Is the second "person" in the means test an "earner?" or just a "spouse?"

[assprotekshn]

Hi everyone, I love this site!

we're considering filing a BK7, and i haven't gotten past the means test yet.
The value for "one earner" would put us at presumption of abuse, but adding the second person...would put us underneath into the safe zone. My question is when they say "second person" does that have to be an earner? Or is it a second dependant in the household? The places I looked didn't specify and we have only one earner in our family...who makes just slightly more than the means test limit.

Also, if anyone knows.....do creditors and trustees prey on people who file pro se? Do creditors take advantage just because a person isn't represented by an attorney? If we started pro se, and this happened, could we retain an attorney later?

Thank you so much in advance, i'm grateful for any input anyone has!

[justbroke]

I don't know what you mean by "one person" or "earner" or any of those things. The "Means Test" is part of an official bankruptcy form known as Official Form 22 (22A for Chapter 7, and 22C for Chapter 13). When you are married, you are always "married" for purposes of the means test. However, you can file solely or jointly. In either case, the income of both spouses count... even if one of them has "no" income. You just put $0.00 for their income.

If you are pro se you can run into issues if you have any assets or "mess up" on the forms. Assets means that you own ANYTHING of value, including furniture. Depending on the State that you live in, you could have very few "exemption" to cover your assets and you would become an asset case. You could even "mess up" on the asset exemption sheets and end up causing issues where you need to surrender money or other personal property. This could be just because you misunderstood what "personal property" is. Any money in the bank is personal property and an asset. Any right to receive proceeds from a lawsuit, is personal property and an asset.

If you are not diligent, cautious, steadfast, nitpicking, highly accurate, and highly assertive, I wouldn't recommend filing pro se. The petition (package) is intimidating and can easily be 50 pages. (My filing was 70 pages, exactly, and didn't include my Chapter 13 Plan.)

What I would recommend that you do, before considering pro se, is to go read a good book on filing. The NoLo Press makes an excellent guidebook to filing Chapter 7. I believe there is at least one other book out there. (I believe the eBook is about $20 or so and you may be able to find an online coupon for it.)

[assprotekshn]

Hi JustBroke, I just wanted to say a belated "THANKYOU" for your answer!!! I couldn't log on....had to request a new password, so here i am!

I think i'm going to take a look at the NOLO book before i decide which way to go, thanks again for the invaluable info!