Should I add my old landlord to Schedule F with estimated charges?

[dumpinmydebt]

It's a long story, and I don't feel like telling it all. lol. I'll try to shorted it as much as possible.

We just moved, and after going to the old place yesterday, that carpet is beyond repair. Obviously it was the cheapest of the cheap (fibers would be sucked out during vacuuming with our tiny, cheap $40 vacuum), and there were a few stains we could never get out when we originally moved in. Well, we added another stain that won't come out (well, I did.. from coloring my hair. Needless to say that was the last time I ever dyed my hair!!!)

Anyways, that carpet is just going to have to be replaced. There's no other way around it. We put probably $150-$200 of our own money trying to fix up that carpet with no luck. Our landlord has the condo on the market and is wanting to sell it, so there is no way stained carpet is going to fly in this market (especially since there are 6 others for sale in the same complex). And, stupid us, never really told her we couldn't get those old stains out.

I expect to have an angry lady contacting me here soon. I did not assume the lease, but I didn't add her to Schedule F since we really don't have charges yet, though I can assume about how much it will be. I can also probably prove the damages happened before we filed (we just filed on Monday. We've been purchasing all kinds of cleaners and crap to clean it up for the past 2 months.)

Or does my "not assuming" the lease suffice? I noticed in Nolo it stated not assuming the lease means I can walk away from all rights and obligations under the lease. Being liable for damages is under the lease.

Question is, should I amend my Schedule F to add her and the estimated charges or are those charges apart of my lease rejection on Schedule G?

[justbroke]

I think NoLo may be a little too quick to say that you can "walk away from all rights and obligations under the lease." Not assuming the lease only puts you in "contractual" default as if you defaulted the day before you filed. The discharge would grant you a discharge of any money owed, if you actually abandoned the leasehold (left the property and returned it to the owner). The problem with the "damages" is that the landlord could have come after you or offset the damages against a deposit. Additionally, a landlord may be able to offset past due rent against that same deposit.

Since you have moved, I might be inclined to include the landlord on Schedule D and to pay the fee to amend. You'll also need to serve the landlord with the Notice of Bankruptcy and file a certificate of service with the court.

The reason why I write Schedule D, is that the landlord "may" actually be a secured creditor if they hold a security deposit. (Much of the thinking on this is that a landlord with a security deposit is "secured" and has a right of setoff.) The landlord can't just use his right of setoff against the security deposit. The landlord would need to file a motion for relief from the automatic stay (MRFS) in order to exercise that right, since the bankruptcy stays any "right of setoff" except for Utility companies under 11 USC 366. (Don't ask me how I know that.)

Anyhow, if there's a deposit involved, it gets a little more complex and I don't think it would go on Schedule F, but it would go on Schedule D.

This is a particular area where understanding the caselaw in your District helps. I actually had exempted my deposits on Schedule C, even though the landlord did use a right of setoff. However, I could have filed a complaint against the landlord, since the landlord never filed a motion for relief form stay (MRFS). The landlord should have filed an MRFS in order to exercise the right of setoff. I was being nice and didn't bother him about it, since he was really nice about the fact that I was rejecting the lease.

[dumpinmydebt]

Thanks jb.

I'll put her on Schedule D. I mean, the worst that can happen is that they tell me to put her on F, right?

There is a $600 security deposit. We had no unpaid rent nor are we in default on the lease. We gave her 30 days notice, so the "last day" is the 31st, but we are already out. Just need to turn in the keys.

I think I kinda understand why it's "secured." One could say the $600 deposit is collateral.

Should I put an estimated amount, and would it be contingent, since the claim really isn't anything until she purchases carpet?

What is the nature of the lien? I don't really see anything that fits this.

[justbroke]

There is a $600 security deposit. We had no unpaid rent nor are we in default on the lease. We gave her 30 days notice, so the "last day" is the 31st, but we are already out. Just need to turn in the keys.

The default is a technicality. You were in default as of 10/21/2010 since you filed on 10/22/2010. Nothing to really worry about... it's just a technicality.

I think I kinda understand why it's "secured." One could say the $600 deposit is collateral.

Yes it is. In many States, it's also "your" money, but it's placed in escrow.

Should I put an estimated amount, and would it be contingent, since the claim really isn't anything until she purchases carpet?

I really don't have a good answer for this.

Now that I looked, on my petition, I actually didn't exempt the security deposit, but I did put it on Schedule B.

If you do put it on Schedule D, you may want to make the Nature of Lien as "Security Deposit".

[AngelinaCat]

Since you don't know an amount yet, you might want to place a token $1.00 in the spot next to her name as a 'placeholder.'

Both 'Hub and I had had accidents requiring medical attention, and in his case, emergency surgery, shortly before we filed. We had no idea what the total amounts would end up being for both of us, so the lawyer had us put down the $1.00 amount.

[Peeps]

You still have time to do a carpet fix...

Use sharp scissors to cut out the fibers that are stained. Go slow and take out as few strands as possible. Then collect fibers from patches inside closets, in corners, or along baseboards where they won't be missed. Superglue them into the bald patch where the stained fibers were removed. Again, take it slow. Make sure they're, uh, standing on end when you do this and use pretty good sized gobs of glue so the fibers are actually a little bit taller than the surrounding fibers. They don't have to be packed densely, especially since the carpet itself probably isn't very dense. Once the glue dries, use sharp scissors to even out the glued-in strands so they're the same height as the surrounding carpet.

If the stains are smallish, this will work like a charm. It doesn't work well for big stains. It's an old Facility Managers' trick. No harm done, you'd actually be extending the life of the carpet, which is really nice of you! No stains - deposit returned - less paperwork. Anyway, just an option.

[dumpinmydebt]

Peeps, I already tried that. It's not a tiny stain, it's a large one(the one I made). The other ones (not made by me) are also pretty large too. So I tried to patch it. I took a piece of carpet from the closet. Problem is, the carpet that is stained is in a high traffic area and it is just so worn down, the patch is beyond noticeable. So I have this bright white (yes, the carpet is white, even better) patch with worn down carpet, discolored carpet. We shampooed every month, and this was after the professional cleaners came out. The carpet is probably 10 years old. I mean, it's not new at all. Everything in there is from when it was built.

[dumpinmydebt]

Thanks everyone.

I'll put $1.00.

We did exempt it.

I actually feel really bad about it. Wish I could pay her back, but it's just not possible. Oh well.

[dumpinmydebt]

I actually listed her on the Creditor Matrix when we filed. Do I need to send her my own notice of bankruptcy, or is that sufficient?

Also, since I'm amending D, do I also amend the Summary of Schedules?

[AngelinaCat]

Yes, since you are a pro se filer, you need to send everything out, and I think you need to ammend all schedules if you are ammending one of them. I suggest sending a PM to Justbroke, and see what he says, but I think he will agree with me.

It would be nice if your landlord would consider a vinal flooring that simulates wood. Home Depot carries it, and we have put it in several rooms in our house, as we are rebuilding. The flooring wears like iron, and we are pleased. When we finally pulled up the 20 year old carpet out of the den, that is the farthest away from the front door--and should be the cleanest room--we could NOT believe the beach front property sand on that floor.

We will never, ever, have carpet in our home again.

Our best wishes

[dumpinmydebt]

Yes, since you are a pro se filer, you need to send everything out, and I think you need to ammend all schedules if you are ammending one of them. I suggest sending a PM to Justbroke, and see what he says, but I think he will agree with me.

It would be nice if your landlord would consider a vinal flooring that simulates wood. Home Depot carries it, and we have put it in several rooms in our house, as we are rebuilding. The flooring wears like iron, and we are pleased. When we finally pulled up the 20 year old carpet out of the den, that is the farthest away from the front door--and should be the cleanest room--we could NOT believe the beach front property sand on that floor.

We will never, ever, have carpet in our home again.

Our best wishes

This is actually what I was thinking. I guess it won't hurt to do it anyway. I mean, I saved mine into a PDF so all I really need to do is reprint all of the other ones. No biggie.

Yes, when we buy a house in 3 or 4 years, there will not be any carpet. I hate carpet. It just traps dirt. Bad for allergies. So nasty. We vacuumed daily and shampooed every month too.

Our old landlord (the one we put in the BK) has no desire to fix anything. The dishwasher was broken when we moved in, she never replaced it. I don't mind, but I'm sure potential buyers will. Everything is so outdated too, never painted. Just flat white all throughout. Very old appliances. There are 7 other condos for sale in the small community, and I've seen the pics, they are nice.

Thanks for your help everyone. Now I've got a TON of schoolwork to do and a Halloween costume to finish. Going to have some fun and leave the stress behind for a night.

[jcj112562]

I will agree on amending all of the Schedules if you change things around. I had to do that when the Trustee objected to the "property settlement" stemming from divorce was originaly treated as unsecured, and I had to amend the Plan and schedules to make it a "priority unsecured" to keep them happy. None of the numbers changed on the Summary of Schedules, but I had to file an amended one. Also, I did NOT Have to send out any Notices of Bankruptcy, everyone on the matrix got one from the Clerk. The only one I did deliver myself was up to the courthouse to "postpone" a hearing date on a lawsuit that was scheduled for the following day. I guess some folks don't quite understand what a Chapter 13 is, since the party that had the lawsuit did not bother to file a claim, and thus did not collect a penny when he would have gotten all of what he sued for (happily included in the Plan, but never claimed).

John

[dumpinmydebt]

Thanks. She was already on the Matrix, so she's received a notice.

So, if I am reading this right, it won't cost me anything to amend?

On my cover sheet it says, "I have enclosed a $26 fee because I am adding new creditors or changing addresses after the original Meeting of Creditors Notice has been sent."

Well I'm not adding new creditors or changing addresses of creditors. I am, however, changing MY address.

But if I am reading that right (and please bear with me. It's finals week and my brain is FRIED) then it won't cost me a thing to amend.

I searched the local rules on my courts website I couldn't find anything about cost. They use all of the Federal forms (which is what this cover sheet is).

[justbroke]

If you read your local rules, you will probably find that changing your address requires a "Notice of Change of Address" filed with the court as well as you need to SERVE that notice on ALL CREDITORS that are on the Matrix! Yes, that means sending each and every one of them the change of address as well as filing a Certificate of Service with the Court.

There is no fee required for this, but it will cost you (postage).

The reason that you are required to serve the notice upon all creditors, is that they would have no way to serve you any papers properly... especially any subpoenas or other papers that need to be served in hand.

(Note: the notice of change of address is nothing more than a property "captioned" paper that has a title of "NOTICE OF CHANGE OF ADDRESS OF DEBTOR" with a statement indicating the new address. It also requires a Certificate of Service that it was served upon all creditors. Also, if your District doesn't have a specific "Local Rule" for change of address, please contact the Clerk or your Case Manager for the specific procedure in your District. Make sure you preface any "questions" with "I have a procedural question...")

[dumpinmydebt]

Holy crap. That sucks. lol