Pre-paying the Attorney: Is this ok, o5r fishy?

[buffee]

I thought I would have to pay the 299$ filing fee up front, but his Attorney fee is $499(yes hes cheap) He said the chapter 7 fee(499) has to be prepaid BEFORE filing, since AFTER filing he cannot collect anything from me.
I just want to make sure I am not getting "hosed"........I filed 20 years ago, and I realize alot has changed, but I want to get some opinions from others who have been there, done that recently. It would be great if this lawyer is on the up & up.

[free2breathe]

Is this a lawyer you met in person? That seems VERY low for a Chapter 7. The actual filing fee is $299. So he's only charging $200 for the work he's going to put into it? I'd want in writing what his service includes. The lowest I've seen on this forum is either $1200 or $1400 for Chapter 7. However, that being said, it is totally above board to pre-pay before he actually files the petition.

[chicagoannie]

He would want to be prepaid, otherwise you could end up amending your filing to include HIM as a creditor. $499 is pretty cheap... we have a local guy who charges a $400 prep fee, plus the $299 filing fee. That's the least expensive Ch 7 I have seen.

[tcreegan]

Hi buffee,

...for that price I'll bet you only get documents prepped and filed. ...the ol' you get what you pay for...

After reading lots of posts, I compiled the most common attorney/client sticking points (sorry for all the long-suffering forum regulars)

Communication: phone/email/face-to-face, secretary/paralegal/attorney, turnaround time on responses
Organizaton/work ethic: dot all i's, cross all t's or 'good enough,' document filed ASAP or 'before the deadline'
Competence: know the local trustees, judges, filed cases like yours, up-to-date on relevant court rulings
Retainer/Fee: exactly what is covered, what is extra, what to expect as 'extra'

The wisdom of the forum is to schedule a series of consultations and shop around until you get a good fit.

Getting paid up-front is standard operating procedure for BK attorneys, no worries there.

Good luck, hope you find a good one!

Tom in Colo

[despritfreya]

I must agree with the others. A licensed attorney is going to charge more than a mere $500.00 to do a Chapter 7. It costs more than that for the attorney's office to type your case let alone attend the 341 meeting and deal with your creditors.

Fees are paid up front. You would be wise to shop around. If you like this person who claims to be an attorney you need to check him out with the California State Bar to make sure he's on the up & up. Don't be "penny wise and pound foolish".

Des.

[kjg812]

I only paid $500 for my attorney plus the filing fee(ch 7). I did shop around and verified the lawyer's status with the bar. I had talked to enough lawyers and done enough research that I felt comfortable with the answers I received from him (Non asset ch 7 with a large IRS debt). I did pay the fee up front. I would make sure to shop around and that you feel comfortable with them.

[buffee]

I believe the 499 is separate from the 299 which is the filing fee. I attached a link to his page. I did check with the bar and he is a lawyer. Can someone read his page and give me an opinion. I am not trying to go cheap, but if you only get 800$ a month, its going to be hard unless I can make a payment plan or borrow money. thanks

http://www.skinneresq.com/bk/?gclid=CKPliqiykKYCFQYEbAode1wVZQ

[tcreegan]

Hi again buffee,

Really hard to tell from a website; anyone can post anything. He seems on the up-and-up to me, couple years out of law school, clean record w/ the state bar and BBB, listed on Cornell's law site, low fee might be a case of 'young and hungry' I would just make sure what his fee covers and what it doesn't that might crop up later. No surprises...

As for paying, do you have any payments on debt that will be discharged in the BK? You could stop paying those and use the $ for attorney fees.

Let us know how things turn out for you!

Tom in Colo

[Charlie777]

Chapter 7 filing almost always requires that you pay the attorney up front, because the Chapter 7 discharges any amount you agreed to pay later.

Be careful to understand what will lead to additional fees because they will need to be paid if something comes up during the case.

[Peeps]

I've seen ads for attorneys that start their BK fees at $499 (with the $299 filing fee being extra, plus plan to pay fees for courses, credit pulls, additions to paperwork etc) and they're for legit representation. Usually it's for very straightforward cases, which yours might possibly be. The feedback that I saw for the $499ers is that they get the job done but it's not exactly the cadillac of service. The up-front payment seems pretty standard.

The biggest piece of advice that seems to be offered up by those who have left their experiences for others: check the paperwork carefully. And then check it again even more carefully. The NOLO book that people have mentioned on the forum might help with this. But then again, if you have a straightforward case and are checking so carefully that you become NOLO-versed, maybe you might want to consider filing pro-se. Just a thought. Best of luck to you!!

[buffee]

Hi again buffee,

Really hard to tell from a website; anyone can post anything. He seems on the up-and-up to me, couple years out of law school, clean record w/ the state bar and BBB, listed on Cornell's law site, low fee might be a case of 'young and hungry' I would just make sure what his fee covers and what it doesn't that might crop up later. No surprises...

As for paying, do you have any payments on debt that will be discharged in the BK? You could stop paying those and use the $ for attorney fees.

Let us know how things turn out for you!

Tom in Colo

Oh I quit paying my credit card bills in Aug, so everything I get right now goes to rent, utilities & car.

[HHM]

Upfront payment is normal. Your attorney cannot become a creditor of yours in your own case. For a chapter 7, 90% of the work is done BEFORE the case is filed.

But as for the amount, $599, I would never go with someone that low. You REALLY ARE NOT getting legal representation. You are getting a paralegal and an attorney signature and the fee agreement is worded in such a way that if anything goes wrong it will be YOUR fault, not his/hers. In this particular case, either this attorney is a lousy business person (not unusual) and really doesn't understand the value of his service, or he uses virtual assistance (somewhat common). In either event, I loved seeing the flow chart he put on his website, NO WAY his $599 covers everything in that flow chart. For something as important as a BK that can have such long lasting impact, $499 is a ridiculous price. The attorney appears to be a dabbler, he does BK in addition to other areas of law; for an area of practice that is as highly specialized as BK, that is not ideal. Personally, I think you are overpaying for the level of service you are receiving.

[btbeme]

My opinion: An attorney is someone you pay to get you out of trouble. I can promise that $499 gets you nothing should your Ch 7 go sideways. Sounds like a paperwork fee.

I have absolutely no regrets paying over $3200 for my attorney, as his advice, pre-planning experience, and expertise in avoiding the trap doors meant that out BK went very smoothly, despite a very real concern about it blowing up in our faces. He was exceptional. And his fee was more than reasonable. I'd do it again, and I could easily recommend his services and fee to anyone whose Ch 7 is not "cut and dried."

$499 is a red flag.

[tobee43]

i agree with the other posters here....$500 sounds very low....however, that being said, an atty cannot file for you unless you are pd in full with the firm...so that part is normal or "common".....

did you sit with this person and have a consult??? do you fill confidence in their answers to your questions.....are you comfortable with their approach...how long have they practiced bk....these are all questions i would want the answer to before i hired anyone to represent me and my interest in such an important matter.

there are hundreds...let me correct that...thousands of atty's....make certain you pick the right one for you. we had to do monthly payments until our firm was pd in full and then we were able to file. so, don't find the fact that an atty needs to be paid in full anyway odd.

best of luck in your filing!

[buffee]

I have done this before(I am stupid, didn't learn the first time) and in 1994 you paid the filing fee up front, and then you could pay off the remaining fees...so things have changed. I have 17,000 in credit card debt. I am not trying to get the cheapest just someone reasonable. With my income of 800$ per month, its going to be borrowing time...in order to do this. I am pretty "street smart" and his price did send up a red flag, so I made two appointments with two other lawyers next week, one of them is the one who did my BK in 94 and very very nice. I just don't want to have to sell everything I own in order to do this, I had to do that last time.
I never thought it would come to do, but when the stupid surgeon performed a routine surgery on my mom in 2009, he left her brain damaged & on a vent... we lived together, so it was easy to afford all my bills. With her in a home now, I am having to "pick up the slack" and I am squeezed....oh its my fault! In 2004 I made a &*^% load of money at my job, had a work related accident leaving me permentaly disabled....so my income went from a boat load to half of that(whoch was still fine) to a year ago 800$ a month. I tried to keep up, never missed a minimum, and in July it occured to me, I was just "avoiding the evitable" by paying the minimums. So here I am...I am a mess!!!!!!!sorry to vent