Unemployment extensions - 99ers - Any Updates?

[helpme2010]

backtoschool, that was a well informed set of comments you made.

I used the time when I was unemployed to return to school and complete my degree. I have also done volunteer work.

If someone wants to refer to it as welfare beyond a certain timeline, I am not happy with that term, but to me it is a word. As long as I get help until I get back on my feet, that is what is important to me. I am getting more and more interview calls and responses right now, including two for Fortune companies. The rest are for very small companies. I am hoping to find the job and then I can post how the unemployment extensions made a success story out of me and many others that are looking forward to returning to work and contributing large amounts of taxes back into the economy again.

[houston7]

Ok, I have stayed out of this discussion, but am going to throw my opinion into the mix now, because I think some of the posters are confusing issues.

1. Short term unemployment insurance is not welfare. It is in many states, (like NJ) a system that is paid into by employees and is more like insurance than welfare. It is debatable at what point long term unemployment insurance could be considered welfare. If the insurance goes on well past the point that money was paid into the system, and if there is no end date ever, then unemployment insurance would be a form of welfare because it would be a long term entitlement based on need not merit.

2. There is no pejorative connotation to the word "welfare" when I use it. I am using the word as a means of describing financial need based government entitlements. I do not think welfare is bad or wrong.

3. 99 weeks of not holding any job whatsoever will be very detrimental to obtaining professional employment moving forward. Employers do not want to see long gaps in a resume where skills have atrophied, knowledge has been forgotten, work habits have weakened, and skill relevancy has disappeared. It is better to volunteer or start a business than to collect unemployment for 99 weeks without having any job related experience in those 99 weeks.

4. I do not see any correlation between declaring bankruptcy and filing for unemployment extensions. One action is not morally superior to the other in my opinion, nor are either action even remotely related.

5. I am a pragmatist and I do not think that a Republican congress will extend unemployment indefinitely. I think those on long term unemployment need a back up plan asap.

Just my opinions.....

I'll help you with the correlation. And I will address ohiododger.

Crap happens to people and we have to use whatever means necessary to survive. Someone who is considering bankruptcy has no reason to sit in judgement of those of us collecting unemployment. We are BOTH using a financial tool that is available to us to survive. Now, ohiododger's reasons for considering bankruptcy would most likely fall into two categories. Things that happened to him were beyond his control, so he is using bankruptcy as a financial tool for survival. Kind of like, oh I don't know, people who are laid off and are collecting unemployment to survive... The second category would be poor financial decision making. Which would mean that he brought this upon himself and has no place whatsoever to sit in judgement of us.

On to your suggestions. Please. Start a business? People who are collecting unemployment are just swimming in cash. And those wonderful bankers just can't loan money fast enough, especially to folks like us with our skyrocketing credit scores. Volunteer? Again, some of these people here don't even have enough money for gas to get to these places. Don't even bother with the flip a burger suggestion. And if you have read and understood some of the posts in this forum it's not like you just fill out an application Monday and are knee dip in french fries on Tuesday. Feel free to educate yourself on the real unemployment numbers and the fact that employers are sitting on loads of cash and not hiring.

MSBankruptcylawer (if I remember the name right) was at least sympathetic to our plight. One thing he touched was the downward standard of living that we are at the front of. He is so right. And it isn't the long term unemployed that should be worried. It's you employed folk sitting in judgement that should be worried. Employers know that the job market is tight, so I wouldn't be holding my breath for consistent raises if I was you. Also, at some point, I might take your advice and volunteer.
At the company you work for, doing your job. Then I can start undercutting your salary by offering to do your job for less money. At this point you can take less money, or, unemployment. But you can only collect for 26 weeks. Lest you have a large gap in your resume and your skills begin to atrophy. Of course you can always start a business, or volunteer, or flip burgers.

This scenario that I have outlined above is what happens when capitalism moves from merely a type of economy to a type of psychology. If nothing else, this last 14 months has been an eye opener for me as to just how crappy and judgemental some people can be. They toss out republican talking points without taking time to research the depth of the problem. People are too stupid or myopic to realize that banding together and holding employers accountable would give us all a chance to at least maintain our middle class standing. Instead, it's easier to sit in judgement of somebody who lost their job. No problem though. We are at the front economic slide, and, now that I know how my "fellow americans" feel about us, I will be only too happy to drag them down with me.

[shark66]

Crap happens to people and we have to use whatever means necessary to survive.

Amen

MSBankruptcylawer (if I remember the name right) was at least sympathetic to our plight. One thing he touched was the downward standard of living that we are at the front of. He is so right. And it isn't the long term unemployed that should be worried. It's you employed folk sitting in judgement that should be worried.

Although I'm usually very far from passing judgment on anyone around here, I have to agree...I'm employed, making slightly more than 60% of what I was five years ago and am dead certain that I'd be unemployed for an extremely long period of time if I were ever to lose this job. Not for a lack of good resume, experience etc...but because of the fact that there are many people out there who'd be happy to do what I'm doing for half the money and the corporate HR departments know it...

This scenario that I have outlined above is what happens when capitalism moves from merely a type of economy to a type of psychology. .

Yep. The Gordon Gecko mentality as I like to call it. Scary stuff, with no end in sight.

"What do you want to be when you grow up?"

" Bernie Madoff before he got caught..."

Good luck to us all...

[Babybear]

I didnt read the whole thread but I read enough to say that maybe disability payments are a crutch too but some people have no choice, like me. I would hate to think how I could survive if they were stopped. Its not cuz I dont want to work. Its because I cant. I am in pain. I dont see that too differently than someone who honestly truely cant find work. Now if they just werent looking or willing to work for less than maybe you have a point but it doesnt appear that way. We all need to survive and I see it as a necessary role of the government to help people due that weather due to disability, poverty , raising as child alone with low income or the fact that few jobs exist to support someones basic needs. Thats what we pay into the system for in the first place.

[backtoschool]

I'll help you with the correlation. And I will address ohiododger.

Crap happens to people and we have to use whatever means necessary to survive. Someone who is considering bankruptcy has no reason to sit in judgement of those of us collecting unemployment. We are BOTH using a financial tool that is available to us to survive. Now, ohiododger's reasons for considering bankruptcy would most likely fall into two categories. Things that happened to him were beyond his control, so he is using bankruptcy as a financial tool for survival. Kind of like, oh I don't know, people who are laid off and are collecting unemployment to survive... The second category would be poor financial decision making. Which would mean that he brought this upon himself and has no place whatsoever to sit in judgement of us.

On to your suggestions. Please. Start a business? People who are collecting unemployment are just swimming in cash. And those wonderful bankers just can't loan money fast enough, especially to folks like us with our skyrocketing credit scores. Volunteer? Again, some of these people here don't even have enough money for gas to get to these places. Don't even bother with the flip a burger suggestion. And if you have read and understood some of the posts in this forum it's not like you just fill out an application Monday and are knee dip in french fries on Tuesday. Feel free to educate yourself on the real unemployment numbers and the fact that employers are sitting on loads of cash and not hiring.

MSBankruptcylawer (if I remember the name right) was at least sympathetic to our plight. One thing he touched was the downward standard of living that we are at the front of. He is so right. And it isn't the long term unemployed that should be worried. It's you employed folk sitting in judgement that should be worried. Employers know that the job market is tight, so I wouldn't be holding my breath for consistent raises if I was you. Also, at some point, I might take your advice and volunteer.
At the company you work for, doing your job. Then I can start undercutting your salary by offering to do your job for less money. At this point you can take less money, or, unemployment. But you can only collect for 26 weeks. Lest you have a large gap in your resume and your skills begin to atrophy. Of course you can always start a business, or volunteer, or flip burgers.

This scenario that I have outlined above is what happens when capitalism moves from merely a type of economy to a type of psychology. If nothing else, this last 14 months has been an eye opener for me as to just how crappy and judgemental some people can be. They toss out republican talking points without taking time to research the depth of the problem. People are too stupid or myopic to realize that banding together and holding employers accountable would give us all a chance to at least maintain our middle class standing. Instead, it's easier to sit in judgement of somebody who lost their job. No problem though. We are at the front economic slide, and, now that I know how my "fellow americans" feel about us, I will be only too happy to drag them down with me.

Wow houston7, you have a lot of anger. I am not sure just why it is directed at me though, as opposed to "society" in general. Your above post (rant) simply doesn't make any sense. Whatever you may hate about capitalism, it can never be a "type of psychology". I agree that it is debatable whether the US is a purely capitalistic economy, but if the US was more capitalistic there would be less unemployment insurance and other government entitlements, not more. Government entitlements, right or wrong, are more a product of a socialist economy, not a capitalist one. A capitalist economy would rely purely on market forces to provide jobs and living money to workers.

I agree that "crap" happens to people. Short term unemployment insurance can help get through that "crap". I am not even against longer term unemployment insurance, but I do think that the longer one is unemployed, the less marketable one becomes to hiring companies. I know that all the companies that I have worked for, would not even consider interviewing a candidate that was unemployed 99 weeks. I am a highly paid professional, and maybe in entry level jobs that is not the case, but it is simply a fact that employers look unfavorably on long bouts of unemployment and it is also a fact that if an employer has to choose between two candidates with equal qualifications, they are going to choose the candidate that is currently employed somewhere else, or is just recently unemployed.

I agree that American's standard of living is slipping and that we are losing our middle class. But I do not agree that extended unemployment is going to stop that slide. I am simply being a pragmatist. I am not against extended unemployment per se, I just do not think that congress will pass legislation that would allow a person to collect unemployment insurance for over 99 weeks. I do not even think the current extensions are going to be extended indefinitely. At some point soon, we will be back to 26 weeks of unemployment insurance.

Forcing employers to hire a person they do not feel is marketable for whatever reason, will not work. Sooner rather than later, the employer will either go to where the hiring climate is more sane, taking even more jobs with them, or they will get rid of the person they were forced to hire under some other technicality or loophole. I am not sure how "banding together" will force companies to hire long term unemployed workers who are no longer marketable.

[tobee43]

houston7......excellent and the most "true" to life response yet. extremely well spoken,, or written.



it's so easy, as i have stated looking from in inside out.....

This scenario that I have outlined above is what happens when capitalism moves from merely a type of economy to a type of psychology.

remember the movie the postman??............well now the few that have been able to slip by this economic down far unskeath....well...i too, am extemely happy for them....congrats to you...hats off.....(our next judgmental leaders....LOL!!!). however, no one has the right to judge anyone or kick someone while they are down....because they re-educated themselves and were lucky enough to find another position.....or went back to school, borrowed money because they had or have someone to help them get back on their feet to start a business.

there are many of us alone out here in these un- chartered waters just bobbing our heads above water.....scared and looking for even something as simple as a life boat to latch on to. why? to maintain just the slightest bit of dignity......apparently, some of us are hummeled by nothing....and those that are not, love nothing better than throwing dirt in ones' eyes....it's a sad sad world it is.



personally, for me i have 3 degrees...and so what.......??? i can do anything from flip burgers to do taxes to work for any type of atty and have billable hours.....there simply are NO jobs....what???? does someone think they just fall out of the sky??



we joked ...a bit about selling on ebay...but that's not enough to pay for rent. we are, however, attempting to get a business together just based on what we know...although, who the heck has the money to hire us...we are thinking, but since it's NOT going to cost us anything ...other than a few atty's visits we are going to try it. in the meantime, i have been finding local work by going over HOA's bi-laws...redoing them...and getting paid terribly, but it's something. more law firms have closed around here than ever, as well as other places, like in san fran, where i'm from, some of the MAJOR firms...closed.



let's see now...should i go get yet ANOTHER degree??? i think not...that answer is job creation and if the government can bale everyone else out, what about use lowly people..??? scary scary....

[OhioFiler]

trolls on every board... sad but true....

sure isn't helpful to those that need sound advise or just a chance to share and vent...

hopefully one of the mods will start taking notice...i hope...i hope...

Coming from the ONE poster who comments 50 times on every thread on the bkforum this is hilarious.

[OhioFiler]

I think encouraging you to look for an alternate source of income is helpful.

I disagree that one has to live a certain experience to appreciate it or be able to sympathize with others who have experienced a specific event. To use your example of military wives, I would feel horrible pain for a widowed women whose husband was killed in the war yet I've never dealt with such an event directly.

[houston7]

Wow houston7, you have a lot of anger. I am not sure just why it is directed at me though, as opposed to "society" in general. Your above post (rant) simply doesn't make any sense. Whatever you may hate about capitalism, it can never be a "type of psychology". I agree that it is debatable whether the US is a purely capitalistic economy, but if the US was more capitalistic there would be less unemployment insurance and other government entitlements, not more. Government entitlements, right or wrong, are more a product of a socialist economy, not a capitalist one. A capitalist economy would rely purely on market forces to provide jobs and living money to workers.

I agree that "crap" happens to people. Short term unemployment insurance can help get through that "crap". I am not even against longer term unemployment insurance, but I do think that the longer one is unemployed, the less marketable one becomes to hiring companies. I know that all the companies that I have worked for, would not even consider interviewing a candidate that was unemployed 99 weeks. I am a highly paid professional, and maybe in entry level jobs that is not the case, but it is simply a fact that employers look unfavorably on long bouts of unemployment and it is also a fact that if an employer has to choose between two candidates with equal qualifications, they are going to choose the candidate that is currently employed somewhere else, or is just recently unemployed.

I agree that American's standard of living is slipping and that we are losing our middle class. But I do not agree that extended unemployment is going to stop that slide. I am simply being a pragmatist. I am not against extended unemployment per se, I just do not think that congress will pass legislation that would allow a person to collect unemployment insurance for over 99 weeks. I do not even think the current extensions are going to be extended indefinitely. At some point soon, we will be back to 26 weeks of unemployment insurance.

Forcing employers to hire a person they do not feel is marketable for whatever reason, will not work. Sooner rather than later, the employer will either go to where the hiring climate is more sane, taking even more jobs with them, or they will get rid of the person they were forced to hire under some other technicality or loophole. I am not sure how "banding together" will force companies to hire long term unemployed workers who are no longer marketable.

Wow. Speaking of a post that doesn't make any sense. Can you at least make a stand on unemployment, senator?

The main point of my post, that you were unable to understand, but it appears that other posters were, is that the capitalism that you people so fiercely defend is going to come back to bite you in the ass. There are roughly 15 million unemployed people in the US. What do you think these people are going to do as their benefits run out during this year? You may as well save your advice about volunteering or starting a business. And if you think that these people are going to go quietly into the night you are sadly mistaken. A percentage of these people will turn to crime. All of your suggestions and judgement won't mean butt stank when the gun is pointed at you. Others will follow what I have outlined. And if you think for one second that an employer will refuse to hire and train somebody who is willing to work for minimum wage, because they have been unemployed for a long time, you are sadly mistaken. For reference, check out what people have posted in this forum.
They won't have to worry about people jumping to higher paying jobs because there won't be any. We will all be bidding against each other in a race to the bottom.

[houston7]

I think encouraging you to look for an alternate source of income is helpful.

I disagree that one has to live a certain experience to appreciate it or be able to sympathize with others who have experienced a specific event. To use your example of military wives, I would feel horrible pain for a widowed women whose husband was killed in the war yet I've never dealt with such an event directly.

Good. So I assume your going to follow your own advice and do that instead of filing bankruptcy?

[OhioFiler]

Answer the question you dodger.

You are throwing out your opinion that long term unemployment is welfare. You are stating that they should seek other sources of income instead of collecting unemployment. I am pointing out the fact that you, who is considering filing bankruptcy, instead of taking YOUR OWN ADVISE, and seeking other sources of income, are sitting in judgement of other people. As such, if you express your opinion on those of us on unemployment, we will express our opinion of you.

You see, my reason for filing bankruptcy is due to a job loss. Now you, who, according to your posts are still employed, are considering filing bankruptcy. Why? Why don't you follow your own advise and seek other forms of income? You do realize that you look WORSE than those of us who are unemployed because you have a job and considering bankruptcy.

Unless of course there is a backstory you would like to share with the rest of the class.

I don't get your line of thinking at all. I'm done with you with your name calling. Good luck to you.

[OhioFiler]

Wow. Speaking of a post that doesn't make any sense. Can you at least make a stand on unemployment, senator?

The main point of my post, that you were unable to understand, but it appears that other posters were, is that the capitalism that you people so fiercely defend is going to come back to bite you in the ass. There are roughly 15 million unemployed people in the US. What do you think these people are going to do as their benefits run out during this year? You may as well save your advice about volunteering or starting a business. And if you think that these people are going to go quietly into the night you are sadly mistaken. A percentage of these people will turn to crime. All of your suggestions and judgement won't mean butt stank when the gun is pointed at you. Others will follow what I have outlined. And if you think for one second that an employer will refuse to hire and train somebody who is willing to work for minimum wage, because they have been unemployed for a long time, you are sadly mistaken. For reference, check out what people have posted in this forum.
They won't have to worry about people jumping to higher paying jobs because there won't be any. We will all be bidding against each other in a race to the bottom.

So, you have the audacity to KNOW that some people will turn to armed robbery because they are no longer receiving unemployment benefits? WOW! What makes you know that people who have always had a strong moral compass will suddenly turn to serious crime because the evil republicans ended their welfare payments? Are you contemplating a career in armed robbery yourself?

Why would you state to a woman on these boards that she should expect to find a gun in her face once the extended unemployment welfare payments are ended? Seems like a bit of intimidation highlighting weak debate skills.

What makes you think backtoschool failed to understand your post? I am 100% positive she understood your post, main point and any other you may have hoped you conveyed. Perhaps, you assume anyone who fails to agree with you is somehow incapable of understanding your brilliance. That is faulty thinking.

Yes, I previously posted I was done with you. I felt I should defend my friend here. Now, I am done with you and your anger. Best of luck with your job search.

[houston7]

So, you have the audacity to KNOW that some people will turn to armed robbery because they are no longer receiving unemployment benefits? WOW! What makes you know that people who have always had a strong moral compass will suddenly turn to serious crime because the evil republicans ended their welfare payments? Are you contemplating a career in armed robbery yourself?

Why would you state to a woman on these boards that she should expect to find a gun in her face once the extended unemployment welfare payments are ended? Seems like a bit of intimidation highlighting weak debate skills.

What makes you think backtoschool failed to understand your post? I am 100% positive she understood your post, main point and any other you may have hoped you conveyed. Perhaps, you assume anyone who fails to agree with you is somehow incapable of understanding your brilliance. That is faulty thinking.

Yes, I previously posted I was done with you. I felt I should defend my friend here. Now, I am done with you and your anger. Best of luck with your job search.

So how many times are you going to be done with me?
I noticed that you never answered the question, either.
Well done, dodger.

[OhioFiler]

Real effect of extending unemployment benefits

[discouraged]

Your going to take one article for proof that you are correct? What a load of c---. Have you ever thought that maybe, just maybe, there are other views? Or - that some of the people who 'quit looking/applying' became so scared that they started investing more time in networking, going to Workforce workshops to better improve their techniqes to GET THAT JOB. All any of us who are unemployed want is a job. At least the majority that I know. Sure, I met them all at the Workforce Center so I have no way of knowing (as you apparently do) just how many unemployed people stopped looking.

Did you once think that maybe, just maybe if there were jobs out there for all of us who are unemployed there would be no need for those surveys? They should have put the money they spent on the surveys into job creation - that is what we need, not some bs from 'experts' telling us we've quit looking.

OR - maybe a lot of folks took that job at Burger King that we all so desperately want.

Until you walk in our shoes you will have no idea how hard it is to find a job in this economy.