Do we "deserve" a clean slate?

[coloradomrg]

Ignorant consumers do not equate to bad financial companies! Ignoring ANY writing is at your own risk.

It is not the systems job to teach financial responsiblity, its the job of PARENTS.

[wonkettegirl]

For myself, I guess the answer is mixed. Do I "deserve" to be let out the mortgage agreements? Yes, because I bought the house with my now ex-husband and we could afford it together. When we split, I knew I'd have to sell it because I can't afford it on my own. After over a year on the market, with my treading economic water and going down fast, I simply cannot sell it. Not for any price, it appears, and certainly not for anywhere near what I owe on it.

That one I consider a pass - it wasn't my fault that the marriage tanked or that the housing market tanked. I did the best I could for as long as I could, and I don't feel bad about walking away from the house.

Much of the credit card debt I've racked up since the divorce are directly due to not being able to make ends meet while carrying teh huge mortgage on my own. I didn't charge up too much luxury (although I will admit to some dinners out, some shows with my kids, some not-bare-bones indulgences), but I feel a little bad about discharging this debt because it really is a cheat.

The marital debt that I was held responsible for (the sale of the home was supposed to wipe this out, according to the divorce papers)? Yes and no. Yes, because my ex and I DID make those charges and DID enjoy the benefits and I feel a bit guilty about discharging them. No, because it was unfair that I was stuck with them and that because the house didn't sell, it's all on my shoulders.

[junker]

All i want is the same thing as AIG got, and the banks got, no more, no less. give me a milliondollar bailout and i will pay my bills, and stay solvent.

[fltoo]

When you become solvent again, and can afford it, are you willing to pay back the money you discharged plus interest?

If not, you are not eligible for the same "bailout".

[jgordo52]

Do I deserve a clean slate? I'd be lying if I said yes, I knew I was living beyond my means and just kept telling myself that I'd pay more towards it next month, 3 months, a year down the road. Bottom line, I got myself into this mess by being an idiot. I'm not going for a 13 but over the last 8 months of saving to pay my attorney and getting caught up on house and only living on cash and what not has taught me alot. I just hope this will leave an imprint on me to never live as wrecklessly as I did. I, like 'Hub, get more upset at the repeat filers that didn't learn their lesson the first time and vow not to be like them. that' s just my 2 cents. I am glad that I can get a clean slate, but do I deserve it, HELL NO. I did it to myself.

[Scott50]

I'm in a CH13 and I don't feel that I'm getting a clean slate that people in CH7's are getting.. Five years of payments (unsecured are getting 45%)...

[fltoo]

So true. Maybe someone who is not filing BK and pays their bills on time and in full can chime in on you not paying 55% of your debt.

[wonkettegirl]

Jeez, fltoo, what brought you to bankruptcy? Please explain why you're so judgmental toward the rest of us irresponsible slobs.

[jgordo52]

I've been on this site for 8 months now and lately I've definitely seen an increase of people starting crap with others on this forum. We're all here for one reason, we've been irresponsible with our debt. We are not above others in that manner. Whether you've filed, thinking about filing, listening to other's stories to try to avoid the same mistakes. No MATTER what chapter, people are going to have an opinion, but Fltoo, you're above no one here. Chill out.

[fltoo]

What brought any of us here is irrelevent. I did not have any hardship that caused me to file, therefore it is my fault, plain and simple.

Barring personal catastrophes, many of us share the same idea that we are in this predicament due to irresponsibility and it is no one's fault but our own. Read on.

[banca rotta]

If asked this question 50 years ago I would say we don't deserve a clean slate. (not that I was alive 50 years ago)

Today I will say yes. I feel that while I made all of my bad descisions and no one made them for me the "credit system" in it's current form between credit cards, car leases, sub-prime mortgages, pay day lenders have inflated the cost of goods and services causing everyone to pay more.

Now that the above schemes (which is their appropriate name) are disappearing the economy is returning to normal cash only and we are taking a serious beating getting to that point.

Those that crafted this system are killing us all with bailout money so we need the clean slate to pay higher taxes and inflation to clean up the mess.

[banca rotta]

When you become solvent again, and can afford it, are you willing to pay back the money you discharged plus interest?

If not, you are not eligible for the same "bailout".

If I ever got rich I would take the amount plus interest that I discharged in bankruptcy and donate it to causes like debtor education. Get some good out of it.

Would I pay it back to the creditors? Sure! You and I just did courtesy of the 700b tarp.

[fltoo]

If asked this question 50 years ago I would say we don't deserve a clean slate. (not that I was alive 50 years ago)

Today I will say yes. I feel that while I made all of my bad descisions and no one made them for me the "credit system" in it's current form between credit cards, car leases, sub-prime mortgages, pay day lenders have inflated the cost of goods and services causing everyone to pay more.

Now that the above schemes (which is their appropriate name) are disappearing the economy is returning to normal cash only and we are taking a serious beating getting to that point.

Those that crafted this system are killing us all with bailout money so we need the clean slate to pay higher taxes and inflation to clean up the mess.

So true banca.

[Flamingo]

In another thread elsewhere on the board, someone made a comment that no one really "deserves" a clean slate, just because we want one. I wonder what your thoughts are on that - do you deserve a clean slate? Do you feel you're getting away with something you shouldn't?

Without the legal "out" we had as to Chapter 13, we would have had to sell our house. Did we "deserve" that option? No, because we put ourselves in the situation to line up to eventually having to file - a major job loss just tilted the heavy debt boat even though we were making excellent money to keep the boat afloat. We should have known that if a job loss occurred and we could not recover with a job that matched the lost funds in a decent period of time, we would have been in bad trouble. My mother used to always state and it is so true - "You make your own bed and have to lie in it."

It was in the paper today that BK's are approaching the 1 million mark for this year so far. Remember, most of those folks are probably deeply mired in debt. Hopefully in the years to come, people will learn that high debt can get you in bad trouble and that it really doesn't matter anymore if you have the next hot gadget on the market to look good to your friends, neighbors and co-workers...

[Bandit]

I've been on this site for 8 months now and lately I've definitely seen an increase of people starting crap with others on this forum. We're all here for one reason, we've been irresponsible with our debt. We are not above others in that manner. Whether you've filed, thinking about filing, listening to other's stories to try to avoid the same mistakes. No MATTER what chapter, people are going to have an opinion, but Fltoo, you're above no one here. Chill out.

I just want to comment on the bolded part. Nothing could be farther from the truth. There are quite a few people here who are above & beyond responsible with their debt.

Just because you chose to live high on the hog and above your means does not mean everyone else goes bankrupt for the same reason you are. There are many valid reasons that are beyond peoples control and has nothing to do with not being responsible.