Why...anyone have knowledge of this

[snowangel]

I do not understand and am frustrated, angry, and confused all in one.

I am at odds with my lawyer and am trying to bite my tongue until I get this thing done with.

He seems to put everything off till the bitter last minute and it is really affecting me.

He called a meeting weeks ago with me, to file. Told me it was going to be a very long meeting and no kids were allowed. We have no one to watch our young daughter, so we put her into a daycare for the day $75 bucks! HELLO we are filing BK we don't really have an extra $75 laying around...does my lawyer forget that.

Okay so we wait for 30 minutes in the lobby, then he brings us in his office and states that he needs us to sign a few papers (3-4, maybe 5) and that he is going to file a skeletal chapter 13 FYI WE ARE A 7. He said we will have to come back in a few weeks to convert it to a 7 and that then that meeting would be very long. No kids allowed. There is no way in hell we can pay for drop in care again.

He is not missing a single document from us, he has had all of our info for months.

When I told him we wouldn't be able to get care for our child he was upset. I asked him why we couldn't file today and he just said that he wanted to just file an emergency skeletal 13 and then convert it. He said that people do it all the time, or that he does it all the time.

ANYONE FAMILIAR WITH THIS?

I have done some research and found that this is done when people need to file to put a stay on something but need more time to gather documents. We do not need stays put on anything, and we have every single piece of potential document one could ever ask for!

I could just cry, scream, something. Help me please

Any input greatly appreciated.

oh and p.s. so I paid $75 bucks today for something that I could have easily brought my little one to. Aside from sitting in the lobby we were in his office 5 minutes. gggrrr

[ForumReader]

I do not understand and am frustrated, angry, and confused all in one.

I am at odds with my lawyer and am trying to bite my tongue until I get this thing done with.

He seems to put everything off till the bitter last minute and it is really affecting me.

He called a meeting weeks ago with me, to file. Told me it was going to be a very long meeting and no kids were allowed. We have no one to watch our young daughter, so we put her into a daycare for the day $75 bucks! HELLO we are filing BK we don't really have an extra $75 laying around...does my lawyer forget that.

Okay so we wait for 30 minutes in the lobby, then he brings us in his office and states that he needs us to sign a few papers (3-4, maybe 5) and that he is going to file a skeletal chapter 13 FYI WE ARE A 7. He said we will have to come back in a few weeks to convert it to a 7 and that then that meeting would be very long. No kids allowed. There is no way in hell we can pay for drop in care again.

He is not missing a single document from us, he has had all of our info for months.

When I told him we wouldn't be able to get care for our child he was upset. I asked him why we couldn't file today and he just said that he wanted to just file an emergency skeletal 13 and then convert it. He said that people do it all the time, or that he does it all the time.

ANYONE FAMILIAR WITH THIS?

I have done some research and found that this is done when people need to file to put a stay on something but need more time to gather documents. We do not need stays put on anything, and we have every single piece of potential document one could ever ask for!

I could just cry, scream, something. Help me please

Any input greatly appreciated.

oh and p.s. so I paid $75 bucks today for something that I could have easily brought my little one to. Aside from sitting in the lobby we were in his office 5 minutes. gggrrr

Wow about your lawyer. I am sorry he put you such frustration like that. Have you consulted with other attorneys before deciding on this lawyer? He did not explain to you why you must file an emergency CH13 and then convert to a 7? Something did not sound right though especially if he did not explain fully to you what his intentions were with filing your case.

[jadams]

Why does he want to do the emergency 13 first?

Other than your desire to get it over with, is there any reason to go for an "emergency" filing now rather than just file the proper documentation when it's ready? (i.e. stop a foreclosure, garnishment, etc.)

[aljohnson007]

If there was an emergency situation, he could file the Ch7 petition electronically (as they all do) and submit the schedules and other docs later. Something smells fishy with this attorney and I don't know what you can do other than try and talk with him. Assume you have paid him already.

[frogger]

He seems to put everything off till the bitter last minute and it is really affecting me.

There's your problem in a nutshell........

[justbroke]

I asked him why we couldn't file today and he just said that he wanted to just file an emergency skeletal 13 and then convert it. He said that people do it all the time, or that he does it all the time.

This is a stall tactic if I ever heard one. The Chapter 13 confirmation process moves slowly (and in many Districts is at least 5 months). Yes it's a way to get a case filed, but I think the Attorney is technically in violation of the Federal Rules of Bankruptcy Procedure (FRBP) Rule 9011 and Federal Rules of Civil Procedure Rule 11. It reads to me that he is just overwhelmed with cases and doesn't want to tell you that he's too busy!!!

(Specifically, and MSBklawyer help me here, Rule 11 of the Fed. R. Civ. P -- as incorporated into the Fed. R. Bankr. P Rule 9011 -- state that ... (b) By presenting to the court a pleading, written motion, or other paper — whether by signing, filing, submitting, or later advocating it — an attorney or unrepresented party certifies that to the best of the person's knowledge, information, and belief, formed after an inquiry reasonable under the circumstances:... (1) it is not being presented for any improper purpose, such as to harass, cause unnecessary delay, or needlessly increase the cost of litigation;[/QUOTE])

There is no reason to file an "emergency" Chapter 13. Even if you filed a "skeletal" Chapter 13, you still need to file a plan and a bunch of other things within 15 days. I just can't see it being ethical to file under one Chapter, and causing your creditors to align resources and their strategy for the filed Chapter only to switch, purposefully, to another Chapter.

This makes absolutely no sense to me unless I look at it as the attorney stalling and not telling you that he's too busy to work with you. Hopefully, you didn't spend too much money on this attorney. I would be looking for a new attorney... yesterday.

(Let me just add, that I don't know if it's the right way or ethical or not for an attorney to do the old two-step... but it just seems odd to me.)

[snowangel]

sorry this turned out long

Okay lets see a bit more info!

There is absolutely no reason that I need a "stall" or stay or emergency. I have no foreclosure actions, no lawsuits etc. We could easily (okay maybe not easily lol) wait for a few months to file.

I paid the lawyer his entire 1300 fee up front.
I did interview several lawyers--is interview the right word. I met with several lawyers. I went with him because he seemed to be upfront, took time for his clients, and was thorough. Of course this was the impression from the first free consultation.

As soon as I paid him EVERYTHING changed!

Phone calls go unanswered, emails go unanswered. I sent him a semi lengthy email after leaving 7 messages over two weeks for him and not getting a returned call. So, respecting the fact that I assumed he was busy, I emailed him my questions.

His response, "please call to schedule a meeting so we can go over this in person". I was a little annoyed at him requiring me to come in for a meeting over a few simple questions, but again gave him the respect that he is the professional.

I was right on time for my appointment and ended up waiting in the lobby for 45 minutes, only to actually be in his office for maybe 20 minutes! If that! This type of behavior is common. He keeps you waiting in the lobby forever!!!!

He refuses to shut his door when people are in there, so you hear everything that everyone else is saying. = NO PRIVACY.

I don't know. Confused about what to do...I mean he already has our money and we are so far into the process...arrrgggg.. I could just scream, wait I already did that.

I am still stewing over the fact that I paid for care because he insisted my child not come and then he didn't even have the courtesy to call and tell me that he wouldn't be able to get my file ready in time etc.

NOTE: He never did fully tell me why we must file a chapter 13 skeletal and then convert. He just kept saying that is how cases are filed and that it would give us 15 days to get the rest of our stuff in.

But at the very end of the meeting as we were walking out I said, what stuff do I need to bring and he said, Oh you have everything you are fine. Just come back in and plan on at lest 90 minutes to go over all the numbers and sign. I asked when the 341 meeting would be but he said until we convert it to a chapter 7 no 341 will be scheduled!!!

I do know he is the only lawyer in his firm, with 2 assistants. I choose him partially because I thought smaller firm=more attentiveness!
I think he keeps taking cases even though he is swamped and can't handle all his load right now.

There is no reason for us to be in a 13.
We are below median income. We have no assets. We own our cars outright, but they are older (they are welcome to them, it would almost do us a favor). We have a home that we will be surrendering when the time comes but is not in foreclosure status as of now. We are so upside down in the home we are cutting our losses.

We have no financial hangups, and 85% of our debt is major medical bills from a child illness for one of our children.

blah!!! What to do what to do???

[backtoschool]

He is buying time to put your case to the bottom of the pile.

Tell him you want your money back.

See what he says.....

[whipster1]

He can file a "skeletal 7" if he wanted. He sounds like an idiot.

[liz417]

Gee, I don't know what to say about this attorney but...RUN!! Ask for your money back now!! If he doesn't have time for you right now (not returning calls, emails, etc.), do you really think he's going to have time later to do a conversion?!? You'll be stuck in a ch 13 and he'll be in NO RUSH to convert your case!!

Please keep us updated. Good Luck!

[snowangel]

Thanks for all the input, going to call around to a few more lawyers Monday. Also, going to call this one and demand some answers/ actions.

Will keep you updated

[AngelinaCat]

I concurr with all of the above advice. Run like you-know-what from this lawyer. This one sounds a lot like ours turned out to be. If he refuses to refund your money, report him to the State Bar.

[shabam]

This is why people need to research their lawyer and do not go to a run of the mill bk firm.

While my lawyer cost over $2K, their paralegal almost always responded within the day to a few days later. They treated me like I am their only client. Another good sign is that while they are a dedicated bk firm, they only file a few cases a month.

[ForTheBest]

Hi Snowangel,

I think you're wise to switch attorneys now.

I had similar problems with my first bk lawyer (not the CH 13 tactic, however), but because I had already paid him and was so nervous and naive about filing, I ignored my gut feelings and stuck with him. Ended up dismissing him after my first 341.

In the long run, it would have been a lot less stressful - not to mention less expensive - to get rid of him when all those red flags first started flying.

Best of luck.

[snowangel]

Okay my update. THIS IS INSANE

I called several lawyers...was told by all I would have to pay another fee--of course.

Was also told by all of them that this is very uncommon.
But advised to hang in there with this attorney so that I could avoid paying double legal fees.

WELL. I was supposed to have my appointment to sign the papers/convert it to a chapter 7. Lawyer called 3 hours before the scheduled meeting and said something has come up and that he would need to reschedule for 7-10 days out. When I pointed out that this would put us past the 15 day time frame, he stated that he would file a one time extension. WHAT!!! ???!!!

He then said that by the time they heard the motion to extend everything would already be filed so it would be a non issue. What the hell!!!

I am so angry. I hate lawyers.