new to board and questions (long)

[frustrated7]

[SobStory]

Hi Frustrated - I can't answer your questions. I just want to say that you are very right in trusting your instincts not to leave your entire financial future with an attorney that you are not supposed to contact and leaves you in the dark for several months now. Trust your instincts and gain hold of your financial future yourself. You are on the right path by coming here and doing your research. This is very stressful to all couples, but when you are on different pages even more so. Good luck to you.

PS Hub and I discussed borrowing $$ from family to try to avoid BK. Our decision is that it would be a mistake and we would probably be losing their $$ too. Time to bite the bullet.

[jribe]

I don't know how your family is .. but for most, borrowing money from relatives is an awful idea. It can create a lot of problems. Obviously you are aware of that.

I would recommend that you go to the Legal Consumer Means Test online- it's very helpful. You can enter in all your information and it will give you a pretty good indication if you will qualify.

Also, Nolo has a great BK7 book out. I bought it back in December, though i am planning to file with an attorney. But it goes over *everything* from exemptions to paperwork, means test etc.

Also on legal consumer they have a ton of info as well.

I would also go on your own to consult with a few BK attorneys in your area. I'm not exactly sure why your FIL is so dead set against you filing for BK- but it is your decision. Don't let anyone push you!

Good luck!

Oh- and in regards to the car- the 1200 is equity in the car. So if you owe 15k, on a car and it's worth 10k now- there's no equity. That doesn't mean you can keep the car though. You would either give it up in the BK, or reaffirm the loan.
You could also just buy a cheaper car- I'm in CA and we have exemptions if you don't own a house up to 20k; so we can cover a lot there...

[frustrated7]

thanks for responses

Thanks for the responses. The major problem is that my husband and I are not on the same page with this. We have a whopper of a fight anytime this conversation even comes up. He is content to just wait forever and trust that his father will handle everything. I have no such faith in his father to handle OUR problems and think we need to be taking proactive steps to handle the situation.

Even if the "best case" happens at this point and all the creditors settle for no more than 1/3, we still owe his parents a lot of money and there are tax penalties, though we are insolvent now, so I'm not sure how that works exactly.

I realize that the $1200 is equity in the car. We have a 1995 Beretta which is a total hunk of junk, but because we don't have a loan on it, it would qualify as about double that. Which means we would have to pool our equity into that one crappy car and risk losing the other car, even though we need to have two vehicles. The other car is a 2002 Taurus which still owes $1500, but even that would still have more equity than we would have available. This whole thing is one giant headache and I just wish I could sit down with a BK attorney to go over everything and get me hundreds of questions answered.

Unfortunately, my husband is dead set against seeing a BK attorney right now, at least until his father tells him to. I'm of the mindset that once we get our taxes back we should use that money to hire a BK attorney and go on from there. This fight between my husband and myself is only going to get a lot worse over the upcoming month, and I just need to know that there are couples out there who have survived this.

Thanks everyone.

[junker]

a lot of responses on this forum suggest consulting a attorney, but one of the main questions i would want to ask a attorney is one that would make some of them uncomfortable..... how many tries did it take you to pass the bar exam??.....it does make a difference...

[yuckhatethis]

You might be surprised on your cars--have you looked up the fair market value on them? We used Kelley Blue Book and used the fair condition amount and it was less than I thought it would be on the car we own outright (a 2000 Camry); we're reaffirming our newer car, but were certain that we'd lose the Camry. We were pleasantly surprised to learn we were under the exemption.

Thanks for the responses. The major problem is that my husband and I are not on the same page with this. We have a whopper of a fight anytime this conversation even comes up. He is content to just wait forever and trust that his father will handle everything. I have no such faith in his father to handle OUR problems and think we need to be taking proactive steps to handle the situation.

Even if the "best case" happens at this point and all the creditors settle for no more than 1/3, we still owe his parents a lot of money and there are tax penalties, though we are insolvent now, so I'm not sure how that works exactly.

I realize that the $1200 is equity in the car. We have a 1995 Beretta which is a total hunk of junk, but because we don't have a loan on it, it would qualify as about double that. Which means we would have to pool our equity into that one crappy car and risk losing the other car, even though we need to have two vehicles. The other car is a 2002 Taurus which still owes $1500, but even that would still have more equity than we would have available. This whole thing is one giant headache and I just wish I could sit down with a BK attorney to go over everything and get me hundreds of questions answered.

Unfortunately, my husband is dead set against seeing a BK attorney right now, at least until his father tells him to. I'm of the mindset that once we get our taxes back we should use that money to hire a BK attorney and go on from there. This fight between my husband and myself is only going to get a lot worse over the upcoming month, and I just need to know that there are couples out there who have survived this.

Thanks everyone.

[frustrated7]

Thanks everyone for your help. I looked up Kelley Blue Book values to get an idea of the value of our cars. Much less than what I expected, which is a good thing when it comes to exemptions.

My husband spoke to his father earlier today and his father is planning on meeting with the attorney face to face on Weds. FIL plans to tell the attorney that this is taking too long and to put a deadline to the creditors of 30-45 days for them to settle our accounts. I guess we'll just have to see if this attorney gets his butt in gear and does his job to settle these accounts. Otherwise, we will file BK with the money we get from our tax return.

Believe me, I know that borrowing money from family members is a really bad idea, especially in large amounts. Unfortunately, my husband insists we finish this route to attempt to settle our debts before he will consider meeting with a BK attorney. I'm trying to not stress too much about this. At least FIL is going to give the attorney a deadline to get things moving. As far as I am concerned, once we meet with a BK attorney to get BK started, I don't care if they all offer 10% settlements, they can shove it.

Thanks for your support. It's nice to have a place with people who understand.

[Kansas1960]

I have similar issues

I too have troubles with my wife about finaces. We are facing Chapter 7 and she wants to hire someone to put up new trim on our house. Everytime I try to mention a buget she just shuts down and won't talk about it because it stresses her out. Then we fight because "I get what I want and she has no voice" then it goes on and on so I don't even bring it up anymore. I hope you are able to work through this with your husband. I do have faith that we will work on this once we get through Chapter 7. If a husband and wife can work together on a plan it really makes a difference.

[Flamingo]

It's a shame that your father-in-law stepped in and took basically full control of the situation totally barring you from what is going on. Since you are not kept in the loop, be careful as to what, if any, papers you will be asked to sign. Your FIL and hubby appear to be controlling and for some reason do not want to include you as to what is being done with the attorney. That is a shame and raises a red flag to me that there is more to this than meets the eye that they may be keeping from you. It also tells me that your hubby is not great at finances and I just hope all this works out for all of you. He may not be able to actually sit down with you and discuss all this do to his own inability to cope with the situation and he needs someone to tell him what to do besides his wife, or he has to stay in control somehow.

When you do get all this resolved, may I suggest that you and your hubby both sit down together and work on a family budget so that you share things together as to finances and household control. If he balks, suggest a counselor to help both of you out.

[Trixie007]

I have to say, I started squirming while reading your OP! What an uncomfortable situation to be in!

Flamingo nailed it, I think. At some point it needs to be just you and DH who make your financial decisions, and a budget is a good place to start - even before your current situation gets resolved.

Good luck to you -

[frustrated7]

We have actually been tweaking our budget for many months now. We have cut out all sorts of expenses and there really isn't anything left to cut out. Not that there is any way we could ever get a handle on our debts no matter how much we manage to cut out of our budget.

It's FIL who is controlling. My husband lets his father order him around and will do what his father tells him to. This is not the first time this has created a problem in our marriage, but even with the financial stress we were getting along well until FIL found out what was going on. Things have gone downhill ever since then. My husband doesn't have a clue what is going on and FIL set it up with the attorney to only call him if a settlement offer comes. My phone number isn't even on the attorney's list.

I'm trying to not freak out about everything that is going on, but it's really hard for me. I need to feel like some progress is being made, and I don't feel that way at all. Another month or so and I absolutely won't wait any longer. I'll meet with a BK attorney whether my husband likes it or not. FIL will NOT choose a BK attorney and will not come with us when (or if) we meet with the BK attorney, even though he has already started trying to insist that he will be involved in that if that's what we end up doing. Maybe I'm not being fair to my inlaws. Maybe FIL is just trying to help and this is the best way he knows how. But this mess has me so stressed out and I hate being kept out of the loop, though I do call the attorney's secretary regularly and often ask if she knows what is going on.

Thanks everyone for listening to me rant.

[Flamingo]

Your hubby tiptoes around his dad because his dad was probably always the authority/controlling figure in his life and also I'll bet because dad has some bucks due to the inheritances, etc. you mention in your original posting. He is probably afraid to say something that would alienate his father and any future inheritance he could receive from them. Anyway, you can either allow the control to continue or have a talk with your FIL to state how you feel and that it should be you and your hubby handling your own affairs and that you appreciate his help in trying to get things straightened out for you. I'll bet your FIL is or has been a top executive/businessman or in control of a business or company in which it is his nature to take over. You can either cower in the corner and not say a word and let things continue or try to talk to your FIL without your husband around. Where is your MIL? If you get along with her, that could be someone you could speak to as to what is going on....

[CatsInTrouble]

We have actually been tweaking our budget for many months now. We have cut out all sorts of expenses and there really isn't anything left to cut out. Not that there is any way we could ever get a handle on our debts no matter how much we manage to cut out of our budget.

It's FIL who is controlling. My husband lets his father order him around and will do what his father tells him to. This is not the first time this has created a problem in our marriage, but even with the financial stress we were getting along well until FIL found out what was going on. Things have gone downhill ever since then. My husband doesn't have a clue what is going on and FIL set it up with the attorney to only call him if a settlement offer comes. My phone number isn't even on the attorney's list.

I'm trying to not freak out about everything that is going on, but it's really hard for me. I need to feel like some progress is being made, and I don't feel that way at all. Another month or so and I absolutely won't wait any longer. I'll meet with a BK attorney whether my husband likes it or not. FIL will NOT choose a BK attorney and will not come with us when (or if) we meet with the BK attorney, even though he has already started trying to insist that he will be involved in that if that's what we end up doing. Maybe I'm not being fair to my inlaws. Maybe FIL is just trying to help and this is the best way he knows how. But this mess has me so stressed out and I hate being kept out of the loop, though I do call the attorney's secretary regularly and often ask if she knows what is going on.

Thanks everyone for listening to me rant.

You are married to a man (and I use the term loosely) who is still- as an adult- controlled by his father? Perhaps you need to consider a divorce lawyer too.

[frustrated7]

ARGH! It never ends. FIL decided against the face to face meeting with the attorney and instead called him today. FIL then told the attorney that he is to send a letter to the creditors, enclose a copy of the first letter which was sent in November 2008, and tell them that they now have 45 days to settle these debts or we will file BK. The attorney said okay and is sending the letters, but the attorney refuses to contact any creditors after sending the letters, saying that it then is the responsibility of the creditors to contact him.

I then explained to my husband the importance of either everyone settles or nobody settles, because even though we have emphasized this to the attorney in the past, his letters do not reflect that. I also told my husband that once we are done with this 45 day period, we will hire a BK attorney and try to file for a Chapter 7. I told him that I don't care what sort of settlement offer they come up with, once we are with the BK attorney, we are done and will not consider any settlement offer. Of course, then my husband was arguing that was a stupid idea, because we would take it if they offered something decent. The entire point of BK is to end this nightmare. I don't know what (if anything) we would lose in a BK, but I don't really care anymore. I just want this to be over. If we can file a Chapter 7, then we should and get this over with. We can rebuild our lives later, after this is over and done with. That is, of course, assuming we are still a we at the end of all this. Sadly, that is something I am starting to wonder.

[danaf]

After reading this thread, all I can say is Eeeeeks. I don't think I could handle a 3 way marriage like yours - in fact, I know I couldn't. Your FIL isn't doing anything to help although he thinks he is and apparantly your husband is useless when it comes to handling his own affairs.

I don't know what to say except that in most states even if you are married you can file on your own without your spouse. Perhaps if I were in your situation, I'd consider that among other things.