Battling with AZ HOA since filing for BR - but received discharge today!

[maffy]

I'm in Arizona and have been battling with my HOA regarding a monitoring fee that they want me to pay ever since I filed for Bankruptcy in Feb.

Good news is, I checked pacer today and my discharge was granted!!!! Yippeee!

I have send them two letters asking them to tell me "where" in our governing documents that allows the hoa to charge this fee. I did include my house in my BR - but am not behind on payments, so the mortgage company said they would be happy to continue to receive payments in lieu of forclosing on my property. So no foreclosure notification has been sent to me or the HOA.

My attorney included my HOA when filing, though they were owed no money (I am current with them - except I for the monitoring fee which I have not paid).

About a week ago, the HOA's Management company called me and said the fee was not in any of the documentation - it was part of "their" written contract with the HOA and that they can charge it because of the paperwork I filed for the BR to "monitor" my situation whenever they get any notificiation. I asked them to send me their response in writing but have not received it as of yet.

Does anyone know anything about this? HOA's can only charge fees that are allowed within our documents, can't they? They can't single out someone in BR just because they were copied on the filing, can they?

[btbeme]

An HOA, like any other entity, can TRY anything. The bigger issue is whether challenging them is more of a money or time-waster than simply paying them to go away. HOAs in AZ are given a lot of leeway, though there are some very recent laws passed in the last 60 days that might help you here (search on Google). I cannot prove it, but I do have a gut feeling that "monitoring fees" charged during the course of a Ch 7 proceeding would likely be verboten by the court. Methinks the HOA is grabbing at straws here. Imagine the dialogue in front of a judge when he asks for any proof of contract...

Big questions - did you reaffirm your home loan? Do you plan to stay and pay? This is relevant, because if you plan to stay, a non-payment (or not defeating them legally) will mean a lien on the house. However, if you plan to vacate, I say stop paying them anything and let them lien lien lien until the cows come home.

Even most short sales will make good on HOA fees and liens - typically charging the new owner in fees on the loan.

Our HOA filed a $2200 lien on our place for non-payment of dues, plus fees. So, they will get their lien paid when we either sell our house at a profit (BWAAAAHAHAHAHA! We are $250,000 upside down and 11 months late), or someone else buys it at auction and the bank or the new owner pays up.

Big congrats on your discharge! It may take a few weeks for the case to close, so be patient.

[AngelinaCatHub]

How DARE they sell you something you do not wish to purchase? Who they think they are, Obammy? Forget it and if they attempt some kind of lien sue them pro se as then "They" have to come up with a legal reason, not an outside second party agreement. AND monitor what? That in itself would be an invasion of your privacy. You might just tell them you will make that issue with the Federal Trade Commission. What name of the so called company? I wish to Google it. Sounds phoney to me. 'Hub

[AngelinaCatHub]

Oh I didn't forget

To you and yours. From all of us at the Forum. Your dance of Victory.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9aA_fba_To

[helpmeout]

How DARE they sell you something you do not wish to purchase? Who they think they are, Obammy?

@@, must you bring politics into everything?

[maffy]

Thanks Btbeme and Angelina (you crack me up!) !

Btbeme I'm curious, were you behind 11 months - on your mortgage (before they foreclosed) or on your hoa dues? No, I didn't reaffirm my mortgage (I'm about $50,000 upside down). I have an interest only loan for another 4 years, then my payments will increase. Not sure what I'm going to do in the long run, but for the time being I will stay and pay for a while longer, as long as I can afford the payments. I plan on staying current with the HOA maintenance charges. This is a nice neighborhood and I know that hoa's rely upon maintenance fees to keep the neighborhoods up, but I'm not going to pay them any arbitrary additional fees that they "want" to charge...

Thanks for your responses - You're so right Angelina, monitor what???? If I were behind it would be one thing, but I'm not. It helps SO much to have a few others give me their take on this.

Thanks for the hamster dance!!!!

[bcohen]

About a week ago, the HOA's Management company called me and said the fee was not in any of the documentation - it was part of "their" written contract with the HOA and that they can charge it because of the paperwork I filed for the BR to "monitor" my situation whenever they get any notificiation. I asked them to send me their response in writing but have not received it as of yet.


Well, by that logic, the HOA's management company could also charge you for office supplies, ink and toner for their printers, and maybe even ask you to pay their phone bill while they're at it. See how stupid that sounds? The point I am trying to make is that even if it is true that the HOA's contract with its third-party management company allows the management company to bill the HOA for "monitoring" one of the homeowners' bankruptcy cases, you are not a party to this contract. It is up to the HOA to absorb this cost, just as they absorb the costs of landscaping, electricity for street lighting, and so on. They cannot legitimately bill you for this fee, even if the management company is charging them for it.

I would say to keep on disputing this, and if necessary, raise it with the actual board of the HOA that you are being charged punitive, discriminatory fees because you filed for bankruptcy protection--even though you have not defaulted on any debt to the HOA--and that this is a direct violation of state and federal consumer protection laws. Remind them of the fact that you don't want to have to get your attorney involved, which will result in fines against the HOA for each violation--you'd like to resolve this amicably.

[jacko]

I noticed a correlation of why some who hate Obama for no reason. They tend to be in their sixties mostly caucasian who do understand why the society they are accustomed to has been pulled underneath them due to societal change. They need to blame someone who does not look like them and does not have a traditional American name for their own personal and financial failings.

@@, must you bring politics into everything?

[Sariah]

I noticed a correlation of why some who hate Obama for no reason. They tend to be in their sixties mostly caucasian who do understand why the society they are accustomed to has been pulled underneath them due to societal change. They need to blame someone who does not look like them and does not have a traditional American name for their own personal and financial failings.

If I can write my own tax rules like GE and have Obama *OK* it, I would love Obama like GE loves Obama. Yea, I do not like Obama times ten. Oh, I am def not in my sixties. :/

[Cavedog]

Maffy,

I am now monitoring your BK actions. I will be billing you $495. You can pay over 12 equal installments interest free. :-)

[jacko]

The tax perk that GE may have received in the tax code were inserted by member(s) of Congress which is than voted by the entire Congress when passing the appropriation bill. The President had nothing to with it and will not veto just because GE got a perk. Its really our fault for allowing this to happen by not paying attention to this and not demanding Congress to get rid of the tax code.

If I can write my own tax rules like GE and have Obama *OK* it, I would love Obama like GE loves Obama. Yea, I do not like Obama times ten. Oh, I am def not in my sixties. :/

[maffy]

Maffy,

I am now monitoring your BK actions. I will be billing you $495. You can pay over 12 equal installments interest free. :-)

Cavedog, Get in line... oh yeah, I included you in my bankruptcy Thanks for the laugh!

Thanks Bcohen for your response... I think I'll use some of that verbiage as this progresses!

[Sariah]

The President had nothing to with it

Really??? Do you really think that??? LOLOLOLOL!!!!!

[AlmostAmos]

I noticed a correlation of why some who hate Obama for no reason. They tend to be in their sixties mostly caucasian who do understand why the society they are accustomed to has been pulled underneath them due to societal change. They need to blame someone who does not look like them and does not have a traditional American name for their own personal and financial failings.

Oh Lord. You seriously believe that? You think that moron gives people NO REASON to hate him?

[IamOld]

The tax perk that GE may have received in the tax code were inserted by member(s) of Congress which is than voted by the entire Congress when passing the appropriation bill. The President had nothing to with it and will not veto just because GE got a perk. Its really our fault for allowing this to happen by not paying attention to this and not demanding Congress to get rid of the tax code.

Actually this isn't NEW - this has been a long-standing and very problematic part of the tax code - the tax break for corporations that ship jobs overseas. In fact (per Fortune Magazine) over 2/3 of the largest US corporations pay ZERO fed income taxes.

Nice. (sarcasm)