In my case non-consumer?

[lotsahats]

Part of the reason I'm filing BK is to stop an auto accident suit. The court date has been set, and I've quit holding out hope that the plaintiff will settle with my insurance carrier. I'm meeting another attorney next week, and planning on filing at the end of the month, or early next month (depending on how long finding an attorney takes).

I'm just wondering, is my case a non-consumer? My credit card debt is $15K, and I'm being sued for $50K. Obviously, since the court date has yet to come, there has not yet been a judgement, and I'd like to keep that from happening.

[HHM]

Do you have a mortgage? If yes, that debt gets counted as a "consumer debt", as do any existing car loans.

Non-consumer debt =
Income tax debt
Student loans
Business Debt
Mortgages on investment properties (that were originally taken out as investments).

Personal Injury Claim....not 100% sure, but I can certainly see how those would be categorized as non-consumer, but I don't know of any cases off hand that say that.

Also, keep in mind, if your insurance carrier pays the claim, and you were the at fault party, your insurance company will come after you as well...that debt probably would be considered consumer debt.

[lotsahats]

I don't have a mortgage.

From what I understand, debt incurred from an auto accident is considered non-consumer. I was just wondering whether there has to be an actual judgement in place in order for that to happen (in other words, a fixed amount of debt, as opposed to what the plaintiff is "hoping" to get). I can see how it wouldn't be considered a non-consumer case unless there was a judgement stating exactly how much debt is owed.

BTW, why would the insurance company come after me, when I pay them to insure me? The way I understand it, they'll pay up to the amount I'm insured for, but, if the judgement exceeds that amount, I'll be responsible for the rest.

[ValleYum]

And for your planning purposes - you may get dropped from your insurance company at your next renewal (and have to buy insurance at rates for both Post BK and after an accident claim) or face increased premiums from your current carrier.

Should the OP's schedule J reflect that likelihood?

[AbbeyA]

If the suit is criminal in nature -- say you got a dui following an accident that resulted in injuries, I'm pretty certain that that type of debt is never able to be discharged. So if you are filing to stop a criminal suit/monetary judgment, I don't think it is going to help you.

[HHM]

Whether a judgment is entered is immaterial.

[despritfreya]

The accident claim was not incurred for “personal, family or household purposes” and therefore is not on the “consumer” side of the ledger.

Your insurance company is not going to drop you (unless a crime was involved - but then there would be no coverage anyway). Nor is your carrier going to seek recovery from you.

The filing of the bk will temporarily stop the “litigation” however, Plaintiff’s counsel, if he knows what he is doing, will seek to lift the stay for the purpose of continuing the litigation so that recovery can be made against the insurance carrier - not you. The bk court should limit the relief requested to allow for a finding of liability with collection to be made only against the 3rd party insurance carrier.

Des.

[keepmine]

What is the limit of your policy?
This might be an instant where using the "B" word might be a negoiating tool to get the other party to accept the settlement offer.
I'd have my lawyer point out that an actual trial could be years away and the judgment against you might well disppear in a bk filing. Plus, just because they sue for $50K doesn't mean a jury would award that much.
Don't rush to file. Just because you may eventually get sued really means nothing if bk is a viable option. I'd let this play out a little and see if there might be an 11th hour settlement.

[mountanddo]

What is the limit of your policy?
This might be an instant where using the "B" word might be a negoiating tool to get the other party to accept the settlement offer.

If you are in a car accident and it's found to be your fault and the judgement is for more than your insurance pays you can get this discharged in BK? How hurt was the other party? Are they just suing you because they can or is this something that they really were injured? This is one instance where I would feel bad if they actually were injured badly and they didn't get what they were intitled to. Just looking at it from the other side. I guess debt is debt and it's good that this can be discharged but if I was the injured party I would not be happy at all.

[keepmine]

If you are in a car accident and it's found to be your fault and the judgement is for more than your insurance pays you can get this discharged in BK

If no drugs or alcohol or any other criminal act were involved, this sort of judgment can be discharged.

[lotsahats]

If you are in a car accident and it's found to be your fault and the judgement is for more than your insurance pays you can get this discharged in BK? How hurt was the other party? Are they just suing you because they can or is this something that they really were injured? This is one instance where I would feel bad if they actually were injured badly and they didn't get what they were intitled to. Just looking at it from the other side. I guess debt is debt and it's good that this can be discharged but if I was the injured party I would not be happy at all.

The injury wasn't very serious, and there is enough money in my insurance policy to cover 3X the plaintiff's medical bills. There wasn't even an ambulance called to the scene.

And, no, there was no DUI, no malicious intent, no wilful misconduct, no reckless driving, no talking on a cell phone, no texting behind the wheel, none of that. I just made a mistake that anyone could have made, at a notorious intersection.

[HHM]

Then you should be fine, the debt owed to the victim is dischargeable, non-consumer debt. So long as your non-consumer debt is 51% or more of your consumer debt, then you can do a non-consumer chap 7 and ignore the means test.

[TomTea31]

Then you should be fine, the debt owed to the victim is dischargeable, non-consumer debt. So long as your non-consumer debt is 51% or more of your consumer debt, then you can do a non-consumer chap 7 and ignore the means test.

My situation is almost like this persons. So if you have at least 51% non consumer you can ignore the means test? Did not know that!
If they are then I'm like 95% non consumer then.

[nohoneymoney]

My situation is almost like this persons. So if you have at least 51% non consumer you can ignore the means test? Did not know that!
If they are then I'm like 95% non consumer then.

I strongly suggest that you go see an attorney with experience in non-consumer cases. That what we did and it made all the difference.

[TomTea31]

I strongly suggest that you go see an attorney with experience in non-consumer cases. That what we did and it made all the difference.

I'm going to do that. I was planning to file pro se but I kept putting it off since the insurance company is taking it's sweet time to "fry" me. Now I'm due a large tax refund. Might as well use it to pay for an attorney!