once you file Chp 7, its filed, its very hard to get it dismissed.

i as well, but i still have seen the trustee's dismiss them for one reason or other...i.e. turn a non asset case to an asset or send a chapter 7 to roll over to a 13...i'm just wondering if "they" can, and one's situation changes or one has a change of heart or mind, if it's possible?? hopefully one of our forum atty's might have the answer???

[pstallone]

i as well, but i still have seen the trustee's dismiss them for one reason or other...i.e. turn a non asset case to an asset or send a chapter 7 to roll over to a 13...i'm just wondering if "they" can, and one's situation changes or one has a change of heart or mind, if it's possible?? hopefully one of our forum atty's might have the answer???

It would make it a simpler decision for me, if you could. If I go Chp7 and we cant convince the trustee that my equity is used up, I would want to drop it obviously. I dont make enough income to go Chp 13

[tobee43]

It would make it a simpler decision for me, if you could. If I go Chp7 and we cant convince the trustee that my equity is used up, I would want to drop it obviously. I dont make enough income to go Chp 13

it will interesting how this exactly works out. make certain you keep in touch with the board!!

[keepmine]

As Frogger posted, once you file a Chapter 7, the trustee does not have to give you permission to dismiss. Even if you fail to show at the 341, the trustee does not have to let you go if, they feel there are assets to administer.

[tobee43]

As Frogger posted, once you file a Chapter 7, the trustee does not have to give you permission to dismiss. Even if you fail to show at the 341, the trustee does not have to let you go if, they feel there are assets to administer.

i don't believe they do as well, however, i just was wondering what type of argument would allow one to get it dismissed??