HOA Filed Notice of Assessment Lien: Claim to Attempt Foreclusure in 30 Days?

[MGBK]

We owe our HOA about $2000 in unpaid dues and penalties (haven't paid in roughly 6 months). They filed a "Notice of Assessment Lien" with Los Angeles County Registrar. Their cover letter claims the following:

"In the event the amounts itemized in the lien are not paid within thirty (30) days from the date of this letter (December 11), we will commence foreclosure procedings, and seek a money judgment against you personally, as described in our prior correspondence."

Couple of questions:

1). Can they actually force a foreclosure? Aren't they at least third in line of priority (after our 1st and 2nd mortgage holders)? Is this just sabre-rattling or can they actually force the issue? We are currently awaiting a loan mod offer from Countrywide to see if we can even keep the house, so it all might be moot anyway.

2). If they can force a foreclosure and do so as of 1/11 what kind of time will I have to get our ducks in a row re: filing BK? Would it be best to file before or after this date? In other words, are we better protected to wait to see what they do and then it will all just go into the BK?

3). Am I personally liable for the unpaid dues? Doesn't it just go to the house? If they proceed and we file do they eat the $2K.

4). I really despise my HOA, almost as much as Bank of America, and would love for them to get nothing whether we keep the house or not.

5). Would it be worth shaming them in the media for harassing a family with two special needs kids?

Thanks, everyone!

- MGBK

[MGBK]

Update/Clarification: The notice I (might have) received was unofficial (assuming I had received such a letter and not imagined what one would be like as I described in my previous post!). Today the mailman attempted to deliver the Certified copy, which I refused to sign/accept. He said he would indicate it was "undeliverable." Will doing this buy me any more time because they can't prove I was officially notified, or is it meaningless and I am being foolish?

[justbroke]

Update/Clarification: The notice I (might have) received was unofficial (assuming I had received such a letter and not imagined what one would be like as I described in my previous post!). Today the mailman attempted to deliver the Certified copy, which I refused to sign/accept. He said he would indicate it was "undeliverable." Will doing this buy me any more time because they can't prove I was officially notified, or is it meaningless and I am being foolish?

No won't buy you more time. There are alternate ways of service. The key is, that they attempted to serve it.

In any event, I was going to reply to your post yesterday, and I don't know what happened.

Rather than go through question by question... here's the bottom line. When you signed (executed) your Mortgage/Deed and Note, there was a Rider in it which is the HOA Rider. That contained various rules and probably stated that you had abide by the HOA Covenants. One of those is a Power of Sale clause if you fail to maintain your assessments!

HOA Foreclosures are NO JOKE. Stay on top of this. Maybe in this market, they don't want to do it, but these are no joke. Your Mortgage with your Bank may have another clause which would put you in default as well. Generally, if the Bank finds out, they'll probably bid the value of your balance at the foreclosure sale... to cover themselves.

Just don't mess with this. In some States, the HOA fees are a priority line, just like property taxes. They supersede any liens by mortgages or other debt.

[MGBK]

No won't buy you more time. There are alternate ways of service. The key is, that they attempted to serve it.

In any event, I was going to reply to your post yesterday, and I don't know what happened.

Rather than go through question by question... here's the bottom line. When you signed (executed) your Mortgage/Deed and Note, there was a Rider in it which is the HOA Rider. That contained various rules and probably stated that you had abide by the HOA Covenants. One of those is a Power of Sale clause if you fail to maintain your assessments!

HOA Foreclosures are NO JOKE. Stay on top of this. Maybe in this market, they don't want to do it, but these are no joke. Your Mortgage with your Bank may have another clause which would put you in default as well. Generally, if the Bank finds out, they'll probably bid the value of your balance at the foreclosure sale... to cover themselves.

Just don't mess with this. In some States, the HOA fees are a priority line, just like property taxes. They supersede any liens by mortgages or other debt.

Darn, and I thought I was being clever! I am not treating this lightly, just thought that they would file a lien and get in the back of the line (that is basically what the last lawyer said would happen). Speaking of which we are not yet lawyered up but are close to doing so. We are too "po" to pay right now! We are in California so I am unsure about priority.

Would there be any benefit to contacting Countrywide and telling them what's going on to see what they might do or would that make it worse? What if I contact the HOAs lawyer and explain my situation and attempt to set up a payment plan -- would that buy me some time? I also realize that even if we snake them and file BK before they file the lien that the previous debt is gone but even if we give up the house we have to then pay HOA until the deed is out of our name. (BTW what if we both file a quit claim -- will that remove us both from the deed?).

My wife still has delusions that we can keep and afford this house (which is decreasingly possible when you add in peripheral expenses like HOA and prop taxes in addition to the threat of us filing 7 but having the second mortgage still looming out there as another lien). But, honestly, on some levels this is a perfect example of why we should let it go: right now the extra $115 a month is more than we can swing (medical bills and food come first). So how can we expect to cover the mortgage, HOA and everything else even with a mod? I refuse to go through all of this drama to come out of it with debt still hanging over our heads. How much does a BK/divorce go for? ;)

I guess I just want to play my cards right and stall them long enough for us to file before they submit the lien/force the foreclosure. If they do file the lien does that initiate a foreclosure or are those separate things? In other words can they try to force a foreclosure only after the llien is in place? If they did initiate the foreclosure in Jan. before we file what are the next steps and how much time is left?

Thanks again, justbroke -- I might have to start paying you for advice. Do you take a check? ;)

PS: What about going to the local media and trying to shame the HOA into backing down or off?

[justbroke]

Two things. First, trying to work with the HOA attorney only, if you intend to keep the place. They may be able to setup a payment plan. They will probably indicate that the next year assessment, 2009, would need to be paid on time.

Second, shaming them may work, but do they know of your situation? After talking to their lawyer, and seeing where you progress, then maybe taking it to the media. At this point, it's just a notice. When the foreclosure process actually starts, and after you've attempted to negotiate with the association lawyer... then maybe you can play it in the media.

P.S. I don't take checks. However, if you have some spare Ameros laying around...

[MGBK]

Two things. First, trying to work with the HOA attorney only, if you intend to keep the place. They may be able to setup a payment plan. They will probably indicate that the next year assessment, 2009, would need to be paid on time.

Second, shaming them may work, but do they know of your situation? After talking to their lawyer, and seeing where you progress, then maybe taking it to the media. At this point, it's just a notice. When the foreclosure process actually starts, and after you've attempted to negotiate with the association lawyer... then maybe you can play it in the media.

P.S. I don't take checks. However, if you have some spare Ameros laying around...

I think I will try to stall them with a payment plan, but the reality is that even w/ us working w/ Countrywide there is a chance they could file a NOD as of 1/16 (the day after the last day we can make a payment for the next cycle). The deadline for the HOA is 1/11 so I am thinking we should just file already by that second week in Jan. Then, I can take some pride in sticking it to the HOA just a little. ;)

[Flowers]

My HOA sent me a letter saying a lien was filed, and then when they tried to serve the papers to me in person I was out-of-town, and actually had just filed that day.

So now the $4k is part of the BK, and has "gone-away".

I have since paid the December and January HOA dues.

My question is : can I still go to homeowners meetings? I plan on keeping the home.

[justbroke]

My HOA sent me a letter saying a lien was filed, and then when they tried to serve the papers to me in person I was out-of-town, and actually had just filed that day.

So now the $4k is part of the BK, and has "gone-away".

I have since paid the December and January HOA dues.

My question is : can I still go to homeowners meetings? I plan on keeping the home.

Yes, you can attend and vote at meetings. The only thing you've just done is discharged any HOA fees prior to the filing date.

After the filing date, you are responsible for all fees and for paying them on time.

[hereforinfo]

You do realize that the money you are "sticking it to your HOA" comes from your neighbors, right? They will have to pick up your slack.

Call the attorney and try to work out a payment plan.

[justbroke]

You do realize that the money you are "sticking it to your HOA" comes from your neighbors, right? They will have to pick up your slack.

Call the attorney and try to work out a payment plan.

If the poster filed Bankruptcy... it's too late. It's part of the Estate and will be dealt with depending on the Chapter of Bankruptcy they filed.

Since HOA dues are generally secured debt, via statutory liens, they must be dealt with anyhow.

[Flowers]

Yeah, i am well aware that my neighbors have picked up the slack for me in the last several months. I feel almost embarrassed to go the Home Owners meetings, will I be exposed as that woman who did not pay for 6 months and here she is now. Should I hang my head in shame? I am just a bit nervous to come face to face with the board.

I mean, I still have good ideas and can contribute, you know?

[cpatt1124]

HOA Claims to have filed lien and to pursue foreclosure

I fell behind on my HOA dues last year for around $300. I got a certified letter from an attorney that they had filed a lien and would pursue foreclosure if I didn't pay the $300 plus $500 in "legal fees". Assuming this was just an empty threat from a collection agency, I sent a check for $325 directly to the HOA.

It has been about two weeks, and they have not deposited the check. Did I buy myself any time or even avoid the $500 fee all together? I have only one mortgage and I am current on it. I have every intention of staying in my home. I know this is a bankruptcy forum, but I currently have no intention of filing.

Should I just put a stop payment on the check and send another one to the attorney instead?

[StartingOver08]

Usually when the HOA sends a delinquent account to the attorney, the HOA will not cash your check. In fact, by the time it gets to the attorney stage, the HOA attorney wants a money order or cashiers check and all the fees (late fees, attorney fees etc) must be included with the payment in order to clear the lien or proposed lien.

Some of the smaller associations will work with you to obtain payment. The larger the association, the more inflexible they have a tendancy to be with the process. Pick up the phone, call your association and find out if the check has been deposited. If it has not, find out if you can still work with the association directly or if you must work with the attorney.

If you have a lien, you are going to want to pay with a cashiers check and get a lien release filed too.