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Fee Waiver Denied?

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  • #16
    It is not whether or not you are entitled to file bankruptcy, it is whether having your debts discharged in bankruptcy will do you any good. If you can't manage to raise the filing fee, that is a good indication that bankruptcy will not help you. If you have only $300 a month income and no assets, there is nothing for a creditor to get. See my response in the other thread regarding the specific types of debt you have. If automatic payments are set up, I suspect that with the low income you have you can stop them.

    People as poor as you simply will not benefit from bankruptcy because the reason to discharge debt is to protect income and assets. You have no assets and $300 in gross monthly social security income for a family of 8 is most likely already protected by law without filing bankruptcy. Depending on the size of those debts, it may make sense to file bankruptcy eventually, but only after you have stable income with which to support yourself and your family.

    I in no way believe in "screw the poor". In fact, I would prefer that the measly temporary tax cut I will get from the recent so called tax reform go to help people like you. And I am definitely not wealthy.
    LadyInTheRed is in the black!
    Filed Chap 13 April 2010. Discharged May 2015.
    $143,000 in debt discharged for $36,500, including attorneys fees. Money well spent!

    Comment


    • #17
      When you say your gross income is $300, is that before any money they are deducting to pay for the over payment? If not, that is not your gross income. Your gross income is your benefit before it is reduced to payback the over payment. That reduction would have to stop immediately after you file BK, presumably freeing up money to pay the BK filing fee.
      LadyInTheRed is in the black!
      Filed Chap 13 April 2010. Discharged May 2015.
      $143,000 in debt discharged for $36,500, including attorneys fees. Money well spent!

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by Maria80386 View Post
        If you're that poor, you don't need bankruptcy, you are judgement proof. If a creditor calls, cease them. "Under the Fair Credit and Collection Act, do not call me again." Judgement letters, let them play court all they want. If they're trying to foreclose, now you need to play phone tag, find a lawyer online through your town's poverty law center, and they can arrange for transportation if in their area. There are resources available, it just takes awhile to dig through the websites to find them.
        How do I get my debts cleared then?

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by LadyInTheRed View Post
          When you say your gross income is $300, is that before any money they are deducting to pay for the over payment? If not, that is not your gross income. Your gross income is your benefit before it is reduced to payback the over payment. That reduction would have to stop immediately after you file BK, presumably freeing up money to pay the BK filing fee.
          It is $430 a month. It has yet to stop. And it should go towards things like diapers and food, no? I do not get the logic that the poor should pay and the ones with money get to file free?...

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by LadyInTheRed View Post
            It is not whether or not you are entitled to file bankruptcy, it is whether having your debts discharged in bankruptcy will do you any good. If you can't manage to raise the filing fee, that is a good indication that bankruptcy will not help you. If you have only $300 a month income and no assets, there is nothing for a creditor to get. See my response in the other thread regarding the specific types of debt you have. If automatic payments are set up, I suspect that with the low income you have you can stop them.

            People as poor as you simply will not benefit from bankruptcy because the reason to discharge debt is to protect income and assets. You have no assets and $300 in gross monthly social security income for a family of 8 is most likely already protected by law without filing bankruptcy. Depending on the size of those debts, it may make sense to file bankruptcy eventually, but only after you have stable income with which to support yourself and your family.

            I in no way believe in "screw the poor". In fact, I would prefer that the measly temporary tax cut I will get from the recent so called tax reform go to help people like you. And I am definitely not wealthy.
            I still don't get the logic "If you are too poor, you don't need help." That is backwards.

            "Nothing a creditor can get". How about my money, and my right to travel?

            How do I stop them, without bankruptcy? What else do I file?

            My income will go up almost 50%, and I can have permission to see my father before he dies. How is that not good for me?

            Comment


            • #21
              How does a creditor take away your right to travel? Who says you need permission to see your father? These statements make no sense.

              Nobody said if you are too poor you don't need help. If you are too poor, bankruptcy is not likely to be what is going to help. You are allowed to file bankruptcy just like anybody else, but there are costs involved for everybody. If the fee waiver was incorrectly denied, that can be appeal.

              A creditor must first sue you to take your money involuntarily. They aren't likely to bother suing if you don't have anything to take. Since your only income is social security, even a creditor who sues and gets a judgement against you is not allowed to take social security income. If you don't already, have your social security paid to a social security debit card and no creditor can get at it. Eventually, the statute of limitations will expire on the debt.

              If your income is going to go up 50%, then wait for your income to increase to file BK. But, at your low income, I don't think that is enough increase to make it worth while, especially if it will all still be social security income.
              LadyInTheRed is in the black!
              Filed Chap 13 April 2010. Discharged May 2015.
              $143,000 in debt discharged for $36,500, including attorneys fees. Money well spent!

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by LadyInTheRed View Post
                How does a creditor take away your right to travel? Who says you need permission to see your father? These statements make no sense.
                Actually they do make sense. I believe that the failure to repay a repatriation loan is grounds to deny the issuance or renewal of a passport. OP wants to leave the US. I assume OP cannot because he/she lacks a passport. Like the suspension of a driver's license, I assume that once the debt has been discharged, OP can apply for a passport.

                Des.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by LadyInTheRed View Post
                  How does a creditor take away your right to travel? Who says you need permission to see your father? These statements make no sense.

                  Nobody said if you are too poor you don't need help. If you are too poor, bankruptcy is not likely to be what is going to help. You are allowed to file bankruptcy just like anybody else, but there are costs involved for everybody. If the fee waiver was incorrectly denied, that can be appeal.

                  A creditor must first sue you to take your money involuntarily. They aren't likely to bother suing if you don't have anything to take. Since your only income is social security, even a creditor who sues and gets a judgement against you is not allowed to take social security income. If you don't already, have your social security paid to a social security debit card and no creditor can get at it. Eventually, the statute of limitations will expire on the debt.

                  If your income is going to go up 50%, then wait for your income to increase to file BK. But, at your low income, I don't think that is enough increase to make it worth while, especially if it will all still be social security income.
                  The creditor suspends your passport. No passport, no travel.

                  I have not been sued, and my money is being taken out. Social security can take money from you!

                  "social security debit card" What is this?

                  "Eventually, the statute of limitations will expire on the debt." Really? When?

                  "If your income is going to go up 50%, then wait for your income to increase to file BK." How do I get my income to go up 50%?

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Nothing personal, but if your income is truly only $300 per month (which is approximately 20% of the monthly income of a citizen in a 3rd world country), it should be very easy to increase your income by 50%, which would take your income to $450 per month. Finding a part-time job (literally maybe 10 hours per month at slightly over minimum wage) would get you there easily.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by BillsFriend View Post
                      Nothing personal, but if your income is truly only $300 per month (which is approximately 20% of the monthly income of a citizen in a 3rd world country), it should be very easy to increase your income by 50%, which would take your income to $450 per month. Finding a part-time job (literally maybe 10 hours per month at slightly over minimum wage) would get you there easily.
                      How do I do that?

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by despritfreya View Post

                        Actually they do make sense. I believe that the failure to repay a repatriation loan is grounds to deny the issuance or renewal of a passport. OP wants to leave the US. I assume OP cannot because he/she lacks a passport. Like the suspension of a driver's license, I assume that once the debt has been discharged, OP can apply for a passport.

                        Des.
                        Thanks, Des.

                        david1971 said in another thread that he has now made contact with legal aid. That sounds like a good first step in getting the help he needs.
                        LadyInTheRed is in the black!
                        Filed Chap 13 April 2010. Discharged May 2015.
                        $143,000 in debt discharged for $36,500, including attorneys fees. Money well spent!

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by david1971 View Post

                          The creditor suspends your passport. No passport, no travel.

                          I have not been sued, and my money is being taken out. Social security can take money from you!

                          "social security debit card" What is this?

                          "Eventually, the statute of limitations will expire on the debt." Really? When?

                          "If your income is going to go up 50%, then wait for your income to increase to file BK." How do I get my income to go up 50%?
                          You said that your income will go up 50%. Did you really mean that if you file BK you will get to keep 50% more income because your SS benefit will be reduced? Your gross income is your gross income, regardless of what deductions are taken before you get your money.

                          Some of my comments have to do with debt in general, not your specific debt. I don't know if there is statute of limitations for collecting overpaid social security or for your repatriation debt. It's not clear whether you have any other debt.

                          A social security debit card is a card you can have your social security credited to each month. You use it like a credit card to pay your expenses and it draws down from your balance. If you are worried about collection by other creditors, this keeps your social security money safe. If you deposit money into an account, a creditor who gets a judgement can then freeze your account and you have to then show that all of the funds are social security funds in order to keep the money from the creditor.
                          LadyInTheRed is in the black!
                          Filed Chap 13 April 2010. Discharged May 2015.
                          $143,000 in debt discharged for $36,500, including attorneys fees. Money well spent!

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by LadyInTheRed View Post

                            You said that your income will go up 50%. Did you really mean that if you file BK you will get to keep 50% more income because your SS benefit will be reduced? Your gross income is your gross income, regardless of what deductions are taken before you get your money.

                            Some of my comments have to do with debt in general, not your specific debt. I don't know if there is statute of limitations for collecting overpaid social security or for your repatriation debt. It's not clear whether you have any other debt.

                            A social security debit card is a card you can have your social security credited to each month. You use it like a credit card to pay your expenses and it draws down from your balance. If you are worried about collection by other creditors, this keeps your social security money safe. If you deposit money into an account, a creditor who gets a judgement can then freeze your account and you have to then show that all of the funds are social security funds in order to keep the money from the creditor.
                            Yes my income will go up AFTER bankruptcy. That is one of the reasons why I am filing.

                            I do not have other debt. I do not normally get in debt.

                            Where does one get this card? Is this new?

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by david1971 View Post

                              Yes my income will go up AFTER bankruptcy. That is one of the reasons why I am filing.
                              No, your income will not go up. Your debt payments will go down. I don't mean to be nit picky, but this is an important thing to understand when discussing bankruptcy issues. For one thing, when the bankruptcy court evaluated your fee waiver request, it was based on your income without reduction for debt payments. Did you tell the court on your fee waiver application that you expect a 50% increase in income after filing? If so, that could be at least part of the reason you were denied.


                              Originally posted by david1971 View Post
                              Where does one get this card? Is this new?
                              It's not new. Info is at https://www.ssa.gov/deposit/howtosign.htm Make sure you understand what fees might be charged for certain use of the card.

                              LadyInTheRed is in the black!
                              Filed Chap 13 April 2010. Discharged May 2015.
                              $143,000 in debt discharged for $36,500, including attorneys fees. Money well spent!

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by LadyInTheRed View Post

                                No, your income will not go up. Your debt payments will go down. I don't mean to be nit picky, but this is an important thing to understand when discussing bankruptcy issues. For one thing, when the bankruptcy court evaluated your fee waiver request, it was based on your income without reduction for debt payments. Did you tell the court on your fee waiver application that you expect a 50% increase in income after filing? If so, that could be at least part of the reason you were denied.




                                It's not new. Info is at https://www.ssa.gov/deposit/howtosign.htm Make sure you understand what fees might be charged for certain use of the card.
                                I just told them my current income. "Gross income" means nothing if it is not money you have access to.

                                That link does not mention anything about this card you are talking about. It is just talking about direct deposit of your benefits. That has been around forever. And you can do that with any account and any funds. The military did this with my paycheck like 40 years ago. And many jobs since. IRS uses it too. It is not a "special card that prevents creditors from touching your money." Ha ha.

                                Comment

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