Trustee's motion for turnover of property

[backtoschool]

Did anyone use the TOOLS OF THE TRADE exemption, if there is such a thing?

No Antiques. Lots of Rooms To Go stuff and Robb & Stucky outlet pieces. I have three kids ages 14 to 7, half my stuff they have left their mark on.

She valued stuff like my lawn mower, a generator, my kids video consoles, computer, printer, stove, refrigerator, washer-dryer, etc, in addition to every piece of furniture!

I know I have a nice home and it presents well, but if she would have looked closer, she would see the computers are missing letter keys, two of the tables have legs that come off and my tables are all scratched up and the sofas smell like pee.

Ahhhh, life is fun.

There is no tools of the trade exemption in Florida.

[beachymama]

Did anyone use the TOOLS OF THE TRADE exemption, if there is such a thing?

No Antiques. Lots of Rooms To Go stuff and Robb & Stucky outlet pieces. I have three kids ages 14 to 7, half my stuff they have left their mark on.

She valued stuff like my lawn mower, a generator, my kids video consoles, computer, printer, stove, refrigerator, washer-dryer, etc, in addition to every piece of furniture!

I know I have a nice home and it presents well, but if she would have looked closer, she would see the computers are missing letter keys, two of the tables have legs that come off and my tables are all scratched up and the sofas smell like pee.

Ahhhh, life is fun.

[DeadManCrawling]

And no way is average furniture worth almost 9k. Just not possible unless you are sitting in a house stuffed with appraised and insured antiques.

I would use that as a first avenue of attack.

[DeadManCrawling]

In our case, money in our accounts was exempted as "head of household" wages, to the amount of about 3k.

This money did not appear in the normal exemptions as listed on schedules. In fact, it did not appear ANYWHERE. Nor did our SS payment for our son.

In fact, this income was never listed at all, anywhere, period. Our attorney was very clear on this point: Since it was exempt, it was not even to be listed as income. Anywhere. Ever.

So that is how it went.

I am unclear, aside from potential Totality arguments, why it WOULD be listed.

We had, on filing day, approximately 5-6k in cash in the accounts. Now, this shows up in the bank statements, of course, but we were never asked about it. I am not sure if our attorney spoke to the trustee about the exemptions, or how it was not questioned. But it wasn't.

[backtoschool]

I have a hearing on March 26th per the attorney today. The attorney says applied $6000 in exemptions, but the furniture valued at $8900 vs. the $500 exempted put me way over...duh.

It does not seem as if she is exempting the child support and my head of household pay. It is showing up as part of the $6000 exempted, like it is part of the $5000 wildcard.

Help me understand.

I should have the $5000 wildcard, $1000 for my car, $1000 for my household goods, so that is $7000 exempted. Plus my child support exemption should not be part of the $5000 wildcard, nor should my pay correct? I had approximately $2400 in child support and $2100 in salary in my accounts when I filed.

If so, than the attorney did not do this. All I see on the asset worksheet is a total of $6000 exempted for everything, including money in bank account, household goods, clothing, jewelry, car, cash.

Is that correct that I should have the $7000 in exemptions plus that $4500 in my bank accounts exempted as long as I can show proof (they are direct deposited)? Or am I assuming wrong?

What to expect at a hearing? Is this where I present the dates, ages, conditions of the furniture and then a comparison of similar sales on Craigslist?

Thank you for your help!

The child support was probably not exempted as child support because it was sitting in your bank account as cash. It should still be exempt though.

The salary may not be exempt if it is sitting in your account. Your attorney will have to help you on that one.

I think the attorney is using your wildcard for the cash and did not single it out as salary or child support.

Your furniture is definitely valued less than $8,900.

[beachymama]

I have a hearing on March 26th per the attorney today. The attorney says applied $6000 in exemptions, but the furniture valued at $8900 vs. the $500 exempted put me way over...duh.

It does not seem as if she is exempting the child support and my head of household pay. It is showing up as part of the $6000 exempted, like it is part of the $5000 wildcard.

Help me understand.

I should have the $5000 wildcard, $1000 for my car, $1000 for my household goods, so that is $7000 exempted. Plus my child support exemption should not be part of the $5000 wildcard, nor should my pay correct? I had approximately $2400 in child support and $2100 in salary in my accounts when I filed.

If so, than the attorney did not do this. All I see on the asset worksheet is a total of $6000 exempted for everything, including money in bank account, household goods, clothing, jewelry, car, cash.

Is that correct that I should have the $7000 in exemptions plus that $4500 in my bank accounts exempted as long as I can show proof (they are direct deposited)? Or am I assuming wrong?

What to expect at a hearing? Is this where I present the dates, ages, conditions of the furniture and then a comparison of similar sales on Craigslist?

Thank you for your help!

[backtoschool]

What additional exemptions am I possibly eligible for in Florida?

Tools of the Trade (teacher)?
Head of Household 6 months salary?
Child Support?

I am not homesteaded now as I chose to give up the homes.

I just want to make sure that my attorney is documenting everything correctly. How do I start documenting to show it was valued incorrectly? Do I go down the list and write when and where I bought stuff and how much I paid? I am not sure I have receipts for everything. Do I go on Craigslist? Ebay? How do I prove she is valuing stuff above what you can get at garage sale.

If I could get $9000 for this stuff at garage sale, I would have my own! LOL!



As I looked at the asset worksheet, she has me down for only $500 in household goods exempted only.

Fun!

Florida's exemptions are really bad if you are not using their generous homestead exemption. Your child support will be exempt as well as your head-of-the-household salary. You have $5,000 total wildcard exemption since you are not taking the homestead exemption. You also have $1,000 exemption for your car, and $1,000 exemption for your household and personal goods.

Value your furniture at what you could get for it on craig's list in the condition it is in. If you push back on the household goods you will most likely win, because the trustee does not want the extra expense of trying to sell your used sofa and mattress.

Typically, trustee's push back the most on cars. Use the NADA value for your car if you were to sell it yourself in "average" condition.

[beachymama]

What additional exemptions am I possibly eligible for in Florida?

Tools of the Trade (teacher)?
Head of Household 6 months salary?
Child Support?

I am not homesteaded now as I chose to give up the homes.

I just want to make sure that my attorney is documenting everything correctly. How do I start documenting to show it was valued incorrectly? Do I go down the list and write when and where I bought stuff and how much I paid? I am not sure I have receipts for everything. Do I go on Craigslist? Ebay? How do I prove she is valuing stuff above what you can get at garage sale.

If I could get $9000 for this stuff at garage sale, I would have my own! LOL!



As I looked at the asset worksheet, she has me down for only $500 in household goods exempted only.

Fun!

[backtoschool]

It sounds like your lawyer dropped the ball on this one.

If you challenge the valuation you will probably win, but it will cost you money.

Then again, if you call the trustee's bluff and tell him to come get your used sofa then he will probably end up abandoning those items anyway since he will not get much for them in an auction and he knows it.

But, since you have to file a response anyway to show that the child support sitting in your bank account is court ordered child support, then you might as well contest the furniture and anything else that your lawyer overvalued.

[beachymama]

I am sure my "do nothing" lawyer will be asking for more money right!?!?!? Ugh.

[justbroke]

Will this piss off the trustee? Make my life even worse than it is already?

No, it's a game. The Trustee is the pitcher, and you are currently at bat. Hit one out of the ballpark now!

I am ok with giving up the furniture. I am moving out of state and that will save me from having to pay to move it. I would like to negotiate with some of the stuff but the majority of it can go.

Depends on what your preference is However, I would challenge the valuation!

[beachymama]

Will this piss off the trustee? Make my life even worse than it is already?

I am ok with giving up the furniture. I am moving out of state and that will save me from having to pay to move it. I would like to negotiate with some of the stuff but the majority of it can go.

I am just hoping to make it though the school year.

[justbroke]

So do I have some bargaining power or I am willing to give it up except my work stuff I need like my laptop, copier and printer (I am a teacher and use that stuff daily).

Now you, through your counsel, will file an Objection to Turnover and Opposition to Trustee's Exemption Values. Then you present your evidence that the Trustee's appraiser used values that are not commensurate with the brand, age and quality of the items. Documentation is key!

Evidently I was supposed to pay $833 a month for the next 14 months beginning February 1, 2010, but nobody told me.

Makes sense why the Motion to Compel Turnover was issued!

[beachymama]

My attorney came up with a letter dated from December that shows that my furniture was valued at $8900. Yes, I did put down $1000 but that was because I thought we were doing garage sale values. The estate appraiser has prices that are not garage sale values. I mean some of the stuff she appraised stuff for more than I paid for it 5-7 years ago.

I mean who pays $200 for a used sofa at a garage sale or $80 for a Gamecube I bought used on Ebay back in 2000? Its not gold.

So do I have some bargaining power or I am willing to give it up except my work stuff I need like my laptop, copier and printer (I am a teacher and use that stuff daily).

Evidently I was supposed to pay $833 a month for the next 14 months beginning February 1, 2010, but nobody told me.

[justbroke]

I don't see anything stating that I objected or that my attorney sent in anything. I will go in and see her this week.

This is one of those Motions that are AUTOMATICALLY granted by the Clerk of the Court (under Authority of the Presiding Judge). Basically, the Trustee doesn't trust the prices that you used to value your property. If you were only using the $1,000 wildcard, and said you only had $1,000 of personal property... I can see the issue clearly!

This means that your Motion for Turnover will need to be fought as to the valuation. Your attorney will need to file an Opposition and/or let the Trustee appraise the property. You may also need to modify the exemptions claimed on Schedule C since you should have, if you surrendered your home or don't have one, claimed the additional $4,000 available under Florida Statute 222.25(4), to give you a total of $5,000 in wildcard and $1,000 for your automobile (if necessary).

You need to get a meeting with your attorney and sit down and chat! That old order was from October. I hope you didn't get rid of anything.