Trustee's motion for turnover of property

[beachymama]

The blog is by located at http://www.bankruptcyorlando.com/

[seFlaDude]

If you don't mind me asking, What blog is it? I would be interested in reading it

[justbroke]

The appraiser's posting is very fare if you ask me. It is true that the reason that Appraisers are used extensively in Florida, is because, magically, everyone's home only has $1,000 in property in it. Whether they have a one-bedroom apartment, or 5-bedroom McMansion.

I'll post later on your situation. I'm getting settled.

[beachymama]

Oh, my appraiser wrote this on a blog in response to my blog post (below):

I am the appraiser in Fort Myers. I am not the "Trustees appraiser" as defined as I am under direction to pad a report to the trustees benefit. I am an independent , impartial 3rd party and I have been court appointed to do bankruptcy appraisals in the Middle District of Florida for over 15 years.

I have to agree that it is most unfortunate that the attorneys continue to tell their clients to use "yard sale" values. Judge Paskay does not want liquidation values used. The appraisal report clearly states that the appropriate value is Fair Market. The highest amount exchanged between willing buyer and willing seller with all relevant facts known.

We are very careful to use appropriate secondary markets for valuation.

To use Beachymamas example, it is quite rare to even find a sofa for $50.00 at Goodwill, much less one that you would actually bring into your home. People don't want to realize that items of differing quality and condition have different values.

I often say to people while I am in their home that if I was doing this appraisal for insurance purposes when you got my report you would say I was crazy, you could never replace all this stuff for that amount but when I do it for Bankruptcy and you get the same value on the property , you will say, "that woman is crazy this stuff isn't worth that much"

I asked one debtor with a houseful of lovely furnishings, why one earth she only listed her entire estate at $1,000.00. Her reply was that she was only allowed that much in exemptions. The truth was irrelevant to her.

People need to hire us before they file bankruptcy. Knowledge is power. Go into this prepared.

Joy Augustine , Read & Kelley Estate Services 239 731 2201

My original post:

In my district, the trustees are known for sending out appraisers (ft. myers).
What is unfair here is that the bk attorney will say use garage sale pricing for your schedules and exemptions, but the hired property appraiser does not.
When I added up my personal property, I used garage sale, craigslist type prices like $5 lamps, $50 sofas, $20 end tables, etc.
The trustees appraiser comes in and values my stuff at $150 sofa or $220 sofa $460 for a 5 yr old iMac and $250 for a Maytag stove that the builder included in the home.
So now instead of $1000 in exemptions listed in my BK filing, I am faced with being $8000 over exemptions because the appraiser overvalues stuff (and I have no antiques or jewelry) to make it look like I have more assets and they want me to pay the inflated prices. Then my attorney wants more money to have a hearing to negotiate!
My house is no where near valued at $500,000 and I am giving up my house, and I am giving up my furniture because I will have to pay $8000 to keep it and then $7000 to move it out of state. I don't have that kind of money.

[beachymama]

UPDATE:

I have 20 days from 4-14-10 to advise the court what I want to keep or repurchase as the court was granted the trustees motion for turnover of property.

It also reads that this order is entered without prejudice to the Debtor amending her claim of exemption to seek to exempt funds in the bank as head of family wages.

My attorney is not communicating with me. So I don't know what to do.

I sought the help/advice of an attorney I met at my 341 (filled in for my attorney). He told me that the reason he does not practice anymore is because he no longer had the energy and time to fight with the trustees down here. He said to get a referral to another attorney if my relationship with my current atty is irreparable.

So I guess I am not going to fight with them either to waste my time and money.

I just want to keep a couple of small things and they can keep the rest. Do I just send a letter to the court explaining what I want to keep?

Do I offer the trustee an amount that I will pay to keep the items?

I want to move. Do I just keep these items in my house and just leave?

Who has been through this? Can you tell me the speed of this process for Middle District of Florida (Ft. Myers courts).

Tired, defeated...

[bobbyquefour]

Excuse my language everyone, but that just sucks. Sorry for you!

[beachymama]

From what I have read on these boards, they really will try and sell your stuff if they think they can get some money, even the pee stained stuff.

My attorney is the one who screwed up, she never objected to the trustees objection way back and now I am paying for it.

[gunner01]

What kind of representation? Bankruptcy attorney? Litigation attorney? I guess I was under the impression that the trustees negotiate. I don't understand how my furniture is worth almost $9000 when everything I read online says that the average home has $2-3000 in household goods.

I just don't care anymore. It makes no sense to keep paying attorneys to keep furniture. It is just stuff.

Hello Beachymama,

I have to agree with "justbroke" tell them to COME AND GET IT! I have my appraisal on in April. She explained that they are so booked up. I will keep you posted in regards to the dollar amount they come up with.

Best Regards,

Gunner01

[gunner01]

No you don't have to attend when you're represented by an attorney, unless you were called to testify. It doesn't appear that you are needed.

Yes, it probably has something to do with it.

Not really. If your lawyer is confident that he can have the UST's motion to dismiss or convert denied, then go with that!

Hello Justbroke,

I received a letter last week stating the following...

On 2/19/10 the U.S. Trustee filed a statment that the Debtor's joint voluntary chapter 7 case was presumed to be an abuse under section 11 U.S.C. 707 (b)(2). The United States Trustee has now determined that the presumption of abuse does not arise in this case.

Is it safe to say that they have dropped the 707(b) motion? My meeting was suppose to be tomorrow. What happens to the meeting?

Best Regards,

Gunner01

[backtoschool]

I have three separate bank accounts, one for child support, one for my paycheck and one for other deposits. I opened them several months before I filed for bankruptcy. So they should not be co-mingled.

Should I have her object to the money in the account if I have proof? Or does this create more problems? I am not sure how far back they will go. Before I opened the three accounts, I just had one account all co-mingled.

If your bank accounts are separated like you stated, you definitely should object to the money in the account. That money is exempt and you have proof. It will not cause more problems.

[beachymama]

I have three separate bank accounts, one for child support, one for my paycheck and one for other deposits. I opened them several months before I filed for bankruptcy. So they should not be co-mingled.

Should I have her object to the money in the account if I have proof? Or does this create more problems? I am not sure how far back they will go. Before I opened the three accounts, I just had one account all co-mingled.

[backtoschool]

Your attorney cannot withdraw until you say you do not agree to the trustee's stipulation. Your attorney will have to show up in court.

The problem is that you want to agree to part of the stipulation but not all of it.

Here is what you should tell your attorney to do:

1. Agree to give back the furniture. Call the trustee's bluff on that one. The trustee does not want to have to sell your used furniture.

2. Same with the car. The trustee will work out a payment arrangement with you if you want to keep it.

3. You should have proof that the child support was deposited into your bank account. The problem is that that account cannot have co-mingled funds with your paycheck. The account has to have only child support checks in it for you to be able to exempt the money in the account.

[justbroke]

You still have an attorney. Your attorney has not withdrawn. You will need to weigh what you want to do regarding the property. The Judge will sign an order giving you so many days to "comply" with the order to compel. Personally, I might make them come and get it.

[beachymama]

If you're bored and don't have anything to do.. you can go see the sausage being made. Sometimes, it's actually quite boring.

No, I would have to take off from work, plus it is an hour and half away. I was just wondering if she is going to mess me up some more.

So if I just do nothing, what is going to happen? The trustee will be contacting me now because I will not have an attorney?

I am on Spring Break next week and I am taking the kids up north to see family, we are driving the car they want to take from me.

How soon does this turnover happen? Do they come and take a moving van and pile everything into it?

[justbroke]

My attorney said I don't have to go to the hearing on Friday but maybe I should go?

If you're bored and don't have anything to do.. you can go see the sausage being made. Sometimes, it's actually quite boring.