"Truckers Protest, the Resistance Begins"

[Runnin on empty]

Hi Bandit and Runnin' on empty. Have you two saw the movie on google video/youtube (google owns both) "Zeitgeist, The Movie" ? and if so, what do you two think? The part on religions is very, very interesting. You two might also like "larry david on religion" on youtube and George Carlin (warning to anyone concerned about profanity, George Carlin uses profanity, so watch at youtube at your own risk, if you decide to search youtube) "The Owners of the Country" and "George Carlin - Religion is "

I am unfamiliar with that particular Carlin work, but as I am very familiar with his comedy, I'm sure as to it's content, and I probably would find it quite humorous.

I do not wish to cause anyone hurt or pain, and this may not be the best place to discuss this, but I personally believe that the "Zeitgeist The Movie" hits the nail on the head on so many things. I have seen much of it in it's many Youtube iterations, and plan on purchasing it so I can sit down and watch it from beginning to end without having to pause in-between "episodes".

It is my firm and steadfast belief that "religion" is nothing more than a manufactured belief system created to control people as well as give hope to those who can't handle the idea of no afterlife. Again I want to reiterate that I do not wish to denounce anyone else's beliefs, and I do not wish to cause hurt. I do believe that people should treat each other with respect, and that it is okay to have a "spiritual" side. I do attempt to live my life by the golden rule, and IMHO, if I am indeed wrong and there is a God/Heaven, I would like to think I will have done enough in my lifetime to warrant entrance. That being said, I am preparing myself for one of two possible outcomes:

1) I die. Plain and simple darkness, but I won't know any better because I'm dead.

2) Immortality. We already know that the human body is not "programmed" for death, and that the only reason we age and eventually die is that Free Radicals ravage our systems, causing this to happen. I can see within the next century us coming up with a cure for this, and within two centuries complete and utter immortality. Then, it will become merely a philosophical question of do we want to live forever? And if so, at what "age" do we wish to stay?

This is of course, assuming that the powers that be don't strip everything else away from us before then.

[Runnin on empty]

Religious people are not being hypocritical. They have a different outlook on things than you but that doesn't make them hypocritical.

Which ones?

The jerk who cuts you off in his/her SUV that has the tailgate plastered with "Jesus Saves" bumper stickers or the one who smiles to your face and shakes your hand, but then turns around and talks smack about you to your (insert persons of choice here)? How about the white suburbanite who gives $5 a paycheck to the United Way, but gets nervous and suspicious every time they see a "black person" driving through their neighborhood?

I call a spade a spade.

[rfassett]

And I also mean to do nobody any ill-will. I pull no bones about my commitment to my Lord and Saviour, Jesus, the Christ. That said, I will not argue with you that the Church is full of hypocrits. What's more, and this may come as a shock, it is also full of sinners. For all, yes, all have fallen short of the glory of God. The only perfect person to ever walk this earth was nailed to a cross. Yes, others were nailed to a cross - that was one of the more popular forms of capital punishment at the time - but none of the others are recorded as doing it willing. Do a study sometime on what it meant to be crucified. Read the details and feel the pain. But yes, all the negative ideas that you have about "purported" Christians is probably all true. Unfortunately, Christians feel the same pressures of life that you feel. Just following Christ does not mean one is given a free ride. In fact, Jesus said pretty clearly that we are to take up our cross daily and follow Him. (I refer you back to the pain of the crucifixion.) He said Christians would be ridiculed and persecuted simply because they chose to follow Him. I bet you didn't know that you were fullfiling prophecy. Anyway, do a study sometime on Jesus, the person, and the effect that He has had on human kind down through the ages. It is a very interesting study, and you will walk away with a better appreciation of what you don't seem to understand.

[WhatMoney]

These words have stuck with me for 50 years, when I first heard them:

I think I could turn and live with animals.
They are so placid and self-contained.
They do not sweat and whine about their condition.
They do not lie awake in the dark and weep for their sins.
They do not make me sick discussing their duty to God.
Not one is dissatisfied.
Not one is demented by the mania of owning things.
Not one kneels to another,
Nor to his own kind that lived thousands of years ago.
Not one is respectable, or unhappy the whole world over.

"I know an old lady that swallowed a fly,
I don't know why she swallowed a fly,
I guess she'll die..."

Pete Seeger,
from his introduction to the song "There Was an Old Woman Who Swallowed A Fly",
Pete Seeger and Sonny Terry at Carnegie Hall, Folkway Records, released Jan.1, 1958.

http://www.rhapsody.com/album/petese...?artistId=6155

.

[PaKettle]

FLBK7,
yes, we invaded them.............. to rid them of a dictator and to allow them the freedoms that they wanted, and to protect our interest in their oil.

5 years later, we are still there, fighting their battle with the insurgents for them........... it's time they stood their own ground. They need to stand up, fight for their freedoms they want so badly.

No offense, and usually I agree 100% with your posts but I think you are misinformed here. The war in Iraq was not wanted nor called for by the people of Iraq. It was not started because the people wanted freedom and democracy. That is just what we were told by Fox News and other bought and paid for media sources.

This war was engineered and created by the Bush / Cheney regime and they used false claims (weapons of mass destruction within Iraq; terrorist bases in Iraq) to convince the American people that it was justified. They lied. It was not justified. What it was about was making money for Bush's and Cheney's rich friends and supporters. Money from contracts to build the war machine and military bases.

Their position right now seems to be why shed their own blood when they can shed ours are our expense.

Their position I think is and always has been that they want us out of there. We refuse to get out because we want a base there. Did you know we have built one of the largest PERMANENT bases there in the world? I am not sure but I believe I heard it is the most costly military base ever built by us. Do you think we plan to leave any time soon? The answer is no. Not under ANY circumstances. Why? We want a base there. We want control of that region. We want oil. (When I say "we" I mean "they" - BuschCo, Inc., those who take part in dividing up the world for their own selfish interests.)

WHAT ARE THEY DOING WITH THEIR OIL MONEY.............?????

Probably the same thing that Saudia Arabia is.......... buying land in the USA!!!

I firmly believe in helping my fellow man, but their also comes a time they need to stand on their own two feet and help themselves. I believe 5 years has been ample time to form a new government and put it in place.

Our nation is often "too quick" to jump in and fight a battle for another nation. We are always the "leader of the pack" and bear most of the expense and blood loss.

And then at home (good ole USA) we have people loosing their homes, living in poverty, and can't feed their own children. People do without medical care and die because they can't afford it.

Enough, I won't get started on this today...................

I do agree with you on one thing:
We should be here, not there, and we should take care of our own people and problems, first.
We certainly shouldn't be driving OUR NATION INTO BANKRUPTCY in order to control the Middle East.

[PaKettle]

Excellent points. For the life of me, I could never understand why the super rich want for nothing else but more money. I think I read somewhere that 10% of the USA's population controls 99% of the wealth. Take Martha Stewart for example. She's worth more money than any 50 families could ever burn through in their lifetimes, yet she went to jail over insider trading that amounted to a net gain (IIRC) of like a couple hundred grand? I just can't fathom that. You're got hundreds of millions, why do you need more?

Most of us think like that. The super rich seem to be driven to strive for more money. It's really like an addiction for them I think. They are driven to succeed even after they've made millions. Look at Gates, Buffet, etc... Why wouldn't they just retire somewhere and do what they love? The reason they keep building their wealth is that they are greedy, they are addicted to profit, and/or they worship the Almighty Dollar.

The ironic thing is, and I can tell you this with some authority because I live in Los Angeles and I know some very rich people and I know OF a lot of rich people and their habits:

Most rich people are not happy.

It is absolutely true. They cannot be happy because they cannot stop worrying and striving for more money, more material gain.

Many have families that they completely neglect. I know a guy who has a beautiful young wife and two beautiful little daughters who are crying for attention from their daddy. It makes me sad because he is always "too busy" to be with them. He schedules an outing with them and then cancels it because "something comes up" that is more important.

I know people have giant multi-million dollar mansions in Malibu but they almost never live there. They pay people $60+k a year to take care of the house and clean it etc. for them because they are never there. Instead they are living in hotels and working 14 hour days to make money to pay for the mansion.

Rich people are mostly miserable human beings.

I'm not a Socialist (at least I don't think I am ) and I believe that a man/woman should be entitled to reap the benefits of the sweat from their brow, but jeez-a-wiz, so many are struggling and not making it, yet we have so few who have so much. Paris Hilton, who is the definition of a waste of space, has more in her bank account than all of us here combined will see in our lives, yet she gets a free pass because her grandfather was a smart business man at the right time.

The funny thing is, most of these people are conservative Republicans, those who are supposedly upholding their religious beliefs above all else. Liars. At least I'm not hypocritical, I tell anyone that asks me that I'm Agnostic. IMO, how can there be a God involved in such a evil, nasty, world? And if there is, why is he/she allowing all of this to happen?

It'll get worse before it gets better too.....

I agree.

[FLBK7]

No offense, and usually I agree 100% with your posts but I think you are misinformed here. The war in Iraq was not wanted nor called for by the people of Iraq. It was not started because the people wanted freedom and democracy. That is just what we were told by Fox News and other bought and paid for media sources.

This war was engineered and created by the Bush / Cheney regime and they used false claims (weapons of mass destruction within Iraq; terrorist bases in Iraq) to convince the American people that it was justified. They lied. It was not justified. What it was about was making money for Bush's and Cheney's rich friends and supporters. Money from contracts to build the war machine and military bases.



Their position I think is and always has been that they want us out of there. We refuse to get out because we want a base there. Did you know we have built one of the largest PERMANENT bases there in the world? I am not sure but I believe I heard it is the most costly military base ever built by us. Do you think we plan to leave any time soon? The answer is no. Not under ANY circumstances. Why? We want a base there. We want control of that region. We want oil. (When I say "we" I mean "they" - BuschCo, Inc., those who take part in dividing up the world for their own selfish interests.)



I do agree with you on one thing:
We should be here, not there, and we should take care of our own people and problems, first.
We certainly shouldn't be driving OUR NATION INTO BANKRUPTCY in order to control the Middle East.

I agree with you 100% Pa Kettle. Amazing. You could have been reading my mind!

[Runnin on empty]

Most rich people are not happy.

It is absolutely true. They cannot be happy because they cannot stop worrying and striving for more money, more material gain.

Many have families that they completely neglect.

I know this firsthand. My father may not be rich by the people you know standards, but I can never remember a time in my life where he was never working only one job. My parents were divorced when my brother and I were very young, and there always seemed to be something more pressing going on at work (he is in law enforcement) than for him to spend time with us.

In the little time I did spend with him over the years before I came to adulthood, I found that nothing I could ever do would be good enough, and that the power of the almighty dollar was more important than our relationship. I still carry this with me to this day, and I firmly believe that it is my perceived "inadequacies" that have helped lead me down the path that my wife and I have travelled, basically trying to making myself feel better through material objects. Of course, after the initial rush wears off, it all comes back, and the cycle repeats itself.

I still have my demons to battle, but at least I'm smarter for it this time. We recently got together at my brother and his wife's home to visit with my wife/boys, their 3 month old, and my dad and his wife (his 3rd in roughly 30 years I might add), and my dad said something about retiring this summer. Of course, this simply meant that he was going to drop down to 20 hours a week with the county, instead of 50-70. I asked him why he would want to do that, and he said, "Well, they're going to pay me good money for working part-time". "It was either that, or I could stop working and blow your inheritance."

As if I would ever take any of his blood money. Too little, too late. He's had his chance for nearly 37 years to make things right, and I'll be damned if I am going to give him an inch now. I've never asked him for anything up to this point, I'm not going to start now. It's pretty sad, I could have gone to him before we filed and asked for an interest-free loan to make it all kosher with our creditors, and I know he would have said yes and had the money to me within a few business days, but I would have rather been dragged through the streets by wild horses than to ask him for one red cent.

Yeah, I'm probably slightly more jaded than the average person, but in my eyes, money has done nothing but corrupt and ruin the good things in my life.

Which is why I'm going to do whatever it is I need to do as quickly as I can do it to pay off the remaining debt we have left, and save enough to purchase a hut on some semi-remote tropical island nation that I can become the village hermit on.

[Bandit]

No offense, and usually I agree 100% with your posts but I think you are misinformed here. The war in Iraq was not wanted nor called for by the people of Iraq. It was not started because the people wanted freedom and democracy. That is just what we were told by Fox News and other bought and paid for media sources.

This war was engineered and created by the Bush / Cheney regime and they used false claims (weapons of mass destruction within Iraq; terrorist bases in Iraq) to convince the American people that it was justified. They lied. It was not justified. What it was about was making money for Bush's and Cheney's rich friends and supporters. Money from contracts to build the war machine and military bases.



Their position I think is and always has been that they want us out of there. We refuse to get out because we want a base there. Did you know we have built one of the largest PERMANENT bases there in the world? I am not sure but I believe I heard it is the most costly military base ever built by us. Do you think we plan to leave any time soon? The answer is no. Not under ANY circumstances. Why? We want a base there. We want control of that region. We want oil. (When I say "we" I mean "they" - BuschCo, Inc., those who take part in dividing up the world for their own selfish interests.)



I do agree with you on one thing:
We should be here, not there, and we should take care of our own people and problems, first.
We certainly shouldn't be driving OUR NATION INTO BANKRUPTCY in order to control the Middle East.

That is exactly how it goes. Very much like the story of Moby Dick where most of the crew was blinded by what drove the captain insane. All will die on a sinking ship just so a few men can line their pockets with selfish agendas & greed.

[Bandit]

I am unfamiliar with that particular Carlin work, but as I am very familiar with his comedy, I'm sure as to it's content, and I probably would find it quite humorous.

I do not wish to cause anyone hurt or pain, and this may not be the best place to discuss this, but I personally believe that the "Zeitgeist The Movie" hits the nail on the head on so many things. I have seen much of it in it's many Youtube iterations, and plan on purchasing it so I can sit down and watch it from beginning to end without having to pause in-between "episodes".

It is my firm and steadfast belief that "religion" is nothing more than a manufactured belief system created to control people as well as give hope to those who can't handle the idea of no afterlife. Again I want to reiterate that I do not wish to denounce anyone else's beliefs, and I do not wish to cause hurt. I do believe that people should treat each other with respect, and that it is okay to have a "spiritual" side. I do attempt to live my life by the golden rule, and IMHO, if I am indeed wrong and there is a God/Heaven, I would like to think I will have done enough in my lifetime to warrant entrance. That being said, I am preparing myself for one of two possible outcomes:

1) I die. Plain and simple darkness, but I won't know any better because I'm dead.

2) Immortality. We already know that the human body is not "programmed" for death, and that the only reason we age and eventually die is that Free Radicals ravage our systems, causing this to happen. I can see within the next century us coming up with a cure for this, and within two centuries complete and utter immortality. Then, it will become merely a philosophical question of do we want to live forever? And if so, at what "age" do we wish to stay?

This is of course, assuming that the powers that be don't strip everything else away from us before then.

That is pretty radical but a definate possibility. Over the years I can't help but notice that what goes up in the movies comes down to reality within a few years later.

I see it more as people just trying to find some comfort in something better after the misery & discomfort of this life ends & probably everyone will be very suprized because it will be nothing like what we would expect.

[Bandit]

Which ones?

The jerk who cuts you off in his/her SUV that has the tailgate plastered with "Jesus Saves" bumper stickers or the one who smiles to your face and shakes your hand, but then turns around and talks smack about you to your (insert persons of choice here)? How about the white suburbanite who gives $5 a paycheck to the United Way, but gets nervous and suspicious every time they see a "black person" driving through their neighborhood?

I call a spade a spade.

Honk if you are saved

[Bandit]

Bandit, I am not going to get into a protracted dicussion with you about religion - primarily because I do not have the time for that right now - maybe another day and another time, but let me say this. So much of the confusion about "God's plan" centers around people taking a snap shot look at life. Take a critical read of the "Book of John" in the Bible some time soon. Even if you have read it before, read it again with a critical eye. And then take that same critical read of the "Book of Revelation". Take a more global look at life and you will begin to understand some of the things you question. Some of the things you blame God for are no more His fault than it is mine that it is raining today. God has promised eternity. Good eternity and bad eternity. View life from that perspective and it starts making a lot more sense. How long is that suffering that you describe? Compare that to how long eternity is. Perhaps, and I don't know any more than you do, God has a very special place in Heaven for those folks. Just some food for thought.

I really could care less about things that cannot be proven. If you have comfort in all of that then good for you.
Personally it sounds to me more like you are saying this: BELIEVE & DO WHAT I SAY THEN YOU CAN GO TO HEAVEN AND IF YOU DO NOT DO & BELIEVE WHAT I SAY THEN YOU GET PUNISHED BY MY GOD IN HELL.

[Bandit]

That's just my thoughts. The next question is, what do we do to prepare for bad times? Great Depression II? But maybe these truckers can wake more and more people up-the people that believe the myth of the American Dream. Just like George Carlin said, "It's called the American Dream, because you have to be asleep to believe in it" and "They own all the big media companies so they control just about all the news and information you get to hear. They spend billions of dollars every year lobbying to get what they want. Well we know what they want, they want more for themselves and less for everyone else." and finally, he said, "I'll tell you what they don't want. They don't want a population of citizens capable of critical thinking. They don't want well-informed, well-educated people capable of critical thinking - they're not interested in that. That doesn't help them. That's against their interests."

Interesting to say the least. OUr leaders have people a)so screwed up by gettting us to believe them or, b) to the point that most people refuse to vote because there are no good ones to vote for.
Maybe people really are afraid to face the the truth of the negatives, so they just pretend all is good by turning face.

ah, the American Dream

[Minnymouth]

Yes, our main interest in Iraq is "oil"........ and the rich keep getting richer off of it...........
Will we ever leave Iraq, I doubt it! It's a proven fact once we move into a country, we never move out of it entirely. We stake our claim for one reason or another. Economically, humanitarian, etc...... and we stay or leave part of our forces forever there.

Our next politicians in office need to make major changes in America. But all candidates are so out of touch with how the rest of the "real world lives" they can't even imagine it. They don't understand proverty....... starvation....... families who live from paycheck to paycheck.... pay bills instead of buying meds.... This part of the real world never touches their lives while in or out of office.

In our society you have to be a multi-millionare to even run for office. The candidates are no longer for the people, by the people, or even elected by the people. When Congress and the House are passing laws, they talk seriously about one law and then pass another that you don't even know about. It never becomes public knowledge until after its passed.

I often wonder what our ForeFathers would think of our "government" today??

Bring our soldiers home............. take care of priorities at home!!
Our nation is falling apart from the inside out and everyone is watching it!!! Financially the USA is very unstable right now. Housing is a BUST, Wall Street keeps plunging, and our dependency on foreign countries keeps GROWING. Not only for oil, but for clothing, food, etc..... The USA doesn't make much of anything, anymore... We buy it overseas and ship it in. The USA is putting itself in a position where it can't be self-reliant any longer.

It's not the USA's place to "fight the battles" of the world between Nations and Inter-nations. Many of these Nations have been at "inner war" since the beginning of time. It may never change, and our involvement often makes it even worse.

And the main thing............. if our Country has no "personal interest, gain, or involvement" with a messed up Nation, they don't get involved. THEY TURN A DEAF EAR AND A BLIND EYE!!!
Whatever happened to helping your fellow man just because it's the "right thing to do"?

Very interesting debate........... I've enjoyed reading ALL SIDES AND ALL OPINIONS on this one...... Many things to look at, observe and opinions to ponder on.

[Bandit]

No, they *Want* to be a service industry. They thought they could do without manufacturers and farmers. This is where they find out how dead wrong they are.

Right. That is how our world leaders want it to go (at least for awhile until things balance out a little). There is so much hype already of how the manufacturing costs in China are big time on the rise & those higher costs to manufacture overseas will be passed on to usa. The USA working people will become more like the way things are done in China.

I do not blame the working people, the soldiers & farmers of the USA or China, I blame the global leaders who sleep with each other to gain more power. When the USA is buying everything & making nothing there will be serious problems, and we are closer than most people can see. I just do not see how this is ever going to turn around.