How do you get sued if you're not there? We're also in DEEP HOCK!!

[debtmonster]

I've read about people getting summons for court and what not. I don't understand how you'd have to go to court if they can't find you. My wife was hurt by a neighbor's dog. We went to sue him for $2500. We went to court and the court sent the cops over 3 times to subpoena him. Every time the cops knocked on the door either somebody answered the door saying he wasn't home or they would say that he is the landlord and they simply rent from him. He kept dodging the police visits. My wife went back to the court and asked what was up. They told her, "We were not able to serve him. There's nothing you can do."

So if this was this case for us, why can't everyone simply not answer their door when the person comes to your house to give you a subpoena?

Last year me and my wife made over $100k together. In 2006 and 2007 we bought three 2007 cars. A few days ago one was repo'd. Both of us are out of work and don't have two nickels to run together. Both of us left our jobs to work for better jobs. We both got a double-wammy and were let go. When going to file for unemployment, they decline you for making less than $3600 at the new job and for the fact that the previous job wasn't a layoff. Our previous jobs filled the positions when we went back. So now we're both stuck with a $5,000+ per month deficit, yet all of the bills are coming in.

The car payments on our 3 cars totaled $1,658/mo. + insurance and gas. Back then we could easily afford it. As of now, we're stuck. We've been living on credit cards just to buy groceries and what not. As of now we have maybe $10-20 in our checking account.

We live in Florida. Is it different here about being sued? So they can't sue you if they can't serve you? Is this why Florida is like the Bankruptcy Capital of the country or something? We really don't want to file for bankruptcy since we've recently racked up a lot of debt including stuff after we were unemployed thinking that we would be able to get another job. We live way out in the country and just to go on an interview uses $7+ worth of gas to drive into town. One of our cars runs on premium only and now that's $3.60/gallon and climbing.

Pretty soon both of our cell phones will be cut off from lack of payment. The only phone we will have working is the MagicJack.com phone since it's a 1 time payment of $40 bucks to use it the entire year using the USB port. The sound quality is horrible most of the time for the person on the other end, but it makes a call in a pinch. Our land line doesn't have long distance on it since we can't afford anything. So we make all long distance calls with the MagicJack USB phone line.

My wife is spoiled with the new cars. Also since we have to drive 30 miles to any major grocery store, Wal-mart, Home Depot, etc, and the fact that there's no cell coverage out here, the LAST thing you want to be driving is some old beater car with 100,000+ miles that will break down. If it breaks down out in the forest where we live, you'll be walking to miles to either get home or find the nearest payphone.

I told her that we need to get rid of our luxury car and simply give it back as a repo and buy a $500-1000 beater. She fights with me all the time saying it's not going to happen.

I have a 3rd income where I earn money as a contractor, so it's reported as a 1099. I told her that we're supposed to be putting away 1/3rd of this money to pay the IRS. It's now the 3rd month and we haven't put any money away for the IRS. Instead, we've been using the money to pay the creditors to keep our credit from being trashed. But if this keeps up and we can't get a job all year, then we'll end up not paying the IRS all year. In 2009 I'll end up owing $8,000+ in taxes and much more in penalties and interest. I wanted to use this contractor money to buy something like a '92 LeBaron for $1000 that has 112,000 miles on it. ANYTHING to keep us from walking. Then we can file bankruptcy.

I have a phone # with GrandCentral. It re-directs to my real phone # as a proxy. If any collection agency starts hounding me hard, I simply can put all of their calls into voice mail automatically without even ringing my phone, OR I can block them so it gives them a true simulation of a disconnected phone.

I also had another car repo'd right before we got the three 2007 cars. A friend of mine is in disbelief how I was able to get these new cars, especially at 5.9% on one and 9.9% one the other and 10% on the third, WITH A REPO. Then we got new credit cards and stuff even with that repo showing up. It blows my mind that we're driving a $40k luxury car down the road and the payment on it is almost $750/mo. But that party is ABOUT TO BE OVER very soon and we'll be driving an old '92 Lebaron or '94 Chevy with 150,000 miles once the last 2 cars are repo'd. Not to mention the car we had repo'd the other day was WAY OVER $10k upside down. In 12 months we put over 35,000 miles on it.

The other car I have, I used to drive 4 hours per day to commute to work since there's nothing around here. I racked up over 50,000 miles on this 2007 car in one year. I owe like $15k on it. It's probably worth $5-6k at auction with those miles.

The $40k luxury car has $11000 miles on it and we bought it around August of last year.

All in all it was:
Car #1 $17k
Car #2 $25k
Car #3 $41k

All to eventually be repo'd with of miles on them making them worth way less than what we owe.

Since we don't have real jobs, there's nothing to garnish. All we can afford on the contractor income is about $2k max. Our bills exceed $5k when paying everything the way we're supposed to. We need to gross $7-8k/mo. to take home $5k. In today's economy in this area, it's impossible to make anything more than $6-8/hr which wouldn't even put a DENT in our bills. And that's for a part time job. The cost of fuel to drive to that job would be almost 1/2 of the entire net paycheck since we live so far out in the country. And now with the housing market so bad, we can't sell our house. I am just using the contractor money to pay the mortgage, electric, property taxes and home owner's insurance. After that, there's not much left.

When my friends hear and see the stuff we all bought last year, they call me "DEBT MONSTER."

Well... I thought we could pay it back. Who knew a bad recession was coming with $3.60+/gallon gas, soon to be $4/gallon or $5/gallon? And I don't have a scooter!

Your friend to the end,

Debt Monster

[Flamingo]

After reading your posting, I think you already have solved your own problems. Reality has hit as to your bills and living beyond your means and when the problems occurred with the job loss, it all came to a screeching halt. Happens to a lot of us, especially when the income stops and one cannot find a comparable job in the same income area. I would suggest seeing an attorney to investigate bankruptcy to get you out of the mess you are in now and get ahold of your finances and make a budget and stick to it. The lifestyle change is what is going to hit you both the hardest and it has already started with your wife. She will need to learn luxury cars don't pay for themselves and you have to make enough to purchase the vehicle, maintain it and purchase gas for a gas hog. It's tough out there.

To find out exactly where you stand, you need to get a free consultation with a BK attorney in your area. You can call your State Bar Association to get a referall for a lawyer or you can look in the yellow pages and find one who gives free initial consultations. Call and make an appointment for you and your wife. Take with you a full listing of all your bills, monthly payments, sources of income, paystubs, most recent income tax returns (state and federal) and a listing of assets (stocks, house, checking/savings, etc.). You will be advised where you stand and what you can and cannot do. Best of luck to you both!

[keepmine]

Process and service requiresments differ by states. It's not true you have to actually serve someone .All states have provisions for alternative service. From service by publication to a registered letter to a last known address. You should have researched your state laws more throughly.

[debtmonster]

Process and service requiresments differ by states. It's not true you have to actually serve someone .All states have provisions for alternative service. From service by publication to a registered letter to a last known address. You should have researched your state laws more throughly.

[HHM]

So what if you don't sign the registered letter? What if you were out of the country or in another state? How can a company sue you if you're physically not there?

Doesn't matter. When it comes to service by mail, the requirement is that the summons be "sent", not that it actually be received. And as was already pointed out, all states have some method for service by publication. Basically, the creditor files an affidavit with the court saying they have done research to find and can't find you...at which point the court will authorize the publishing of the summons in a newspaper, after a certain number or weeks of publication, the summons is considered served.

For the most part, from a creditors perspective, serving the debtor and getting the judgment is the EASY part...the hard part is actually collecting the judgment. A motivated creditor will get service of process one way or the other, it is quite easy to do, and despite what people, the don't literally have to place the summons in your hands.

FL is Bk friendly because they have an unlimited home equity exemption and other very beneficial asset exemptions for debtors.

[debtmonster]

paper

Doesn't matter. When it comes to service by mail, the requirement is that the summons be "sent", not that it actually be received. And as was already pointed out, all states have some method for service by publication. Basically, the creditor files an affidavit with the court saying they have done research to find and can't find you...at which point the court will authorize the publishing of the summons in a newspaper, after a certain number or weeks of publication, the summons is considered served.

For the most part, from a creditors perspective, serving the debtor and getting the judgment is the EASY part...the hard part is actually collecting the judgment. A motivated creditor will get service of process one way or the other, it is quite easy to do, and despite what people, the don't literally have to place the summons in your hands.

FL is Bk friendly because they have an unlimited home equity exemption and other very beneficial asset exemptions for debtors.

I wonder why they have not done this to me in the past. In the 1990's my credit was also in the toilet. I had tons of credit cards and many repo's. Why didn't they ever come after me then? I've never had a judgement put on me. So moving around should have nothing to do with it then? In the 1990's I moved every 3 to 12 months. I relocated to a job in Indiana once. The guy paid the relo. I signed for an apartment. The guy never paid me and I ended up fleeing the state. This was for a job that was supposed to pay $50k/yr. It never panned out and the apartment complex wanted $7k from me.

Also, a friend of mine told me that Capital One has like 1,000,000 people in default. If they went after all 1 million people and put ads in the papers, and let's say it costs like $40-50 per ad... that's a LOT of good money going after bad. Why spend all that money running ads to chase a bunch of broke people knowing full well they can file bankruptcy?

I guess I will have to just wait it out. My wife was born in South America. I've been telling her that we need to move there ASAP. She has no desire to go back there. Since my income is MLM, we could move there. The money we make living in this country isn't worth anything because everything here is so expensive. $3.60 for a gallon of gas. $4.79 for a gallon of milk, etc. But if we went there, everything there is so DIRT CHEAP! You could rent a nice little place for $150-300/mo. USD. I haven't seen people able to rent any apartment here for that price since the early 70's!!

When you convert the USD to their currency, you can buy so much more. Then we could just stay low there for a few years until the statute of limitations works into play and come back like my friend did. She has lots of family there. We'd have a place to stay and plenty of food to eat. Unlike here, we are so broke and can't even buy groceries right now. My wife went to Save-A-Lot, which is like an Aldi's, and bought a bunch of cheap groceries. That put her HSBC card over the limit.

What I am trying to figure out is why many people have gotten served and I didn't.

Here's the bad debts I had up until around 1999-2003, which most of them I got removed from my credit reports... but none of these people ever sued me or subpoena'd me that I know of...

First Premier Bank $250
FNB BRKGS/Credit Store $1953
Providian $2300
Zeos/Micron $1400
Fleet CC $1,561
Credit First/Firestone Tire $650
Perimeter Credit LLC/BAL $800
JCPenney $2200
ACSI/Charter $16,199 (repo)
Discover $1200
VW Motor Credit $20,000 (repo)
Harris Bank Mastercard $1500
Colonial National Bank $1500
Amtrust Bank $1100
Mutual Acceptance $1100
Citibank VISA $1500
PSINet $3000
Bally's $815
Cinergy PSI (electric in Indiana) $150
Apartment building in Missouri ($3200) left when I became unemployed
Apartment building in Ft. Myers, FL ($3800) left when I became unemployed again
Kia $8500 (repo in 2003)
Capital One $500 (I think another card I had)
Wells Fargo ($10,000) another repo last year

These are all old debts that haunted me for years. I never went bankrupt. I was just starting to get back on my feet and now it's all happening again. So now we'll have a good $100k+ to add onto this, especially with 3 new repo's all in the same year.

Will the post office forward mail to an address out of the country? What happens if I contact all of my creditors and let them know about our new address and phone # overseas? What will they think about that? What legal recourse do they have for somebody not living on U.S. soil?

[keepmine]

What I am trying to figure out is why many people have gotten served and I didn't.


Why are you wasting time worrying about events over which you have no control?
Creditors are very aware that suing is an expensive way to collect.
Several years ago, I saw a study that concluded that only about 1/3 of all judgments are ever collected. The reasons are varied. People file bk, their income is exempt from garnishment, they just quit their job and disappear, they may well have other judgments that must be satisfied before another wage execution can be proceesed or, the ultimate-they just die.
Also, nobody has to sue you the moment you default. They have years to sue prior to the SOL running.
There just seems to be no rhyme nor reason sometimes to who gets sued and who doesn't. Just accept the fact that you can be sued regardless if you accept service or not.

[debtmonster]

What I am trying to figure out is why many people have gotten served and I didn't.


Why are you wasting time worrying about events over which you have no control?
Creditors are very aware that suing is an expensive way to collect.
Several years ago, I saw a study that concluded that only about 1/3 of all judgments are ever collected. The reasons are varied. People file bk, their income is exempt from garnishment, they just quit their job and disappear, they may well have other judgments that must be satisfied before another wage execution can be proceesed or, the ultimate-they just die.
Also, nobody has to sue you the moment you default. They have years to sue prior to the SOL running.
There just seems to be no rhyme nor reason sometimes to who gets sued and who doesn't. Just accept the fact that you can be sued regardless if you accept service or not.

Why do I worry? Because we now have $100k+ in new debt, not including our house that I don't want this rollercoaster ride to start all over again. All of the other debts are now just about past the statue of limitations for my state.

What is the big deal about being sued. Do you think I was sued and didn't know about it since I moved around so much? Just because you are sued, what is the big deal? So you get sued, they win, then what? I've never been sued (that I know of), so that's why I am asking these questions.

So if you get sued, they win and you don't pay, what's the absolute worst thing that can happen if both people are unemployed with no job? You don't go to jail, right, since there is no debtors prison? So why do people on here make such a big deal about it. So I get 20 people to sue me and win. What will happen if they can't get blood from a turnip?

We've been able to pay all of our bills FLAWLESSLY for all of 2007 since we had anywhere between $5,000 and $8,000 per month gross coming in. Now our income has tanked to $1,900 to $3,500 (max) gross from an MLM I joined. They can only garnish W2 places, right, since companies that 1099 are different.

[BKOnce]

After reading your story, I laughed real hard!!.. It's so funny...

[HHM]

We will try to give you information as best we can, but this is NOT a debt avoidance website.

Although for some people, doing nothing, is a viable option, for most people it is not, so we don't really dwell on the ins-and-outs of tactics to avoid creditors, there are plenty of other, "questionable, and some downright fraudulent" websites you can visit for that information.

Bottom line, IF you are sued, and IF the creditor gets a judgment against, the creditor can go after any assets. The garnishment issue is a double-edged sword for you...on the one hand, creditors can't normally garnish 1099 income...but at the same token, in many states, you cannot exempt it either. Your MLM money is like a receivable, and is therefore an asset that could conceivable be levied against to satisfy a judgment, HOWEVER, that scenario is purely hypothetical, the creditor would really have to be motivated to take things that far.

Also, do a search on this website for Statute of Limitations to get some information about the type of path you are taking. Statute of Limitation is only a defense to a lawsuit, creditors can still continue non-judicial collection activity against you, and your credit will basically remained trashed indefinitely.

[debtmonster]

thanks

I really appreciate you guys posting. BKOnce, you're not the only one. When I tell my long-term friends my situation over the phone, many of them have laughed or are in total awe. Most of them freak out wondering how I was able to get a $40,000 car after having a repo. Even the finance guy at the place told me that. He was in awe himself when they approved the loan.

I wasn't trying to purposely avoid the people. It just turned out that way because I either got evicted or had my phone shut off for lack of payment. I go from one extreme to the other. We either made good money to survive or it came to a screeching halt and went to almost $0.

And the big problem is, a bankruptcy lawyer wants $1600 or so to file Chapter 7. If I don't have the money to pay the creditors, how do I have the money to pay him? So I've just been going through life NOT filing bankruptcy, even though I wanted to many times, VERY, VERY badly. I wish to God that I made recordings of the phone calls from these collection agencies. I could have made a million dollars from selling the recordings as people would have been on the floor howling with laughter. I know it wasn't funny for me, but coming from your side of the fence, most of you would have thought it was hysterical, even though this is not really a laughing matter.

Well, as it is right now, we're stuck. We have no money to our name. The mortgage, electric, home owner's insurance, phone, groceries and all of these things are coming due to be paid and we're broke. If we can't afford to pay these absolute necessities, how do we pay a bankruptcy lawyer? How do people here get all that money to file bankruptcy?

If anyone came to my house one time, you'd have to be nuts to live out here without having a fairly new, reliable car. The last thing you want to do is be stuck out here in the middle of nowhere in a broken down car. That happened to me once when I ran out of gas. I left work at 5:30 PM. I didn't get home until 10 PM!!! SIMPLY FROM RUNNING OUT OF GAS! If I went bankrupt and bought a $500 dollar beater car, it would be throwing rods or have a transmission fail from all of the miles we quickly rack up.

What I truly need is a $5300 to buy a Majesty 400 scooter. That way I can pay like $129/mo. and not have car insurance. All I would need to pay is the scooter payment and gas. That would be the best deal ever... but this is just a pipe dream.

If I could simply go to a used lot and get a $5,000 used car at 12% interest and pay over 48 months, I WOULD BE TICKLED PINK!!! On the Auto Trader, I have found tons of used cars for $3-5k with low mileage, but they are all 500 miles away from here and are PRIVATE SELLERS who want CASH and do not do financing. I simply don't have $3-5k cash. If I did, I would be paying bills and keeping my credit good.

If I could get the $3-5k car with like 40-60k miles like the above and have the ability to pay $100-140/mo, I would give back both of our 2007 cars now and file bankruptcy.

[Flamingo]

After reading all this, both you and your wife need some serious financial counseling if you feel you don't want to file bankruptcy and get your lives in control financially. You have some deep financial issues going on as to a history of unpaid debts and are in denial feeling you can avoid them. You can run but you can't hide - all this will catch up with you big time if you don't make a serious attempt to turn some things around as to your lifestyle to go along with a drop/loss of income. I am just giving you some good advice because no one but yourself can get you out of the mess you are in. You are in a downward spiral that will be come so bad you will end up at the State Agency for Food Stamps. You don't have the income you had last year and apparently do not have any savings to tide you over and are using credit cards to survive. No one is giong to knock on your door and hand you $100,000. Make that appointment as I mentioned to you in my previous posting and I wish both of you good luck in getting everything resolved.

[debtmonster]

Counseling

After reading all this, both you and your wife need some serious financial counseling if you feel you don't want to file bankruptcy and get your lives in control financially. You have some deep financial issues going on as to a history of unpaid debts and are in denial feeling you can avoid them. You can run but you can't hide - all this will catch up with you big time if you don't make a serious attempt to turn some things around as to your lifestyle to go along with a drop/loss of income. I am just giving you some good advice because no one but yourself can get you out of the mess you are in. You are in a downward spiral that will be come so bad you will end up at the State Agency for Food Stamps. You don't have the income you had last year and apparently do not have any savings to tide you over and are using credit cards to survive. No one is giong to knock on your door and hand you $100,000. Make that appointment as I mentioned to you in my previous posting and I wish both of you good luck in getting everything resolved.

I would LOVE TO! Where do I go for the counseling?

I tried some debt counseling places and they told me that they could not help. All they asked is how much credit card debt I had. I told them, "It's the $1658/mo. in car payments that are killing me. The unsecured debt is easy stuff. We can pay that." Then they replied, "Sorry, we don't do auto loans." Why can't they reduce the payments of the cars?!?!?

If they could get these payments from $1658 to something like $500/mo., that would help tremendously.

I will have to start adding up the debts into a spread sheet as the bills come in. As of now, I have no idea how much the bills are. My wife gets the bills and files them away. I've been just trying to make the minimum payments.

[Bandit]

What is the big deal about being sued. Do you think I was sued and didn't know about it since I moved around so much? Just because you are sued, what is the big deal? So you get sued, they win, then what? I've never been sued (that I know of), so that's why I am asking these questions.

So if you get sued, they win and you don't pay, what's the absolute worst thing that can happen if both people are unemployed with no job? You don't go to jail, right, since there is no debtors prison? So why do people on here make such a big deal about it. So I get 20 people to sue me and win. What will happen if they can't get blood from a turnip?

Most people do not get to or do not want to move around that much but I totally relate to what you are saying. They also would not want you in jail because then they cannot get any money from you if you are not working.

I suppose just end up in a state that does not allow them to garnish your wages & nothing would happen. My little brother has kind had the same situation as you & has been moving around for many years & had over 100,000 in debt but nothing ever came of it. He works for cash doing his own business, pays taxes etc, and a lot of the debt may not exist any more.

They can't get blood from a turnip & they can't eat you either but many places once you settle or start working again, then the judgment if there is one can garnish wages and other states do not allow that even...so maybe you will stay lucky.

It would wear me out after awhile but maybe in younger days, while in those days I had no debt.

[debtmonster]

Man, you are not kidding. Moving absolutely sucks. I did it in the past for various jobs in the 1990's. I moved from Florida, to Indiana, back to Florida and then Illinois, Missouri and back to Florida, all for computer jobs. I was renting apartments and was in my 20's and early 30's back then. Every time I would lose a job, we would have to liquidate assets to be able to pay for the moving truck and move what little we'd have left. I'd get a job in that town, start to get back on my feet and then layoffs would happen and the vicious cycle would repeat over and over. I simply can't just keep a job. A friend of mine works for the gov't and I've been begging him to get me a job there for 12 years and he refuses to lift a finger. His parents were rich and paid $50-60k for his education so he made out on a silver spoon. I moved around and worked right out of high school. The jobs I took frowned upon me going to school since I was working overtime. Plus I never stayed put long enough to finish. I enrolled in school a few times and ended up moving and never got to finish. It really sucked.

Now we're home owners and can't move. We can't sell our house. I'd have to abandon it if we wanted work anywhere else. It's the first home I'd been able to get in my life and I was lucky to get it as it was. We managed to save up a little bit while living with in-laws. Now since the housing market has tanked, the banks have gone back to the old school way of wanting 20% down. If we lose this house, we'll never get another.

So let's say they put a judgement on me. What exactly happens? Is it just some entry on my credit report not letting me sell the house or finance a car? I don't mind that.