I know these items are covered in other thread, but need deeper understanding.

[screwedupbyRE]

Item I clarification on are (HHM, HRx, Minnymouth, BassBoy, lrprn - pls respond), or anyone with good know abt it...

1. Tax Refund: Do we have to report back tax refund? Even though if it is 1-2k or smaller amount? I see other posts - answer is Yes but is there any limit restriction?
2. Bonus: Do we have to report bonuses?
3. Pay raise: I think we have to report pay raises. Again what it the raise is not significant... std 3%!!!
4. Job changes: Do we have to inform job change? And any increase in pay?
5. Spouse job: When can spouse pickup job after filing ch 13? Does UST need to know abt it?
6. Increasing # of allowances on W4 after filing ch 13 - so that there's no tax refund.: Is it doable? Would UST come to know abt it?
7. Trying for an early discharge: What if I pay-off in one year time frame (with loan money from friend)? Do problems doing it?

Above of all, would UST know abt any any of the above change?

Thanks for your response...

[woeisme]

Almost all of these items are trustee specific, meaning that it varies from trustee to trustee so no one is going to be able to answer them for you except your attorney who knows your local trustee's rules and the actual trustee for your area (although many of them will not speak to the debtor, require you to go through your attorney unless you are pro se.)

My trustee does not require tax refunds if they are under $6500. Others require tax refunds over $2000, some require any tax refund whatsoever. Your trustee will tell you if they want your tax refund. You can make adjustments in your witholdings to prevent you from having a big tax refund, if it is something your trustees would normally go after.

Bonuses and pay increases are the same way. Some trustees say 10% or higher must be reported, others require tax returns every year so see the increases then and possibly will adjust your payments as a result. Very trustee dependent.

Job changes usually do have to be reported, mainly because most trustees require payroll garnishment of your wages to make their payment, so if you changed jobs you'd have to re-do the paperwork to get the payments made.

Yes, the UST will want to know about it if spouse picking up a job causes a significant increase in disposable income. What is considered significant, again varies from trustee to trustee. And some trustees will know based on tax returns while others don't ask for them, varies, varies, varies!

Whether early payoff is a problem or not depends on whether CH 13 is at 100% payoff to creditors or not. If say you are only paying back 25% to unsecured, for example, you can't do an early payoff at year one of the 25%, you would have to pay back 100% to get discharge. Old law allowed payoff of just plan base after 3 years, no one knows what new law will allow since the 3 year mark hasn't been reached yet, but will know more after this fall and people start reaching that point in their CH 13s.

[AngelinaCat]

Hopefully, Ms. Flamingo will see this and respond. From what I've read, she and her husband were in a 13 and able to do an early payout, though they filed under the 'old law.'

Good luck to you.

[Flamingo]

Thank you Ms. AngelinaCat....but Woeisme did an excellent job with the buy out description.

To the OP - Woeisme's posting encompasses quite a bit of what you need to know to answer your questions. The problem with Chapter 13's is that they are all different; what each Trustee does or wants is different and each attorney handles everything diffrently although they all do follow the BK laws and requirements/exemptions for the state in which you reside and will file in.

While you are in a Chapter 13 Plan, your finances are under the control of the Trustee whether or not you like it...that's the way it is. If you have extra income that comes in via a raise, bonus, inheritance, lottery winnings, etc., those amounts increase your disposable income that is available to pay your creditors over the remainder of your Plan. The same applies if your income decreases. Yes your spouses obtaining a job with an increase in household income falls under the same. No Chapter 13 plan is the same...thre is no Chapter 13 cookie cutter available to put the same shape cookie on the baking tray. Your specific situation and finances/debts will dictate your Chapter 13 if that is the Chapter you end up having to file.


We are old law and bought out early from a five year Plan but it was due to major repairs having to be done on our house; it wasn't done on a whim. There is a lot involved to that and you need to have enough equity/money on hand in order to be able to buy out. Woeisme explains the timing perfectly in her posting and also about the Old Law and New Law situation.

[screwedupbyRE]

Thanks much for your responses.

Just a clarification on early pay-off:

little data on my unsecured loan (104k cc plus cram down on home equity, totally $261,000 of total unsecured debt)

After paying all the bills plus mortgage, I'm left with $207 bucks a month (per 6 months net). That I would handover to UST.

Over the five yr plan, that totals to ~ $12,500. That's what I was planning for early pay-off.

Does it means $261,000 minus $12,500 = $248,500 goes away in ch 13? Or I'd spend my life paying all the unsecured debt?

Pls clarify... Thanks

[Flamingo]

Thanks much for your responses.

Just a clarification on early pay-off:

little data on my unsecured loan (104k cc plus cram down on home equity, totally $261,000 of total unsecured debt)

After paying all the bills plus mortgage, I'm left with $207 bucks a month (per 6 months net). That I would handover to UST.

Over the five yr plan, that totals to ~ $12,500. That's what I was planning for early pay-off.

Does it means $261,000 minus $12,500 = $248,500 goes away in ch 13? Or I'd spend my life paying all the unsecured debt?

Pls clarify... Thanks

More to a Chapter 13 plan is involved besides just your income and debt. There are assets to consider, state exemptions, etc. Are you in a Plan right now or just going by presumed figures above?

[screwedupbyRE]

I'm in the process of filing (and undecided between 7 adn 13). I passed means test for ch 7 (with DI for -$180k). Though I and my wife wants to retain house "only" after the cram down. So, my attorney ran the means test by showing some extra income (just to qualify for 13 by taking out private school fee of my son) and it came up positive for $207 per month.

I did not run these numbers by myself - my attorney did. And he wouldn't answer any more questions until I pay retainer or hourly fee. I found this forum as blessing and I dont have to knock his door again and again.

[Flamingo]

The problem here is there will also be a Trustee's fee (usually around 9%), attorney's fees and who knows what figures can change. Guessing at a payoff figure, and whether or not you would be able to even consider buying out this far in advance just by guessing on a presumed plan is difficult. You just can't buy out of a Plan cause you want to buy out. Most people buy out using equity on their home accumulated during their Plan (most had a good bit of equity to begin with at the start of their plan and wanted to keep their house due to that). The Trustee would probably question if you want to buy out a year into the Plan as to where the money is coming from and there could be issues. I highly suggest you discuss all this with your attorney when/if you retain him/her so you don't think you can go into this and buy out a year later.

Don't take advice on this forum as advice that would come from your attorney (I am referring to your last paragraph in your last posting). We can only guess and surmise at what might occur but what could occur with you could be totally different. The attorney you spoke with had all your financial data in hand and knew the state exemptions/requirements and is the best source for the advice you need.

If you are undecided as to what Chapter to file, most people in that situation who want to keep their house with go with the Chapter 13. That is your own personal decision as to what you feel you can or can't afford.

[screwedupbyRE]

thx for the reply flamingo.